First of all you want to start with the sum of the external angles being 360 degrees which is probably easier to prove and is true for all concave shapes.
Nearly every day you prove that geometry is easier than political philosophy?
Can’t. It is a postulate, not a proof.
My answer IS cryptic isn’t it? 
But I doubt I have ever actually proved that postulate (or have ever tried to).
I’m not an atheist or agnostic, but I’d like to play. I promise not to try and convert you to my own belief system on this thread. 
First off, I’ll say what (outside of religious things) I believe in: I believe in the nobility of the social contract. I believe in science. I believe in the human spirit (not meaning in the sense of ghosts). I believe in the value of charity. I believe in self-accountability.
Second, the discussion here seems to be ignoring the dual nature of the question. Some people are using “believe in” synonymously with “believe”, which doesn’t do the question justice. You can “believe in” Santa Claus referring to his existence, but you can also “believe in” Santa Claus, referring to trust and confidence in him. Believing 2+2=4 is not the same as believing in the eternal nature of mathematics and the ability of mathematics to add value to life and empower people.
Likewise, believing that the theory of evolution explains life on earth is quite different from believing in science itself. Which brings me to my next point-- that some things we think we believe in we really just believe; we believe it because we believe in something else. While self-reflecting it may be good to look at our beliefs and what we believe in, and see which is which.
I won’t comment much more on the theory of evolution for fear of going off-topic, but I think this is a good issue to analyze our beliefs on. Those who say that the theory of evolution has been proven, take a careful view of what you mean by that. Do you believe that it has been shown soundly that the origin of life as we have it now is evolution? What is the basis for this belief? Even when only considering the mechanism of speciation, where does your belief in this come from?
I can be 99.9% sure that it is a case of transferred faith in something else-- namely science. Or in the case of some, a belief that another group is wrong and by default the other position must be right. Now, I’m not arguing the theory of evolution here. Only the basis of belief. I believe in the process of evolution, myself. But why do I believe this? Because I believe in science. I believe that the system we have set up to observe, record, and confirm would prevent errors or deception. I believe it has been recorded that animals have evolved into different species, even though I have done no original research on this myself. I’ve only read a report and I believe it because I believe in science.
So, perhaps we can better focus the question by examining our beliefs to get to what we actually believe in.
I believe that people who talk about science ‘proving’ things need to go back to school.
A social scientist, a physicist and a mathematician are riding in a car. They see out of the left window some black sheep. The social scientist says, “The sheep in this field are black, therefore; sheep are black”. The physicist says, “The sheep located in this field are black; therefore there is the possibility that sheep are black.” and the mathematician says, “The sheep located in this field are black; therefore there is the possibility that sheep in this field are half-black”
I believe that the set of prime numbers is infinitely large.
I believe that if A=B and B=C, then A=C.
I believe that matter exists.
Also, I believe in the theory of evolution because of the overwhelming body of scientific evidence supporting it, the complete lack of any evidence against it, and the fact that it makes sense logically, more sense than any other theory posited.
:bravo:
FREEDOM. hmmm
I had surgery this week. As I was being straped onto the warm operating table I had the deja vu of being lethally injected but couldn’t quite figure out how I was remembering the future. Probably has to do with my brilliant decline of Chaon’s Smith Morrow.
OBLIVION. Thats freedom. We should be given the choice to obtain enough general anethstesia to self terminate.
Why wait for a rainy day? We shoiuld choose to just drop into any hospital and get a free shot as long as we volunteer our selves to the Instant Cadaver Unit. That way our bodies get to be used for new students or for scientific research.
We shoudl choose to go checkin out when we are in a good mood.
This instant oblivion available isnt like passing the time sleeping where you know you’ve woken up with a sense of time passed.
This is the great plunge where you could have been under for 5 minutes, 5 days, or 5 years. Death has no sense of time.
So good it is that I’m going in again next Friday for my next trip.
The answer doesnt lie within your soul cause that’s just a confused chemical imbalance.
No need for false tenderness or silent tears. Was actually pleasent checking in and getting strapped down. There is no fear.
You gotta stop foolin’ around and get with the program.
When it’s over, don’t shed a tear for me
First, why does a topic conccerning your personal opinion lead to other people’s opininions. The query asks for yours. Maybe we all share a desire to say or think what others say or think. It really is strange. Anyway, I used to have a print of a copy of Desidorado on my office wall. I enjoyed the print and thought that I would share. However, I think we all can think of things beyond this poem that we enjoy
The disclaimer concerns a rumor that this poem was originally found under a monastary wall many centuries ago. We know now that that is not the case. However, the poem is as true today as it was then and will be true long after you and I are gone.
