Heading out in August

Work Teaching English in Taiwan
1

I have a couple of questions that are probably answered somewhere on these forums, but if I can get them all answered in one place, I’d be grateful.

Anyway, I’m heading back to Taiwan for the first time in about eight years. I was there as an undergrad in 98-99 and took up one private lesson then that paid 800 NT p/h. At the time I knew that was pretty lucrative, but I’m kind of shocked to find that it still seems to be near the top of the pay scale. Have teaching salaries stagnated? What can one reasonably expect from teaching privates and can you still expect to be offered them just walking around the streets (I got mine in line at 7-11)?

Also, I have a BA from Brown and an MA from Harvard and taught English in the mainland for 3 1/2 years. I don’t state that to brag, but having taught in the mainland for awhile these were facts that came in handy when negoiating pay. Are the same sort of negotiations de rigeuer in Taiwan?

Another question, which I assume has no single answer, is how people distribute their teaching load? When I was in China I taught at one really awful private university two days a week for 4 hours (plus an hour of commuting) because it paid really well and was dependable. I spent the rest of the time working privates that were easier, more fun and around the corner from home. Grand total I worked about 17 hours per week. But it seems that any contract advertised for teaching in Taiwan is for a minimum of 20 hours. Do most people just take one job that sponsors a work visa and stick with that, maybe with a couple of privates on the side or do people in Taiwan just get used to working more hours? And though I hate to ask it, and hope I won’t be involved in the process, how easy is it to back out of contracts if a job doesn’t work out? It seems with work visas one would have to be more careful but I can’t imagine every yearlong contract is honored. And if I show up in mid-to-late August, am I good shape?

Finally, I’m planning to move to Taichung… what would most people throw out as a monthly figure one should plan on making in order to live comfortably without having to teach more than 20 hrs. per week? Is that even possible?

Thanks.

2

I’m not trying to be sarcastic, but, damn -a BA from Brown and an MA from Harvard. Things are sure getting tough in the States these days. Are a lot of your former classmates thinking of coming out here?

3

I should have mentioned that both my degrees are in Asian Studies and that I’m headed over to try and save a little money before starting a PhD. But, actually, lots of people are headed to Asia… but mostly to the mainland. I’m not in with the MBA/law/finance crowd, but all those kids are lining up to learn Chinese now. That’s part of why I’m headed to Taiwan this time rather than the mainland: I’m not looking for a chance to make millions, I’m more interested in the 17th century.

4

Taiwan is crap for making money nowadays. It’s harder to find work, the pay rates are stagnant, and your NT buys much less foreign currency than it used to. It’s still fine if you use your earnings locally, or in cheap areas in Asia, but trying to save money for the States would be hard. Sorry to be so downbeat. It was so much better a decade (and more) ago.

5

Well, if you’re studying 17th common sense, you’re in LUCK!

6

If you want to put away money, you’ll have to be teaching about 40 hours per week. That kind of routine will become exhausting in a few weeks. At least it does for me. On a brighter note, as you probably remember, Taiwan is filled with gorgeous honeys. They will take your mind off of the lower wages and pollution.

7

Yeah, this place doesn’t bring nearly the money that it used to. I was in Taichung in '99 as well. At the time, if I didn’t want to work, I put in 15 hrs/ week and lived cheaply. When I wanted to sock it away, I put in 55 hrs/ week and had no time to spend any of it. It was pretty sweet to look in the bag and pull out a few forgotten about packets of cash: Oh yeah, another NT$12,000, another $8,000, woo-hoo here’s more!

It ain’t like that any longer. Not even close.

8

Wow, I didn’t realize things had become so bad. But how does it work if students are given 30000 NT and average contracts seem to be 60000 that people are walking around broke? Maybe my expectations of saving are pretty low. I’m just hoping to be able to afford to live, save about 300-400 US a month and have enough time to study a few hours a day. My girlfriend is also coming over and she’ll be on her stipend from school (about 1700 US a month) so I’m planning on splitting rent/most costs with her.

Realistically, how much do people spend per month (obviously this varries but surely there is some figure out there that people can agree is average) and what do you consider savings? I know I’m not going to Korea where I might expect to come back with 10000 US, but is it really difficult just to get by?

I’m not freaking out yet, but it is a little disconcerting to hear almost entirely negative feedback. When I was living in Beijing I thought my standard of living was exceptional, do people genuinely feel deprived in Taiwan now? Yikes.

9

No, it’s not hard to “get by” at all.

