I think 90 % of us foreigners have ARCs but are working illegally!
It has now been 8 days since the broker promised to mail me Lisa’s passport, but it still hasn’t come yet, so they obviously didn’t mail it last Wednesday when they said they would. Today (Thursday, April 5) and tomorrow are holidays, so I can’t call the broker until next Monday.
I was afraid this would happen. When Taiwanese people don’t agree to something, they often lie and say they agree, but then they never do it.
I’ll call the broker next Monday and I’ll let everyone at here at the Forum know what the broker tells me. I’m afraid they probably won’t care if I threaten to report them to the CLA because almost every broker in Taiwan confiscates the passports of all their foreign workers, so I doubt the CLA would crack down on just one broker since 99% of the brokers do the same thing. Since it’s so widespread, I’m sure the CLA already knows about this practice, but they don’t care. And since the CLA doesn’t enforce the law, the brokers know they can get away with it.
The Taiwan Mail System is one of the few bureaucracies in Taiwan that is highly efficient. There is no way this has been ‘lost in the mail’.
Please don’t send passports in the mail.
What should Lisa do if it really dissapears in the mail. Better go and pick it up in person - then you are also sure then can not stall too much.
[quote=“X3M”]Please don’t send passports in the mail.
What should Lisa do if it really disappears in the mail. Better go and pick it up in person - then you are also sure they can not stall too much.[/quote]
If they ever do mail it to me, I’m sure they will send it by Registered Mail (gua4 hao4), so it wouldn’t get lost in the mail and it would arrive within 2 or 3 days.
It would be very inconvenient for me to go to the broker’s office to pick up the passport in person because they are in Hualian and I am in northern Jiayi County. There aren’t any flights that go from Jiayi to Hualian (the only flights are to Taipei, Penghu, and Jinmen), and it would take 7 hours each way to get there by train. That’s 14 hours round trip!
When you are the employer, what is the broker doing with her passport?
I called the broker this morning (Monday the 9th). They admitted that they still haven’t mailed Lisa’s passport to me yet, and they said it’s because they first have to get a re-entry permit from the Foreign Affairs Police, and they haven’t had time to do that yet because last Thursday and Friday were holidays. I told them that I can get the re-entry permit myself so they can go ahead and mail the passport to me right away.
Then they said “Well, you don’t really have to do that yourself because we can do it for you. But if you really want to get the re-entry permit yourself, then we’ll mail the passport to you right away.”
I’ll let everyone here know when it comes, if it ever does.
It’s a complicated situation because it’s true that my wife and I are the maid’s employer, but we are hiring the broker to do certain services for us:
Done in the Philippines when the maid was first hired (1½ years ago)
- Advertise for new maids.
- Interview prospective maids.
- Collect a fee (I think Lisa said it was about 100,000 NT) that the maid has to pay the broker in order to be hired.
- Train the maid how to cook, clean, wash clothes, iron, and sew.
- Help her apply for her passport.
- Buy a one-way plane ticket for the maid.
- Give her a ride to the Manila Airport.
Done in Taiwan when the maid arrived here (1½ years ago)
- Pick her up from the airport.
- Take her to the Jiayi County Foreign Affairs Police to apply for her ARC card.
- Take her to a hospital to get a physical exam (which is really just a test for pregnancy, sexually-transmitted diseases, and illegal drugs).
- Drive her to our house.
- Go back to the Foreign Affairs Police two weeks later to pick up her ARC card.
- Apply for her National Health Insurance card as soon as she gets her ARC card.
- Notify my wife and I that they already paid 3000 NT for the ARC fee (because it’s good for three years) and about 1500 NT for the hospital fee. But actually Lisa has to pay those fees, so we had to first pay back the broker and then deduct those fees from Lisa’s first paycheck.
Done during the whole 3 years that she’s in Taiwan
-
Give her a ride to the hospital once every 6 months for the physical exam (to see if she got pregnant or acquired any sexually-transmitted diseases). But the broker doesn’t pay the hospital fee for the physical exam. Instead, the fee is deducted out of Lisa’s salary, and it’s about 1500 NT each time. And unfortunately, National Health Insurance won’t cover any of it.
-
Collect a fee of 5000 NT once every 3 months for a “service charge”. (This is also deducted from Lisa’s salary, and it’s really a rip off because it’s 1/3 of Lisa’s monthly salary! If it’s for the rides to the hospital once every 6 months, then it’s quite a scam because it would cost less than 1/10 as much to just take a taxi to and from the hospital!)
-
Hold Lisa’s passport so that she doesn’t “escape”.
So to answer your question: Yes, my wife and I are Lisa’s employer, but Lisa has to pay the broker 5000 NT once every three months, and the broker gives Lisa a ride to the hospital once every six months.
