Intelligent Design in the US part 2

Politics International Politics
#1

[quote]WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Conservative Christian televangelist Pat Robertson told citizens of a Pennsylvania town that they had rejected God by voting their school board out of office for supporting “intelligent design” and warned them on Thursday not to be surprised if disaster struck.

Robertson, a former Republican presidential candidate and founder of the influential conservative Christian Broadcasting Network and Christian Coalition, has a long record of similar apocalyptic warnings and provocative statements.[/quote]

[quote]“I’d like to say to the good citizens of Dover: if there is a disaster in your area, don’t turn to God, you just rejected Him from your city,” Robertson said on his daily television show broadcast from Virginia, “The 700 Club.”

“And don’t wonder why He hasn’t helped you when problems begin, if they begin. I’m not saying they will, but if they do, just remember, you just voted God out of your city. And if that’s the case, don’t ask for His help because he might not be there,” he said.

The 700 Club claims a daily audience of around one million. It is also broadcast around the world translated into more than 70 languages.

In voting on Tuesday, all eight Dover, Pennsylvania, school board members up for re-election lost their seats after trying to introduce “intelligent design” to high school science students as an alternative to the theory of evolution.[/quote]

Ah Pat Robertson, making friends, influencing people.

#2

There are many in the United States who view a divergence of religion and politics in the United States as problematic, a view shared by many Islamic scholars.

#3

Good for the people who voted out “all eight Dover, Pennsylvania, school board members up for re-election”.

And Pat Robertson can go screw himself.

#4

he he is obviously not an alum of the Dale Carnegie school…

:loco:

anyone else catch the article in the latest Esquire mag? it’s appropriately called “Welcome To Idiot America”. an interesting look at the Int Design cyborgs.

i found the part about the “creation museum” especially enlightening. one lovely area of the museum shows early man herding and saddling the dinosaurs…lol…too f**king funny. apparently Noah took 2 of each dinosaur on the Ark…sheesh. poor suckers are paying $150 to be “charitable” members of this freakshow…

another telling area of the museum shows adam naked…his penis is mysteriously non-existant…hmmmm

the gist of the article is the assault on thinking/educated America. forget about science and reason, go with your gut. if you can come up with an idea that sells, it must have some validity, nevermind that it can’t hold up under scrutiny. if you can hook enough suckers, you’ve won…

what’s next, a coin with the likeness of Bill Bennett emblazoned on it?

#5

It’s folded under I’m sure. Easier to run that way.

“It puts the lotion on its skin or it gets the hose again.” :smiling_imp:

#6

2 Chronicles 15: 2 " the LORD is with you, while ye be with him; and if ye seek him, he will be found of you; but if ye forsake him, he will forsake you."

Hebrews - Chapter 13 v5 “[Let your] conversation [be] without covetousness; [and be] content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.”

Take your pick. Pat’s gone for the Second Chronicles. Incidentally, is he supposed to be a Christian?

#7

An interview here with E. O. Wilson.

#8

thanks for posting that. Wilson also wrote a good article about religion and biology in New Scientist earlier in the month.
newscientist.com/article.ns? … print=true

#9

I demand that if Intelligent Design is taught in schools, that pastafarian and every other half scientific ideals (over 500+) be taught too!

venganza.org/

#10

While I am sure all this superior smirking at religion is amusing, I am going to step in. I believe in evolution but I also believe in creation. Now, I am not picturing some humanized figure there but there is an underlying formula to the universe and when science comes up with an explanation that satisfied me, I may switch but until then I am with Intelligent Design. Not the easily satirized version of our country cousins but something a bit more sophisticated that allows for evolution. Also, it is interesting that many of the most brilliant scientists in the world have remained or become very religious. When faced with what they do not know, cannot explain and will never understand, they are awed into a respect for the incredible universe that we live in. Okay. Big Bang started the universe. What was there before? What was there a billion years before? Even if the universe ends, what will “still” be there? If you go out a billion miles you can go out a billion more then why not 10 billion more or 100 billion more? What is on the other side of the barrier? Etc. So, while it may make you feel “enlightened” and “intelligent” to laugh at these simpletons, remember that the question itself is a serious one and far beyond our understanding. The irony here is that while those in favor of Intelligent Design may come off as unsophisticated rubes, in the end, they may actually have the right answer while the posturing sophisticates (from a different plane) are equally laughable in their cocksure confidence that they have all the answers. How’s that for a thought?

#11

The very reason why all types of theories should be taught or accepted, rather than FORCING people to accept the (Un)intelligent design “theory”.

#12

I am not sure what you are referring to Irishstu, but I will note that creationism has no place in most schools and that evolution is the “theory” that is forced down people’s throats. I think that it is important to understand evolution but I also think that it would be fair to say that science has no answers for many of the questions we have regarding how the universe was created and then… what was there before that? infinity? eternity? all these concepts are things that we simply cannot and may never be able to explain. So, I will take your statement as a refutation of mine, but again, I think it may be amusing to see many of the “intelligent” and “sophisticated” thinkers stumped with these age-old questions. Again, the irony that these rubes may in fact be closer to the truth than these “intellectuals” and “self-styled scientists” would be a delicious one. Again, I am all for science. I am all for evolution within a certain context but I do believe that “science” has become the religion of the West since the Enlightenment but unfortuately it does not contain all the answers either. No reason to discard it, but certainly no “certainty” that it alone holds the winning hand.