Enjoy:
– written by Max Ehrmann in the 1920s –
Not “Found in Old St. Paul’s Church”! – see below
[size=24]
Go placidly amid the noise and the haste,
and remember what peace there may be in silence.
As far as possible, without surrender,
be on good terms with all persons.
Speak your truth quietly and clearly;
and listen to others,
even to the dull and the ignorant;
they too have their story.
Avoid loud and aggressive persons;
they are vexatious to the spirit.
If you compare yourself with others,
you may become vain or bitter,
for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself.
Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans.
Keep interested in your own career, however humble;
it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.
Exercise caution in your business affairs,
for the world is full of trickery.
But let this not blind you to what virtue there is;
many persons strive for high ideals,
and everywhere life is full of heroism.
Be yourself. Especially do not feign affection.
Neither be cynical about love,
for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment,
it is as perennial as the grass.
Take kindly the counsel of the years,
gracefully surrendering the things of youth.
Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune.
But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings.
Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness.
Beyond a wholesome discipline,
be gentle with yourself.
You are a child of the universe
no less than the trees and the stars;
you have a right to be here.
And whether or not it is clear to you,
no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.
Therefore be at peace with God,
whatever you conceive Him to be.
And whatever your labors and aspirations,
in the noisy confusion of life,
keep peace in your soul.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams,
it is still a beautiful world.
Be cheerful. Strive to be happy.[/
size]
Doesn’t that say it all? Especially:
You are a child of the universe
no less than the trees and the stars;
you have a right to be here.
And whether or not it is clear to you,
no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.
Therefore be at peace with God,
whatever you conceive Him to be.
And whatever your labors and aspirations,
in the noisy confusion of life,
keep peace in your soul.
Be at peace my friends and relish the time you have here in Taiwan with your friends. You will soon find yourself back in your home country and wondering who you met here. Nod at the passing foreigners that you see. Help those that need it. Don’t isolate yourself. Be yourself.
Alan
Have no idea what you are on about.
I am in my home country and don’t wonder about who I have met here.
Nodding at passing foriengers is a tiresome habit. Try to do that to Chaon cause neck cramps anyways,
Who is isolated?
Why is that some people always try to introduce into the subject matter god gods and more gods.
Goddammit.
Hey sat;
Read the previous post. You probably disagree but, hey, there are always vexations to me and others. I have obviously hit one or more of yours. Enjoy my friend.
Shit I knew I forgot my reading glasses somewhere.
Enjoy I will 
i love this part:
many persons strive for high ideals,
and everywhere life is full of heroism.
i’m not cynical at all- i know there is good and i love it when i stumble on it- it knocks around my head for a while. this way of looking at the world reminds me of a girl in college i heard speak. she was disabled and had trouble walking. she said she would feel the spirit of jesus when people would want to help her. i tell my children that it doesn’t matter to me if jesus was a supernatural being or not- people with his qualities exist in the world now.
I hope everything went ok Sat TV.
bah. Only if one believes in an afterlife. Oblivion is meaningless, and the word us serves only as a metaphor for a non-conscious state that is thought to exist after death. But doesn’t.
And as a godless heathen, I am ok with that.
Why does one need to beleive in an afterlife to also accpet oblivion?
It can exist as a non concious state before death too!!
I’ll be enjoying some more oblivion and surgery next Friday.
Thanks enigma, that’s a great poem. My dad gave it to me many years ago, when he was trying to straighten out his screwed-up adolescent son and wanted to give me wise advice without it coming from him. Of course I resented it then because it did come from him, but I’ve always thought that’s very well written and sound advice. 
As for the God part of that poem, while I’ve never believed in God and have often resented people’s attempts to foist their God/s on me, that never really bothered me because the poem is clearly not religious, is full of good secular wisdom, and says God, “whatever you conceive Him to be” (ie. God may be just a shorthand way of referring to the sun and moon, destiny, random chance, the scientific world, ones own self, etc).
Finally, almas john speaks out from the back seat, “damn, them’s some fine looking sheep.” 
Mother T wrote
It’s not me. To be honest, black sheep - while very attractive - wouldn’t be my first choice. I used to have a preference for them slim oriental sheep but in the last year I’ve developed a strange reverse fetish for voluptuous blonde sheep. (Note: sure, most sheep are blonde to the untrained eye, but there are in fact many shades of blonde).