I occasionally see some very clean, slightly modified Hartford brand motorcycles.
Whats the story on these?
Are they all 125cc?
What about quality and dependability?
Some of these have been fitted out with nice rims, better seats. bigger tires, etc. Look pretty clean compared to the usual bikes I see.
Just asking - Thanks.
[quote=“TainanCowboy”]I occasionally see some very clean, slightly modified Hartford brand motorcycles.
Whats the story on these?
Are they all 125cc?
What about quality and dependability?
Some of these have been fitted out with nice rims, better seats. bigger tires, etc. Look pretty clean compared to the usual bikes I see.
Just asking - Thanks.[/quote]Hartford do two styles of bike – the road machines and the dual purpose/offroad ones. They’re mostly 150s though there is a larger-engined offroad bike – 200cc IIRC. The motorbike section of the Hartford website is quite informative but seems to be down at the moment.
As you say, they’re nice-looking bikes, and a real bargain on paper. I believe that the engine is similar to most of the other 125/150 motorbikes though and is not particularly exciting. A friend in the know suggested steering clear of Hartford for the moment until they have a few more years’ experience in making motorbikes. I think Forumosa member “Satellite TV” has one of the dual-purpose ones and he may have some useful comments to add. A now-banned poster, Popo, had one as well and liked it. He said it felt a bit under-powered. That’s what you get with a four-stroke 150 though.
[quote=“joesax”]A friend in the know suggested steering clear of Hartford for the moment until they have a few more years’ experience in making motorbikes.[/quote]They’ve been around for a while already. I translated the service manuals for that same series of engine in 1998. Most of the parts on those bikes are straight out of the trade catalogs, and are made by the same suppliers that SYM and KYMCO use. That goes for engine parts too. From what I’ve seen they are just as reliable as the big two’s product.
Of course you cannot expect superbike performance from a 150cc four-stroke single designed forty years ago.
[quote=“hsiadogah”]They’ve been around for a while already. I translated the service manuals for that same series of engine in 1998.[/quote]Interesting. How about the 200cc engine? I suppose that’s just a bigger version of the same. It would be nice if they put that in one of the road-only bikes. The dual-purpose VR200 is less than a hundred thousand NT.
No, I just did the 125/150 OHV manuals and that was back in '98. I don’t know anything about the 200cc version. Honda had a very successful 200cc version of their OHC unit in the XR200, also an off-roader. IIRC it’s the biggest bore/stroke available on that platform.
If Hartford has cloned that motor it should be a good one. I know a few people who’ve modified Honda CB125s with the crank, rod and top-end from the XR200. They go very well on a streetbike if geared appropriately. More likely though is that they have just upped the bore and stroke on the OHV 150cc unit to get the extra displacement. Should be okay, but I bet it’s not as good as Honda’s XR200 mill.
I found this. It gives info about Hartford models thru the years.
Hartford motorcycles from 1970 to present day.
Not sure how this applies to Taiwan availability.
Yes, that’s the Hartford range. Never mind about 1970, it’s the site database that goes back that far, not Hartford’s history.
The VX200 engine is a stretched OHV unit, not an XR200 copy. Lower revving, lower compression, less powerful.
Very comprehensive info on the OHC Honda engine here
Yes, I have the off road Hartford. 150cc… It’s underpowered but it does the job for the mountain tracks that I ride on and also good in teh city.
If you’re looking for a bike that will do long hauls it does this well but 80kmh is the most comfortable speed but you can zip along at 100kmh if you need to. Top speed is around 110.
It’s not a sports bike but it’s nice being up high enough to see above the traffic. With long suspension and great brakes.
Shitty roads are not a problem as you don’t get smacked around like the scooter boys.
It’s been very reliable.
I have a SYM and a Hartford.
In all honesty, the SYM is a better performer. The Hatford is esstentialy a Kymco motor. Both are reliable bike with no surprises. But that’s just it. As far as price is concerned it’s not bad as far as my humble opinion is concerned.
I do think the OHC SYMs are a better motor. You can also have the 125 SYMs bored out to 150 without too much trouble from what I understand.
Beercan -
Thanks for adding the SYM bike to this thread.
I see a lot of the SYM bikes. More than the Hartfords.
Are the SYM’s all 125cc?
The SYMs I see do not look as sharp as the Hartfords - wheels, gauges , etc, but there are a heck of a lot more of them.
I would like to see either of them in 250 or 350cc. That would be about the best bike for the island, city riding/country cruising wise IMO.
For me, reliability is a major factor. I am not a street racer.
And I personally prefer a 4-stroke motor.
They’re all made in Taiwan, so you can always be cynical of quality, however, from experience, and seeing alot around Taipei, they’re almost bullet proof.
If you want my advice, don’t bother getting a new one. There’s plenty of 2nd hand SYMs and KYMCOs out there.
Just make sure when you get one, steer clear of the obvious issues, scapes (accidents) oil leaks, smoke (excessive amounts of Blue or black), tyres, brakes, lights etc.
I think you may find the spoke rims are a little more fiddly to maintain, but they’re a softer ride.
Everytime I look at this thread I can’t help but think…
Hartford with NSR two-stroke swap…Could it be done?
MJB -
With a welder and a pipe bender all things are possible.
Thought I’d revive this long dead thread to see if there are more opinions out there on the Hartford’s. I’m looking to pick up a used on/off road bike and the second-hands I’m finding are decent prices.
Specifically for the off-road version, for those who have owned them, how have they held up over time?
Bikes were so terrible they slowly fell apart and rusted away? 
Remembering is far too painful?
So to add a new spin on things…
I found these two on the Hartford website-
hartford-motors.com.tw/hartf … p?id=7#one
Looks like a little 150cc cafe racer style (they call it a 125cc, but the engine displacement is 149cc?)
it’s also on Ruten
goods.ruten.com.tw/item/show?21408202890107
priced at around NT 60,000 looks to be in the same ballpark as a new SYM wolf 125cc.
It’s probably not that practical, and not that well built, but what local bikes are? (also they call it ‘MyDream’, odd name?!?)
The next one is a little more juicy!
hartford-motors.com.tw/hartf … .php?id=22
Yes ladies and gents, thats a 650cc (locally made? not sure, but I’d guess so)
It’s also on Ruten
goods.ruten.com.tw/item/show?21405078148000
Priced at around NT240,000, it ain’t cheap, but then what red plate in Taiwan is? At least it’s not hitting the NT600,000 mark of the last new 650cc I saw here (Triumph speed triple).
I don’t see this selling a lot (much like the SYM T2 - the local boys just buy the T1 and add the cosmetics to make it look like a T2, and SYM priced it out of the market), but I do hope it’s good! I so want for it to be good, a locally made red plate, even if it is a bit overpriced, it’d open the door for SYM, Kymco, Aeon, etc to compete and get the market going here.
The best thing about the Hartford 650 is that SYM and KYMCO may be spurred to compete with a red-plate motorcycle. I would expect about 10hp/100cc from KYMCO, given their top tier scooter mills.