Working at an average paying job with about 20 hours of teaching a week you should have no problem making $500US on top of your living expenses if you don’t party hard or live somewhere with outrageous rent. But if you live like that you will get bored of life and burn yourself out. You will probably need to blow a little bit of that to make life fun and live more comfortably. (Your first few months here, you will probably just break even because of 2 months rent, deposit, and buying basic necessities).

If you get a good job you can probably clear $1000US a month after taxes and living expenses if you live a fairly Spartan lifestyle. If you live a little, you can still probably save $700 a month.

Honestly, you can make a decent living here. But it really isn’t better than you could do back home with a decent job if you watch your budget.

10

I think you’re getting more of a negative picture than a realistic one. Basically, I would say an average salary here is in the 60-70,000 range, which is about US 2000-2300. Rent here in Taichung will run you about 10-15,000 for 2 people, which would be US 300-450, depending on what you want. Food will be an expense that is decided by what you want to eat. If you want local food, it’s pretty cheap, but if you want western food, you’ll pay for it. I would guess 5,000 NT (US 150). Then there’s going out, travelling, and other random expenses.
On top of your average salary, you can also pick up night work and privates, which for a couple hours a week, can add up to around 5-10,000 per month. In my opinion, it’s not difficult to save 30,000 per month (about US 900). Plus you say you’ll be splitting expenses with your girlfriend, that makes saving money even easier. It actually amazes me that some of my friends say they are broke 10 days before payday. I just don’t get how you can spend that much in such a short amount of time. Anyway, just my 2 cents.

11

DJM409,

You think he can make 60-70k a month working 20 hours per week? And at that, bank 30k. That sounds dillusional to me -especially in Taichung. In order to pull that kind of $, you’d have to be doing the “kindy circuit” and it doesn’t really sound like OrionGalaxy is up for that sort of thing, wanting to substantially

12

No, not that much for 20 hours per week. I was thinking more of a full time job salary, whether that be in kindy, elementary, or high school. But yeah, to make 70k and save 30k a month is not all that difficult. Come on, let’s say your rent’s 8,000 NT(I live by myself and only pay 7,000 for a 2 BR, so that’s a high figure, considering he’s splitting rent), and you spend, oh, let’s say 5,000 NT on food (also a high figure in my opinion), that leaves you with 27,000 NT to blow on whatever- almost 1,000 NT per day. I don’t know about you, but I definitely don’t spend 1,000 NT per day.
Now, I know there are the taxes and insurance that gets taken out of your monthly salary, but overall I think it’s very feasible to save 30k a month.

13

[quote=“orionisastar”]
Also, I have a BA from Brown and an MA from Harvard and taught English in the mainland for 3 1/2 years. I don’t state that to brag, but …Thanks.[/quote]

Everybody comes to Taiwan to make money. Fullstop. I dont buy any other reason.
I maintain that things must be going bad for folks from places like the US, UK and Canada if they come out here. With what they earn here, they may as well get a job back home. :loco:
For South Africans, the money we earn here is miles more than what a (qualified) teacher gets back home. I was a teacher in SA for 6 years, and most Saffies here are not even qualified, so imagine their luck!

14

Thanks for all the feedback. If I come home with any money at all I’ll be in pretty good shape. I’m used to living on ~2000 US per month in Boston which I assume, and pray, is significantly more expensive than Taichung. If it’s not, something is seriously wrong (and something is already seriously wrong with Boston being so expensive).

15

[quote=“TaiwanSaffies”][quote=“orionisastar”]
Also, I have a BA from Brown and an MA from Harvard and taught English in the mainland for 3 1/2 years. I don’t state that to brag, but …Thanks.[/quote]

Everybody comes to Taiwan to make money. Fullstop. I don’t buy any other reason.
I maintain that things must be going bad for folks from places like the US, UK and Canada if they come out here. With what they earn here, they may as well get a job back home. :loco:
For South Africans, the money we earn here is miles more than what a (qualified) teacher gets back home. I was a teacher in SA for 6 years, and most Saffies here are not even qualified, so imagine their luck![/quote]

I am headed out partly for money, but only because I’m taking a year off between my MA and PhD. But if I were only interested in money, I think I’d head to Korea, or, even better, wouldn’t do a PhD. at all. I’d hook with a consulting agency or bank in Shanghai/Beijing/HK, where I’m pretty well connected.

