Fuzzy Logic

Anyone know what this is? It’s on some appliances (ie washing machinese)… It’s somehting to do with some feature that it has…not a company trying to be “cool” by using English all over the place. What, exactly, is that “feature”?

It’s one of those fad concepts that hits the island regularly, like “EQ” or asparagus juice. Fuzzy logic is used to describe a computer that can make judgements based on the information it gets, even if that information is incomplete, or unclear. Instead of a washing machine that has just high and low settings, a “fuzzy logic” machine would theoretically be able to determine how full your machine is and possibly even the density of the fabric (denim jeans vs. lace panties) and make the appropriate decision in terms of washing speed, rinse cycle, etc. Whether they in fact work like that is doubtful, but that’s what fuzzy logic is supposed to be all about. It’s also the reason why there are still hundreds of thousands of Fuzzy scooters out on the streets. No computer inside, just a name that briefly had cachet.

Is that similar to “ISO 9002”? Do companies throw that around just to make the product sound high quality? I mean it’s some international standard…but to me, as a consumer, it means nothing.

No manufacturers use cheesy terms like that to try to impress dorky customers in the hope that they’ll be bowled over by this “advanced” terminology and will buy their products and ask questions on Internet forums later. :smiling_imp:

ISO is very real. Its an auditing standard. Your company pays ISO to audit the profesionalism of your company. Its creation really matured industry around the world. Stands for International Standards Organization. Most emblems like that that you see on products are standards organizations. Like UL is for things which can be plugged into walls, etc.

Ah, true, but I think the point is that in Taiwan, people put ISO onto the labels of their products or incorporate the term into a marketing scheme to say “Wow, look our product passed a basic standards test,” as if we should be impressed. But really the product should be up to those standards to begin with. It isn’t a selling point at all. It just means that the thing shouldn’t rip, break, fall apart or infect your family with salmonella within the first few weeks of purchase.

I’m not going to go apeshit over something I can plug into a wall because I’m supposed to be able to plug the thing into a damn wall. I’m only going to freak out if it doesn’t.

If Taiwan had had these standards to begin with, people around the world wouldn’t guffaw at the hackneyed punchline of the 1980’s “Made in Taiwan.”

But I guess it was the shoddy work and stupid plastic toys that made Taiwan into one of the “Asian Tigers.”

ISO only tangentially means a product is good.

What ISO do is review a company’s work processes then award certification based on whether the company has set things up so it can produce a product of consistent quality.

So if you liked a particular ISO product before, you should like the same product in the future.
If the product was crap, ISO certification is a warning to expect more of the same.

I can only agree with Jelly. A lot of companies here are still living in the “good old days”, talking of “OEM” all day and ensuring every customer that they are “professional” and have “experience” and of course are “the cheapest”. Oh yes, and now we have “ISO”… (like in “I so, you so, Da Jia so so…”)
Dilbert was right:

  • “You are responsible for our ISO project. We don’t know what it is, but it looks great on brochures.”
  • “I think it means that we are following a consistent procedure.”
  • “That’s us! We always lie on our brochures.”

Or: What’s the difference between ISO9000 and ISO14000? Exactly 5000…

“Fuzzy logic” as sticker on a product has about the same value. Or could it simply mean that the logic is somehow unsure about how to deal with the clothes? That’s why they added a random generator to find a solution. So sometimes your socks get washed at 30 degrees, sometimes at 90. “Fuzzy” could have several interpretations…

Another nice thing is “organic (you ji) food”. Does anyone know of any food that is anorganic?

Anything is ok if it only helps to get rid of the product…

ISO 9001: is a quality assurance model that is basically used by companies that design, produce, inspect, test, install and service items. (For example, a manufacturer that designs and produces furniture.)

ISO 9002: is a quality assurance model that is basically used by companies that produce, inspect, test, install and service items. (For example, a manufacturer that produces but does not design furniture.)

ISO 9003: is a quality asurance model that is basically used by companies that must inspect and test items. (For example, an importer or distributor.)

Taiwanese are under the impression that this ISO is a selling tool… WRONG… it just says that your company has the relevant standards processes in place that comply to the now industry ISO standard. It doesn’t say anything about the actual quality of your product. Simple Quality theory states that quality is designed into something and is not achieved by applying quality procedures. Quality checks serve to eliminate 50% of the bad, there is another 50% going into the field. Also it doesn’t matter if you have ISO, if it ain’t policed properly(as happens so often here) it means nothing

However in the same way the Taiwanese think they are becoming more worldly and in tune with world business by speaking english, they also think ISO is some sort of qualification that allows them to be put up there in the international league.