Since all of the broker’s fees are paid by Lisa, it’s as if the broker is working for Lisa. But it’s very ironic because the broker isn’t working for Lisa at all. Actually, it’s like we hired Lisa, but we are also hiring the broker to do certain services for us. But all the broker’s fees, the hospital fees, and the ARC fees are paid by Lisa, not by the broker, and not by us either.
(By the way, I just changed the word “employer” to “broker” in the title of this thread because I was really talking about the broker. (Actually, my wife and I are the employers.) The title used to be “Is it legal for an employer to hold someone’s passport?”. I changed it to “Is it legal for a broker to hold someone’s passport?”)
It’s heartbreaking that someone is poor enough to have to submit to forced pregnancy/STD tests which she must pay for herself.
Shame on the government for allowing this to go on! Disgusting people, and the brokers too.
Mark
A small suggestion for you, from someone who has been through the same mill.
Do not let the broker bamboozle you with the things they have to do, most of it is pure bull.
When you apply for the very first time, it is generally necessary to go through a broker as you do not have a list of potential employees, but thereafter it is not. Use the maids contacts once her six years are complete etc, it can save them a large amount of money and make them far happier at work. When your current maid finishes her three years, under current regs, she will have to go back to the PI for approx 30 days, but before she goes, do all the paperwork yourself assuming you wish to remploy. It is not difficult, although can be a little time consuming, maybe more so in your case based on geographical location. Once done, you can then send her off, with everything she needs to reapply for her visa once in the PI, even potentially her medical report etc.
To many of the brokers here really rip off these maids, even to the point that most are now charging them the fee costs in the PI based in NT dollars on a one to one ratio, thieving gits.
But you need to make a ton of money … not just being a GM on paper …
This is just outrageous … she has to work almost 7 months to set-off this ridiculous fee …
You don’t believe this … do you?
It wasn’t included in the 100,000 NT$ … ? Talking about ripping off people …
What are we talking about here … a meat market? This is so … no words for that …
Traveller, thanks for the suggestion. Actually, I already knew that it would be legal to hire a maid myself, but when our last maid (an Indonesian girl) finished her 3-year contract (1½ years ago), we didn’t want to re-hire her because she stole my wife’s jewelry and she also stole cash from my wallet. (She didn’t steal anything until the last month, but when we realized that our things were missing, it was only a few weeks before her contract was finished, so it was too late to fire her. We never got our cash back because we didn’t have any proof, but we found my wife’s jewelry in her suitcase.)
Then when our last maid’s contract was finished, we decided to hire a Filipino maid so that she could speak English to our daughter. (Our last maid could speak Chinese, but she couldn’t speak any English at all.)
I knew at the time that I could legally hire a maid myself without going through a broker, but I didn’t have any friends in the Philippines and I didn’t want to take the time to travel to the Philippines, advertise, and interview people.
But you need to make a ton of money … not just being a GM on paper …[/quote]
Actually, you can get a maid if you make at least NT$250,000 per month and have income tax receipts to prove it. Otherwise, there has to be someone handicapped or at least 75 years old living in your house.
This is just outrageous … she has to work almost 7 months to set-off this ridiculous fee …[/quote]
I forgot how much Lisa told me, but I’m pretty sure it was at least the equivalent of NT$100,000 in Philippine Pesos. I’ll ask Lisa today how much she had to pay, and then I’ll convert it from Pesos to NT$ at the current exchange rate and I’ll let everyone here know how much it was.
You don’t believe this … do you?[/quote]
It was like a crash course, like everything in just 8 hours (one day). But one thing that was strange was that they didn’t teach her a single word of Chinese. Well, I don’t mind because her English is fantastic, but I feel sorry for the 99% of Taiwanese people who can’t speak English. It must be impossible for them to communicate with their maids, except using gestures!
It wasn’t included in the 100,000 NT$ … ? Talking about ripping off people. [/quote]
I agree. It is quite a scam. The broker is basically all income and no expenses (except for the rides to the hospital, but that’s a very minimal expense, of course).
I wonder why? It seems a slightly random criterion if she’s paid sod all anyway.
I just asked Lisa how much she had to pay the broker in order for them to hire her. She said it was only 100,000 Philippine Pesos, not 100,000 NT$.
When Lisa came here in July 2005, the exchange rate was NT$1=1.77 Philippine Pesos, so that means the amount she paid to be hired was only NT$56,500, which is much less than I thought it was. Sorry for the mistake.
But that’s still a lot of money compared to her salary. Her salary is only NT$15,800 per month, so it would take her more than 3½ months to make that much money!
She told me that if she couldn’t afford to pay the “hiring fee”, then she could pay it in monthly deductions from her salary, but they would charge 50% interest, so then the total amount is 150,000 pesos, which is NT$84,746 (using the exchange rate of July 2005). In fact, Lisa told me her friend Monica got hired by the same broker by paying the hiring fee in monthly deductions from her salary.