Instead, I liked Taiwan last time I was there and I’m excited to go back, this time relatively fluent in Mandarin and more aware of Taiwanese history and politics. My girlfriend’s family is Taiwanese (though she grew up entirely in the States and is not close to proficient in either Taiwanese or Mandarin… which, my translating for her, will make us a funny team) and she needed a break from being in Boston, so she’s excited to spend some time in her mom’s hometown and meet with relatives she only barely knows. I’m also planning to study, and have heard that pedagogy in Taiwan is a little bit (emphasis on little) better than the mainland, even if that simply boils down to more exposure to traditional characters. And, frankly, I lived in China for roughly four years and was tired of people coming up to me on buses, telling me that they are raising their kids to be fighter pilots, shoot down American planes, and take back Taiwan. I’d like some exposure to the other side. And Taiwan has better museums.

I’m sympathetic to the situation SA teachers are in, and the English-teaching system throughout the world is full of corruption, inequalities, and the like, but I don’t think everyone goes to Taiwan only for the money. Lots of people, surely you agree, go there for the girls (whatever you think of that, there’s not much denying that it’s true) and some, however few, might go because it’s an interesting place (and they are in love with Hou Hsiao-Hsien films).

16

I came home after 8 months in Taichung to get my teaching degree in Ontario, Canada… and now I’m going back. I’m in debt and I don’t expect to save close to enough in Taichung to pay off those debts anytime soon, yet I’m still going, so the “everyone only goes for money” theory is out the window.

Being in Canada, it’s easy to say that I will surely raise my children here. I’d like my child to breathe some clean air when they enter the world. But at this point in life, Taiwan is simply a more stimulating and exciting place to be. Yes, the girls are a wonderful bonus, but that’s not enough of a reason to shift one’s entire life to the other side of the world for a while. If a guy can’t get a decent girl at home, he probably won’t get a very cool one here. Pretty maybe, but not necessarily a “quality” one. Still, that may be enough for some who have no options otherwise. But yeah, the girls are great, but that’s not limited to Taichung or even Taiwan.

I also love teaching. It’s either do it while living at my parents’ place because I can’t afford to live on my own here, or do it in Taiwan while crusing around on a scooter and immersing myself in a completely different culture than the one I’ve spent my life a part of.

If all one is going to do is complain about the things they don’t accept/understand in Taiwan, why even bother living there? The money for full time work (at least 22ish, can’t do 17 these days, sorry to break it to you) is enough to live comfortably and pocket a little, but Taichung is certainly not close to being one of the most lucrative places one can travel to work.

Some people interested in culture and peoples can appreciate the subtle and not so subtle differences of an interesting place like Taiwan, not only redicule them. You sound like one of those, so if you’re ready to work a bit more than you were used to, it’s definitely worth going. With your quals, you’ll surely land a good job.

17

:laughing:

We’re talking about teaching here, so I’ll restrict my response to that field. I would say that a majority of people who come here to teach do not do it for the money. I taught for two years to get me through while I was studying Mandarin. Making NT$65,000 a month is not justification enough to come half way around the world, no way. OK, you have taxes and cost of living to take in to account, but if I had stayed home, my financial situation would still be a whole lot rosier than it is right now. I don’t know about South Africa, but coming here to teach left me with a hole in my CV (resume) and a hole in my pocket. It’s a sad fact that when I moved back to the UK for a year, my two years teaching in Taiwan counted for absolutely nothing as far as employers were concerned (and some were very open in telling me that).

18

I just don’t get most of the posters here. When I left for Taiwan, my education contacts told me to get in touch with them upon my return, and I’d get a teaching job in the public system without any trouble. I still have a couple of standing job offers if I ever choose to return, but I just don’t see any reason to. I was making 80K net every month within 6 months of coming here, and for the last 9 years my salary has rarely been below 100K a month. I live comfortably in Kaohsiung…not extravagantly, but not cheaply either, and I’ve managed to create some pretty healthy investments. Within then next ten years my wife and I should have enough to retire and do all the stuff that people dream of doing. Although my colleagues back in Canada get regular union pay raises, they pay those enormous taxes, union dues, and other payroll deductions that just don’t happen here. Say what you want about statistics and all the other yadda yadda that people keep saying, my financial situation is far better here than it would have been if I had decided to stay teaching in Canada.

19

Hi all,

When do the English schools do most of their hiring? I’ll be arriving and looking for an English teaching job in Taipei in mid or late August. (I believe the school years starts in August, right?) Do you think arriving in late August hinders the job search?

Thanks in advance.

20

[quote=“Groo”]Hi all,

When do the English schools do most of their hiring? I’ll be arriving and looking for an English teaching job in Taipei in mid or late August. (I believe the school years starts in August, right?) Do you think arriving in late August hinders the job search?

Thanks in advance.[/quote]

The school year never ends.