IRS Mess

Folks,

I have just (hopefully) finished cleaning up a small misunderstanding with the IRS. :blush:

My problem started a couple of years ago when this IRS guy came to the Kaohsiung AIT to help out with US citizens tax filing. He looked over my 1040 and said “why are you even filing?” Yeah man, my question exactly. So I blew it off. I should have never listened to that Dilbert. :x

The IRS has been very polite and I do not think I will get hammered too hard. Money…whatever…

I am posting this to let all US citizens know that do not listen to what anybody says otherwise…file your US income taxes. Yeah, I know, all that paperwork just to show you don’t have to pay, but do it anyways. It doesn’t take that long and it will make your life go easy.

DB

how did the trouble arise, db?

Are you telling me a tax collector came all the way to Kaohsiung from the USA to help Americans living in Taiwan fill out their US tax returns ?! That is the most bizarre thing I had heard in a long time.

Oh I can’t wait for HM Inspector of Taxes to arrive in Taipei so that I can laugh my bollix off in his/her face !

What happens to Americans living abroad who don’t submit a tax return ? Do you get detention ? Lines ? Do they come over and take you home again ? I mean what do they do to you ? Will they arrest you at the airport when you return ? Will they have a CIA man pop up in your lu rou fan and put a slug between your eyes ?

Are US citizens not allowed to emigrate ? If you had been living in Taiwan for 30 years would you still have to file a tax return every year ?

they come out every year

you’re supposed to file as an expatriate, there is a $70,000 exemption though, you don’t pay unless you make over that level

unless you work for ibm or something they have no way of knowing what you make

i didn’t file for years with no trouble, curious what happened to db

just filed recently some back returns as i’m doing the green card thing for my wife and you have to have them, haven’t heard any response from the irs (fingers crossed)

if you are still an american citizen you have to file no matter how long you live overseas

My accountant concurs. He always files for me, even if I only earn money in Taiwan.

You are supposed to file, particularly if you have US source income. That is still exempt as you are not a resident of the US, but you do owe Social Security taxes on it (!!) which might even be a good thing if you believe there will be any money left in the system for us when the time comes!

I got nailed a couple of years back, but the only thing they had a problem with (after I’d filed the “supplementary returns” for several years worth) was the Social Security taxes. I think they put a small “penalty” on but I don’t remember what it was – maybe about $150 or $200. Annoying but not fatal. :slight_smile:

I got nailed by selling some mutual funds(not much) and transferring the dosh to a new account.

hexuan----yep the IRS sends Dilberts out to help US citizens with tax questions. Hey, bombs and missles aren’t cheap these days so every little bit counts.

I will probably also take a small hit (of paying money, that is) but nothing too harsh. The main point is, always file no matter what.

Nothing escapes the all-seeing eye of the IRS.

Ironlady,

I just called the the Singapore IRS office and they told me that US source income IS taxable. Not trying to be disagreeable, just letting you know what info I received.

DB

Maybe Ironlady meant exempt up to the $70,000 limit? That’s my understanding.

Interesting to know that about the mutual funds, db.

US citizens and permanent residents should be aware that nearly all income, from whatever source, is taxable under the US federal income tax code. There are some exceptions, such as the US$ 70,000 exemption for income earned abroad. That exemption is to prevent double taxation, as that income is being taxed, in our case, here in Taiwan. Thus, US citizens or PRs need only pay US taxes on the portion in excess of the US$ 70,000 limit.

HOWEVER, all US citizens and PRs are required to file tax returns the to USIRS every year, regardless of the amount of income, earned or otherwise, obtained.

[quote=“tigerman”]
HOWEVER, all US citizens and PRs are required to file tax returns the to USIRS every year, regardless of the amount of income, earned or otherwise, obtained.[/quote]

Or else what happens? I haven’t filed in about 7 or 8 years since I moved to Asia, but I thought because I didn’t make more than US$70,000 per year that it didn’t matter.

So what are they going to do to me?

[quote=“Hobart”][quote=“tigerman”]
HOWEVER, all US citizens and PRs are required to file tax returns the to USIRS every year, regardless of the amount of income, earned or otherwise, obtained.[/quote]

Or else what happens? I haven’t filed in about 7 or 8 years since I moved to Asia, but I thought because I didn’t make more than US$70,000 per year that it didn’t matter.

So what are they going to do to me?[/quote]

I don’t know precisely what happens… but I suppose there may be some fine(s) involved :frowning:

Remember, even if you don’t OWE any taxes due to an income below the exemption amount, you still have to file a report telling the IRS that you don’t owe any taxes for that reason.

Imagine if the IRS just took everyone at their word, anyone could say they don’t have sufficient income to be taxed and that would be that! :wink:

You must file in order to show the IRS that you do not owe.

I wonder how many Taiwanese citizens with dual US citizenship religiously file tax returns to the IRS. I’m glad Australia doesn’t have this barmy policy - I haven’t lived in or been there since 1974 - I’d be looking at a hell of a fine !!!

I have a current problem with the IRS. I always file, but sometimes a few months late. This was never a problem since we never owed anything.