Monica got only NT$8100 per month (which is about half of her salary) for the first 11 months that she was in Taiwan, and only started getting her whole NT$15,800 salary starting the 12th month. But Monica still had to pay the NT$5000 “service charge” once every three months during those 11 months, and she also still had to pay the NT$1500 hospital fee once every six months and the NT$3000 ARC fee when she first arrived. So actually, she hardly saved any money at all during those 11 months.
And I forgot to mention that the “hiring fee” does not cover the price of the one-way plane ticket to Taiwan! The maids have to pay themselves for the price of the plane ticket, but the broker makes the reservations, picks up the ticket from the travel agency, and gives the maids a ride to the airport.
[quote=“Buttercup”]It’s heartbreaking that someone is poor enough to have to submit to forced pregnancy/STD tests which she must pay for herself.
Shame on the government for allowing this to go on! Disgusting people, and the brokers too.[/quote]
The Goverment allowing?, it’s actually a government regulation.
Yes…
Mark,
I’m surprised I’m the first one to tell you this, but you might want to take a closer look at your broker. For one thing, my understanding is that the monthly service charge is illegal. You might want to report this to either CLA (or is it MECO?). Sometimes it is as simple as the worker being very firm with the broker and saying, “I’m not going to pay it, and if you keep taking it from my salary, I’m going to report you.” One guy I knew of in my old neighborhood was afraid of being reported. He went from being a complete ^$%&)*% to the worker to kissing her butt. Other times the employER has to step in and insist on behalf of the employee.
Believe very little of what the broker tells you. These women often sign two sets of papers, the one everyone else sees, and the one that the broker holds them too. For example, that 5000 service fee could be something that the worker agreed to on some other paperwork. He’s already made the 100,000 pesos upfront PLUS the finders fee from you!
I can’t remember if any of the other fees are to be paid by the broker or the employer. In the case of a Nanny there are fees apart from the worker’s salary, so is it the same for a Caregiver for a senior citizen?
About the NT$5000 “service charge” that the broker charges Lisa once every three months (which is deducted from her salary): Thanks braxtonhicks for telling me that it’s illegal, but I don’t think there’s much that I can do about it because Lisa’s broker isn’t the only broker in Taiwan that charges a “service charge” once every month or once every three months. Lisa told me that before she came to Taiwan, she went to interviews with about 7 or 8 agents (the Philippine representatives of the Taiwanese brokers) and they all told her that a service charge would be deducted from her salary during the whole 3 years of her contract.
Most brokers deduct the service charge once a month, but some brokers deduct the charge once every two months or once every three months. Lisa told me that among the 7 or 8 agents that she talked to (each one representing a different Taiwanese broker), the cheapest service charge was NT$1500 per month and the most expensive was NT$3000 per month, but most of them charged NT$1500 to NT$2000 per month. Also, some brokers gradually decrease the service charge during the three years of the contract. For example, some brokers charge NT$1800 per month during the first year, NT$1700 per month during the second year, and NT$1500 per month during the third year.
Lisa told me that she also went to several interviews with agents which hire maids in Hong Kong, Singapore, South Korea, and Japan. She said that Taiwan is the only country in the world which has brokers in the country in which the maid works! For all other countries, the maids are hired directly by their employers. So in all other countries, no “service charges” (also called “broker fees”) are ever deducted from the maid’s salary!
Then I asked Lisa why she chose to come to Taiwan instead of going to another country, since there are no brokers in any other country. She replied that for South Korea and Japan, the salary is much higher than in Taiwan, but the the “hiring fee” is also much higher than for Taiwan, so she couldn’t afford to pay the “hiring fee” to go to South Korea or Japan. (Lisa’s agent charged 100,000 pesos to be hired, which is NT$72,100, according to the current exchange rate).
As for Singapore, the hiring fee is about the same as for Taiwan, but the monthly salary is much lower than the NT$15,800 that she makes in Taiwan. As for Hong Kong, the monthly salary is about the same as in Taiwan, but the hiring fee is about 150,000 pesos compared to only 100,000 pesos for Taiwan. However, in Hong Kong (as in all other countries except Taiwan), no service charges are ever deducted from the salary, so the total income is actually higher than in Taiwan.
Lisa also told me that all of the 7 or 8 agents of the Taiwanese brokers that she interviewed told her that they would confiscate her passport during the whole 3 years of her contract! So apparently, this is common practice in Taiwan. Even though it’s illegal, apparently the CLA doesn’t care that all the brokers are breaking the law in this respect. (Since the practice is so widespread, I’m sure the CLA knows about it.)
And the CLA also doesn’t do anything at all to stop the brokers from deducting the service charges from the maids salary. So it seems like the CLA is a very weak and ineffective part of the Taiwanese government! They apparently don’t care at all about the widespread corruption and fraud which is constantly committed by the brokers. (I haven’t reported Lisa’s broker to the CLA, but I don’t think it would really matter because why would the CLA crack down on only one broker when there are 200 or 300 other brokers doing the same thing?)
Parasites …