Global Warming VI

[bz]

@FairComment

It’s the utilization of the BIT to convey the message,

Okay, that helps, I think - could you post some examples?

[FairComment]

@FairComment

It’s the utilization of the BIT to convey the message,

@bz

could you post some examples?

Of what? That the govt and media are indeed engaging the BIT to shape climate change messaging? See above links.

[urodacus]

@FairComment

Another reporter sprung;

Yeah, but: “the Daily Mail”? Really? Is that your best swing?

I did read the findings of the ECU, and he’s not exactly guilty of lying, just poor emphasis.

anyway, let’s not allow this thread in the Science and Nature subforum to degenerate into one that belongs in the Politics forum.

[bz]

@urodacus

let’s not allow this thread in the Science and Nature subforum to degenerate into one that belongs in the Politics forum.

I flagged some as Off Topic, then noticed you’re the moderator!

Perhaps that thread can be split off to some existing Climate Politics topic? (And misc like my own right here deleted?)

[FairComment]

@urodacus

Yeah, but: “the Daily Mail”? Really? Is that your best swing?

If you have an issue with the veracity of the article, please direct your response to that, rather than making it personal. This was also in the Daily Mail. A load of crap?

@urodacus

Science and Nature subforum to degenerate into one that belongs in the Politics forum.

It certainly appears that (if the past few years are any indication) that what constitutes “science and nature” is clearly very definitely influenced by the politics of the day.

The media and govt engaging the BIT to direct climate change messaging is evidence of the politicization and “degeneration” of the climate science-based discussion itself. Acknowledging that said messages are tainted with the nudge unit filter is probably healthy, scientifically-speaking. Would probably also make for a more “science”-based discussion on global warming.

If my comments are unsuitable for the thread, they can be moved/ temped/ deleted, I guess. I’m unaware of the specific rules for discussions in the “Global Warming VI” thread.

[fonserbc]

Founded in 2010, the Behavioural Insights Team has grown from a seven-person unit at the heart of the UK government to a global social purpose company of over 200 professionals across many offices around the world.

BIT being a messaging company founded in 2010 sounds really off-topic with a discussion about global warming itself. You could start your own thread about how you don’t like BIT, because they also do messaging about other non “reduce/revert global-warming”, like literally they have an article talking about how gambling companies should change to “reduce harm”(?!), literally working for gambling companies. It is just a messaging company working for clients’s money after all.

[FairComment]

@fonserbc

how you don’t like BIT, because they also do messaging about other non “reduce/revert global-warming”,

Not only false, but also not my point.

@fonserbc

It is just a messaging company working for clients’s money after all.

To characterize BIT as merely a ‘messaging company’ is quite the stretch. It was originally set up in 2010 within the UK Cabinet Office to apply nudge theory within British government. More on BIT.

The BIT are directly involved in shaping govt and media messaging about climate science. If one doesn’t think that is cause for any concern, particularly considering their unscientific covid messaging, then that’s their prerogative.

[humpty]

It is interesting how the notion of ‘freedom’ appealed to is one of ‘free to do what I wish without any restraint’, when it applies to some segments of the population. Unqualified freedom only applies to the individual in the proverbial wilderness.

Once you have society (organised or not) that unqualified notion has no place amongst grownups. Particularly when one’s freedom foists straitened circustance upon others. Economists sanitise these effects by calling them ‘externalities’. This is the bedrock upon which a lot of denialism is built. unfortunately there comes a tipping point at which ‘externalities’ cease to be, and become applicable to everyone. Hope there is still time to avert that.

[cake]

@urodacus

I’d rather have the liberties of breathable air and sufficient food and so on, than the liberty of choosing to burn coal in power stations over windfarms. But that’s just me.

Regarding coal, there is already ‘clean coal’ apparently. If it works, it is not wanted.
Windfarms are a paradox.

Here is an interesting debate with an expert on coal and an environmentalist.
This segment on coal and the steel industry.

Great Energy Transport Climate Debate: Green Party XR Shane Collins v. Dave Douglass NUM Coal Miner

On clean coal:

Great Energy Transport Climate Debate: Green Party XR Shane Collins v. Dave Douglass NUM Coal Miner

And this presentation at a local council that wants to introduce a ‘15-minute city’ spells out how their solution is not a solution:

Residents vs Colchester City Council 21st March 2023

@urodacus

Well, the science is fairly clear that climate change is happening, about as badly as predicted by the majority of scientists for at least 30 years, and that there are things we can do to mitigate it, but are choosing not to for reasons both political and financial, as well as outright selfishness (although these are basically the same as political and financial reasons).