On our 2000 return, we found that we were due a substantial refund since we incurred a lot of unrecoverable business losses and the IRS had withheld taxes from some US sourced income. (Income from anywhere is taxable, but the Foreign Earned Income Exclusion is applied only to income resulting from work performed outside the US.) The IRS reviewed our return and sent us the check. Our return was unusual enough that I am sure someone at the supervisory level okayed it before they cut the check.

We noticed that all IRS correspondence comes directly to our mailbox. Their letters are clearly marked IRS and contain all of the information an identity thief would need. They are sent by regular post, not registered.
After I complained about the security risk, they started sending TWO COPIES of each letter, both with our names and SSN’s.

However, refund checks are sent directly to the AIT in a diplomatic pouch. The AIT opens them. Then, after whatever investigation they do, they send them by regular Taiwan mail to the recipient. I don’t know what they do with the checks, but they held ours for almost two months. (this was clear from their “received” stamp and the local postmark.)

This would have been OK, but the IRS then changed their mind and decided we had made a mistake on our return. They sent us a bill for the full amount of the tax they said we owed for 2000, most of which they were still holding. They assigned someone to the case whose English was not up to the task (mainland Chinese, I think) and it took a long time to get the bill straightened out. Now we still owe the amount of the refund, plus several hundred dollars. Bear in mind that we lost a lot of money in 2000, resulting in very little net income.

They hit us with something called the “Alternative Minimum Tax”. This is, in essence, where the IRS can simply through out their own rules if they think you don’t pay enough taxes. They ignore all deductions and charge a flat rate (28% I think).

Through this whole thing, the IRS has been unresponsive and behaved in a way that could best be described as “predatory”.

They are still charging interest for the time that my check was sitting at the AIT. The money was in THEIR account. My check was at a US government agency that colluded with the IRS to delay its delivery. I did not have the money and could not possibly have had the money, but they are still charging interest for that time. They have ignored multiple requests for an explanation.

Make no mistake, the AIT and IRS are now working more closely together than ever to collect information about Americans in Taiwan, all under the guise of fighting terrorism.

This whole thing has raised some deeper questions for me. What right does the US government have to tax, or even to know about what I do in another country? I have no representative in the US congress, since my voter registration was canceled because I don’t reside anywhere in the US. I do not enjoy the services or facilities of the US government. The highest authority they can cite is is the US supreme court and Taiwan is outside their territorial jurisdiction. I do not recognize any obligation to provide information on my activities in Taiwan (economic or otherwise) to the US government. (But, until now, I have voluntarily done so.) I think my opinion is as valid as the government’s. The only difference is that the government can use deadly force to impose its opinions on people.

After having experienced the IRS’s wrath firsthand, I have decided to support the “fair tax” plan that is currently in congress. Check it out at fairtax.org. It looks like a good solution, especially for those of us who live abroad. Best of all, NO MORE IRS.

Side note:

If you fail to claim the Foreign Earned Income exclusion any year, you can not claim it again for three years. So, be sure to at least file a return. Otherwise, you could miss the exclusion.

“No Taxation Without Representation !” Hmmm. Where have I heard that before ?

So now that I am ready to come clean, what do I do next? How do I go about making up for not filing taxes for the past 7 years (even though I clearly did not make over US$70,000 a year during this time)? Is there some kind of form for law br4eakers like me? Will these free tax consultants be here again this year? Should I dare to show my face there? Will I be immediately thrown in jail?

This page might help:
irs.gov/formspubs/page/0,id=12236,00.html

You should be able to just go to the IRS Web site and download the forms for the appropriate years. In addition to the 1040, you’ll need to fill out a form to claim the foreign earned income exclusion. I think that’s the 2555/2555-EZ, but 'm not sure.

The IRS consultants make an appearance at AIT every year, and I’m pretty sure they aren’t accompanied by the tax police. They really want to get people “back into the system,” so they’re pretty firendly. At least they were when I went 5 years ago.

I was advised by a lawyer experienced in tax preperation–my dad as a matter of fact :slight_smile:–to just file for the current year, and let them ask any questions if they want, which was very unlikely. as you wouldn’t have owed any taxes anyway they are unlikely to get hyper about it.

I was advised by a lawyer experienced in tax preperation–my dad as a matter of fact :slight_smile:–to just file for the current year, and let them ask any questions if they want, which was very unlikely. as you wouldn’t have owed any taxes anyway they are unlikely to get hyper about it.[/quote]

The form is the 2555 or 255ez… the hardest part of the whole form is if you are paid in NT, you have to get the offical IRS exchange rate in order to calculate what you made in US$. Mind you the IRS exchange rate is NEVER IN OUR FAVOR…

I was told by an IRS guy (in a seminar I attended once way way back) to file for the current year, and then file (later) your past returns. Now, granted it was an IRS guy speaking… and I am sure he was trying to convince us to get our clients to comply and file past returns, but he stated that if you owe no$ penalties for failure to file would be minor if at all… not really sure though.

Good Luck!

1 year is a good start. I had to file 3 years’ worth to complete the paperwork for my wife’s immigrant visa application. I haven’t been fined…yet.