But BJJ and wrestling involve going to the ground. Do that in a street fight Taiwan? Hopefully it will one on one, but I doubt it.
Honestly if there are multiple people and you have no weapons. Running is the best self defense technique. Obviously can’t be avoided always but like I said, striking at least with your hands have a high risk. You hit one guy and break your hands, you’re fucked.
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Some standing grappling being able to control the other guy cutting them with elbows and knees up close if your best bet if you must strike.
In real life, those Kung fu movie scenes of beating multiple guys is not how it works. Unless the guy is just physically so much bigger and stronger built like a tank and can take some hits and hard to tackle to the ground. Skill goes out the window against multiple attackers.
No, I’m still missing the point. If someone regularly practices punching and kicking, albeit in a style you don’t think is the best, then how could they not be better in a fight than another guy who hasn’t done that?
Are you suggesting that Wing Chun training makes people worse fighters than the completely untrained?
Wing chun is very rigid with foot work. No one fights that way so yes I can see a person who thinks using wing chun exclusively is going to save them eat shit from it.
you get the physical benefits of being active is probably the biggest advantage.
It’s very possible. Unless you are in a martial arts competition using that form of martial arts only.
I know nothing about Wing Chun. Well, I’ve learned something but I’m surprised. Wasn’t Bruce Lee a practitioner? He seemed to move alright.
Yes, but he recognized the limitations of wing chun and went on to develop his own martial arts style that incorporates more practical techniques. This idea of throwing out non practical techniques and taking what he found useful from various martial arts has led many to consider him the grandfather of MMA.
Go look at wing chun, they often dig their feet in completely still and not fluid and light. No one fights this way. It’s not good for real fighting.
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its not about what i think is not the best. i just told you what happened in those early ufcs, not sure why you are taking it so personally. hey it would have been cool if the kung fu guys won a few fights in flashy style but it didn’t happen unfortunately.
if kung fu was effective then their kung fu moves would have done the job, and everyone nowadays would be using kung fu in mma instead of bjj. but back in reality, what really happened is untrained punches and kicks did the job better so thats what those guys had to resort to using. you could say it makes them worse fighters, i don’t think its really connected to fighting, i think its more about dance moves and acrobatic stuff. which is cool in itself but i was looking for self defense when i took kung fu classes and thats not what i got out of it.
To elaborate on the last post I did, Wing CHun is still super effective when done properly. Remember the point about it being a conceptual style? That means that most Wing Chun that people see is the specific training methods built around those principles.
All forms of Kung Fu can be said to be about developing attributes, like certain types of power or explosiveness. Wing Chun is about about taking the attributes with a high percentage of success and focusing on them. All that getting in close is useless if you can’t take someone’s head off with a punch at close range.
Ip Ching and some of the other people around today in Hong Kong trained with Bruce Lee, and none of them fight with their feet rooted to the ground. They move lightly and quickly, but you still can’t move them easily.
Bruce Lee essentially took Wing Chun and combined it with fencing footwork to be able to move in and out over bigger distances, because he was sparring with and teaching the closest thing to UFC fighters in his day, karate point fighters. But his quality of movement was Kung Fu, his hands were all Wing Chun and his power generation was Wing Chun too. Those Wing Chun fighters in the early UFC, all respect due, were not very good.
EDIT - Proper Wing Chun just looks like someone getting smashed at high velocity. If people try to take a small part of Wing Chun and show you the training exercises as the actual application, then they probably aren’t that great. But how could they know? It 's a hard skill and it’s usually out of the context and culture it was made in.
EDIT AGAIN - And yes, training a lot of the Wing Chun out there is usually worse than simply going and getting into shape. As is training Wing Chun with no fight experience for say a month vs doing something like boxing for a month.
Why do you think that? I don’t think I’ve ever taken anything personally on here. Perhaps one time when someone suggested I was racist.
For some reason, wing chun schools don’t put much focus on sparring. I think wing chun would be different if people actually sparred with people using various techniques to see if something actually works in real life or not.
as far as I can tell they don’t spar much because they are hobbyists. Also because it’s hard to apply a lot of it with gloves and should be done bareknuckle.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivxUEi42RmM
ok if you still can’t get it maybe its better to just use video evidence. keith hackney, one of the old school legends, as you can see in the backstage video footage he was a kung fu guy doing flashy kung fu moves. in the real fights had to resort to bog standard punches, broken hands and dick punches.
To what degree do you think controlled sparring helps with self-defense? I would say a lot, but there are clear limitations. Do you spar against a guy with a knife? Against 4 guys?
Sparring or fighting experience is vital in my opinion. It’s hard to do it well though, as it’s easy to get into ‘sport mode’, which is a bit different to the street. Key is understanding how they are different.
I do knife stuff but I don’t really teach it. It’s extremely difficult to be able to do much against someone with a knife. In fact it’s way more deadly than most people realise.
We used to do a lot of hard sparring against multiple people but it’s really just for the purpose of understanding the dynamic of it. I’d rather fight 4 people than one guy with a knife who had just little bit of competence with it.
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A lot. Krav Maga does a lot of what you’re describing in real life hand to hand combat skills.
It’s the quickest way to see what is effective and what’s not. Kung fu became too choreographed and too much into flash.
But I do like wing chun. It has many benefits like confidence building, improving mobility and flexibility, and discipline building.
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Bottom line is the argument that being an expert in any martial art makes one worse at self-defense just seems illogical to me.
All credit to the OP for taking this on the chin.
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I always love talking about Martial Arts! If anyone wants to come down to the free classes this week I’d be happy to answer any other questions and to show some real Kung Fu as well as show how to do it yourself.
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who said that? and who actually defined those guys as experts? 5 minutes on youtube will show you how ridiculous some of those martial arts ‘masters’ can be. there are plenty of things that work. thats the whole point in sparring, why would you want to have a fight and you end up doing something that you haven’t even practiced before? thats like some sort of theory based fighting, and thats what is going to happen with kung fu. if you think that sounds like a good idea, then take it up. personally i would rather choose something that is proven to work.