Settled Science again.
Over 50 years, actually. Their modelling has changed over the years.
It used to be called ‘global warming’ before that mass flooding and before that an upcoming ice age.

Don’t worry, the corporates have the answer (nothing else is on the table as the ‘science is settled’), and (the climate industry) will make them ‘quadrillions’ as BlackRock CEO, Larry Fink said recently.
All this to bring in a new financial system.

[cake]

@fonserbc

It is just a messaging company working for clients’s money after all.

Who are the clients?
I bet if you trace them, you will find they are linked to BlackRock, Vanguard and State Street.
BIT has been transported out of the UK.

I bet these have links to various foundations and coporates that fully support Sustainable Development and ESGs

Here the Professor is working on decarbonization or human caused ‘climate change’; which I believe is another corporate scheme to extract money and forward the cashless digital concentration camps and a CCP social credit system on steroids.

They don’t care about the environment. If they did, their ‘solution’ would be thrown out.

[alex-2820]

Here the Professor is working on decarbonization or human caused ‘climate change’; which I believe is another corporate scheme to extract money and forward the cashless digital concentration camps and a CCP social credit system on steroids.

It’s not an either-or.
Climate change is happening, it’s science, and these people will try and profit from it in whichever way they can.

On the other side of the lobbying coin you have big oil and OPEC. We’re between a rock and a hard place.

[cake]

@alex-2820

It’s not an either-or.
Climate change is happening, it’s science, and these people will try and profit from it in whichever way they can.

On the other side of the lobbying coin you have big oil and OPEC. We’re between a rock and a hard place.

Climate change has been happening since the year dot, or whatever happened back then.
Whether it is caused by human carbon emissions is the question. I don’t agree with the scientists’ conclusions that claim it is caused by humans and the scientists whose models in the early 1970s said there would be an ice age by 2000, then in the 80s, mass flooding by 1989, and by 2030 the end of the times. There are scientists that reach other conclusions that are not promoted by nudge units or legacy media. Patrick Moore who founded Greenpeace springs to mind.
Even if CC was what they claim and all conclusions point to ending meat consumption, cows farting, rewilding farmland and moving to the impossible task of making even one country solely an EV paradise, to save the planet, their solution is flawed. They probably know that and don’t care.
‘These people’ are the ‘other side’. They are also heavily involved in the oil industry and other energy industries that, if are shut off, will cause a shit-storm like no other.
But they have all the solutions, we have to trust them like we did over the last 3.5 years, because they got it right (for themselves).

[urodacus]

Well, I think you’re totally wrong in denying the role that humans have had in this mess we find ourselves in (and the vanishingly small number of ‘hero alternative’ opinion scientists you laud). That climate change thing (changing the name does not mean that the scenario has changed) is not a natural process, but it is a natural consequence of taking carbon out of the earth and sticking it into the atmosphere. That much is physics and chemistry, and saying it isn’t happening is pure ostrich head-in-sand-edness.

However, I do see some truth at the center of many of the points you make about peoples’ response to the situation. It’s not too hard to understand that there will always be business interests that stand to benefit whichever way the winds turn. That is a sad reality. I’m not sure I’d put it down to conspiracy theories about people wanting to steal your freedoms, etc. Yes, some businesses will die and others will grow. it’s not business as usual, but it is business nonetheless.

[MikeN1]

Knew this thread would be flooded by covid-denying anti-vaxxers proving it’s all a big plot by the lizard people (the real force behind the WTF) to make us all eat bugs

[TT]

@MikeN1

a big plot by the lizard people

Cold blooded, interesting

[bz]

@TT

@MikeN1

a big plot by the lizard people

Cold blooded, interesting

I think you might be onto something there!

Putin’s pretty happy about it, and he’s as cold-blooded as they come!

Proof of the plot!

[cake]

@MikeN1

Knew this thread would be flooded by covid-denying anti-vaxxers proving it’s all a big plot by the lizard people (the real force behind the WTF) to make us all eat bugs

That reads like a corporate fascist template shared by useful idiots on social media.

[TT]

@bz

I think you might be onto something there!

Putin’s pretty happy about it, and he’s as cold-blooded as they come!

Proof of the plot!

No surprise that the same useful idiots smear his lies all over the interwebs

[cake]

@TT

No surprise that the same useful idiots smear his lies all over the interwebs

Yes, like 6 or was it 7 helicopters were blown out of the Russian sky with no video footage existing.

[TT]

@cake

Yes, like 6 or was it 7 helicopters were blown out of the Russian sky with no video footage existing

I didn’t post about that at all, and this is a global warming thread. Nice try, though