Not to knock the Taiwanese, but why Taiwan sells so much, is cause it is cheaper than other places. It is getting done cheaper in China now, soon everything will go to China, and in 10 years it will again move to a cheaper place maybe Mongolia.

Chinese business people have to loose some of these things that are engrained in them, and think more like - just cause it is cheaper it isn’t better, and if you screw up in business, you can’t take international cutomers down to the KTV, get them drunk and smooth it all over. It doesn’t work like that.


We live in an analogue world, where there are an infinite variety of colour, maybes descriptions etc. Computers are stupid and live in the digital world where everything is 1 and 0, yes and no, black and white. Therefore when we are trying to use a computer to calculate things that happen in the real world, computers run into problems as they are limited to Boolean decisions, YES and NO.

What fuzzy logic offers is mathematical modelling that can be applied to the real world, that computers can interperate in a digital way. So in a since it is coverting the analogue world by approximation and rounding off to the digital world. Its not an exact science but what is does offer is the ability to predict behaviuors patterns etc, that you could probabily do with a pencil and paper, but that would take a lot longer to do.

See people think computers are smart. They are not. They are limited but have the ability to compute much quicker than people

ISO 900X standard conformance would have some value to someone buying a product. If a company can meet the standard you have some assurance that the company can continue to produce the product despite loss of key people or equipment. That is the point, it does not say the product is good or bad, that is for the buyer to decide – but it does go a long way to ensure that you will receive the same quality or product one year from now. This is very valid and I applaud Taiwan manufacturers who conform.

“Fuzzy Logic” on the other hand is probably just another example of a technical term being used for marketing purposes. Other recent ones that come to mind are “Object Oriented” or “Web Enabled” (particularly applying to empty computer boxes!). It happens all the time but not much will happen unless the consuming public becomes more critical of loose terminology. People buy even technical products based on emotive criteria, marketeers know that.

An example: Products are described as “Scientifically proven” - in science however, nothing is proven. Science just holds hypotheses we cannot experimentally disprove to be the likely explanation. Einstein’s theory of relativity has not been ‘proven’, it has just not been disproved (yet).

“Fuzzy Logic” is a technical term used for marketing. Obvisouly it works: if you can’t convince your customer - confuse him!

Can anyone tell me what the term FUZZY means in relation to appliances? I have noticed it on many products and as I am currently looking for a new washing machine, the word seems to be popping up all over the place! At first I thought that it might have something to do with fabric ( okay, okay, stupid, I know :blush: ) but then I saw it on a rice cooker and again on a steamer! I have also seen it on a scooter!

If there were no button above it to push, I would assume that it was simply a “promo logo” but… the button?

Any info would be appreciated! :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

it’s a Japanese-English term that means it is user-friendly.

Well I have an orange “Fuzzy” button on one of my a/c remote controls. Doesn’t seem to do anything.


Everyone slagging Taiwanese business practices and the quality of their products should try and do business with the mainland. I sometimes help distributors in North America to find and inspect factories over here. While things might not be to the standard one would like in North America/Europe, the standard and internationalization of Taiwan make doing business here easier.

I consistently hear that the quality of Taiwanese goods is superior to the mainland, and that Taiwanese are better to do business with. The fact is that most factories that have remained in Taiwan know that they can be underpriced in China very easily, thus they have already begun to develp higher quality products. There is also a lot of work with international electronic companies under sub-contracting structures making things such as Playstation 2’s, and cellphones.

Obviously there are still some shoddy factories and products here, but I could also direct you to places you could find the same shite back home. Perhaps you should be directing your shots at ISO and not Taiwanese factories in particular.

I’m not sure what it does on my a/c. When I press it, it stops trying to cool the air and seems to turn into a fan. The remote control is all in Chinese except for a big orange button with “Fuzzy” on it. I was a bit scared of it at first, I have to admit. It’s like the big “Self Destruct” button you get in old films.

Writing taiwanese = fuzzy logix


Fuzzy logic? Woolly thinking.

They’re good at that here.

I got a massage and a free drink at TGI Friday’s a few days ago. They’re good at that too.


All that cuteness, and other than Blueface, nobody’s actually made even the slightest attempt to answer the question that was asked.

“Fuzzy logic” in the context of appliances means that the appliances have logic circuits in them that, for example, try to save energy by not running at full capacity at all times. A gas furnace that uses fuzzy logic could, for example, run continuously at 45% gas flow so that the house stays near the set temperature at all times, instead of burning at 100% flow for five minutes, then shutting off and letting the house cool down for five minutes, which would burn 10% more fuel overall.

Whether the a/c works as intended or not is another matter, and whether some marketer just slapped the label on the dryer without having the foggiest idea of what it meant is yet another. But the above is the sort of thing that fuzzy logic is supposed to be about.