#13

OK Fred. I thought my comment was fairly obvious, but whatever. What I am saying is that I would support a range of “possible” theories about how life has come to be, and how it has evolved.

I personally have no problem with religion being mentioned (but do not support limiting this to ONLY Christianity), but what I do not support is some nutter threatening people with the wrath of God for not teaching what HE believes (And I’m pretty sure he would want that to be taught exclusively. Correct me if I’m wong).

#14

Ah but that is one nutter from one side. Do you also have a problem with all the nutters that support “science” and “multiculturalism”? Most are far more whacked than Roberts. Again, the media likes to swoop in and make him the standard bearer of all people from one side of the equation. Has the media ever asked someone like me why he believes in creationism and how evolution can be factored into such a theory? No. They run and pander to the “sophisticate” who want to pride themselves on their sophistication and intellectual abilities and since these are none too solid, it requires finding a buffoon and making him jump through hoops.

So… we come to the age old question: Just what are we going to teach in our schools given the limited time frame involved. This is the question we will have to decide. The multicultis are mad because the Religious Right is energizing its base and taking over former “territories” of this group? But they in fact “conquered” this area during the 1970s. “My heart will not bleed” to see them lose it. I would rather have creationism with these whackos like Roberts than the soulless multiculti crap that we have been force fed since the 1970s if it means getting the spirit of our nation back. If we want to end up like France… with its unassimilated, unFrench, unwilling to become French hordes, then no thank you. And I am quite confident that the “scientific” aspects of “evolution” can be incorporated into such theories and teaching methods without putting a damper on what can and should be learned about biological evolution, which is happening each and every day, each and every moment as we speak.

How is this any worse than the delusion that is being taught currently in our schools? Does “science” have all the answers? Does it even have all the questions? Yet, it has been paraded as being the one and only one true way to gain knowledge. And for certain areas, it does. We cannot have a religious Math, Chemistry, Physics, Astrophysics, Biology, etc. or we would be back in the Dark Ages or we would be Islam BUT let’s not pretend that the religious in our nation do not have a right to point out that no one knows how the universe was created and even if they have theories purporting as to how it came to being, many quite plausible, it does not in fact answer the age-old questions, which form the basis of faith and belief among these religious adherents. And is their faith any more contemptible or laughable than the “faith” that is required to believe in the scientific theories that we have been presented with?

#15

Fred, you’re just backing up what I’m saying, which is that no-one knows for sure, so no-one has the right to force-feed any particular religion.

Faith is faith. You cannot and should not FORCE anyone to believe something, only offer it as one of the alternatives. As far as science goes (including evolutionism) all that is offered is theory based on the best evidence we have managed to gather so far.

And admit it, Fred, Pat Robertson is a nutter, with FAR TOO MUCH power of persuasion in the States.

#16

[quote=“Hondu Grease”]I found the part about the “creation museum” especially enlightening. one lovely area of the museum shows early man herding and saddling the dinosaurs…lol…too f**king funny.

another telling area of the museum shows adam naked…his penis is mysteriously non-existant…hmmmm
[/quote]

What happened was they had adam shagging the dinosaur and decided that was way too provacative so they disengaged him. The penis got left behind in one of the rideable dinosaurs.

#17

WE are being forced to accept multiculturalism in our schools. Why is that just or fair?

You must be from Europe. I hear this all the time from Europeans. This fear and contempt for religious figures like this in the States. Don’t worry about it. Whatever your media is writing about that gives you this impression is probably 90 percent exaggeration. Take it from me. I know.

#18

WE are being forced to accept multiculturalism in our schools. Why is that just or fair?

You must be from Europe. I hear this all the time from Europeans. This fear and contempt for religious figures like this in the States. Don’t worry about it. Whatever your media is writing about that gives you this impression is probably 90 percent exaggeration. Take it from me. I know.[/quote]

Doesn’t this guy believe that dinosaurs are just a few thousand years old?

As for your statement about being “forced” to accept multiculturalism, well… what can I say? If that’s how you feel about it, I’m speechless, frankly.

#19

Ah welll… Do let us know how that multiculturalism works out when the Muslims are burning down your cities in the Midlands. Be sure and tell us how you “reason” with them. In the meantime, you can choose to focus on someone of faith whose views are also somewhat unreasonable in my opinion but what about the moral and ethical standards? that are so non-visible among the materialists of your culture? Hmmm? While it may make you feel smug and superior to denigrate them, what if they think the same about you and the European model of what? what does Europe stand for these days? peace? what kind of peace? peace by virtue of appeasement? peace by virtue of sins of omission by not acting and on a massive scale? I understand where you are coming from but before you sneer at these people (and I am not in agreement with them) understand that there is much that they will find unattractive about your views and lifestyle and morals and quite frankly, I sense that so would I.

#20

OK, I’m going to bow out of this thread now, Fred, as I can see that what I am saying is falling on, let’s not say “deaf” ears, but ears that choose to hear which parts they want.

I also have to say that the views expressed in the above quote are fairly xenophobic, Fred.

Finally, I don’t know why you think I’m from the Midlands :stuck_out_tongue: , but I have grown up in an area plagued by trouble due in part to religious intolerance, and I have absolutely no respect for people with that sort of attitude. It can only lead to misery.

Religious fanatics from ANY religion are bad news, but your ordinary everyday believer has every right to his/her belief system.

Signing out.
Stu