Locals refuse to speak the same language as you

Taiwan Living in Taiwan
1

I have noticed something that has been occurring more and more frequently.
The best way to describe what happens, is to just tell the story of the most recent occurrence.

I walk in to 7-Eleven
I grab two Taiwanese sweet teas, and a frozen meal.
I approach the counter, and hand the stuff over.
I say “Hello” in Mandarin (Ni Hao)
He replies “Hello” in ENGLISH
I say “I want the food heated, and I would also like cigarettes” in Mandarin
He replies “Okay” in ENGLISH
He heats the food, and grabs the pack of cigarrettes.
He tells me the total “NT$199” in ENGLISH
I pay him
He gives me my receipt and change and I say “Thank You” in Mandarin
He says “You’re Welcome” in ENGLISH

At this point I assume he is wanting to practice English or something, since he refuses to respond to me in Mandarin.
So, I ask “Do you speak English?” in Mandarin
He looks at me as if he is confused.
I repeat “Do you speak English?” still in mandarin, but this time with the more proper and less local dialect.
He looks at me as if he has no idea what I am saying, and even calls his friend over to listen to me, as if he just can’t figure out what i am saying.
So finally, I say “Do you speak English?” in ENGLISH
He replies “A little bit” in MANDARIN
I said “Hao” and walked out.

So, in case that was confusing, basically, when I speak mandarin, they only reply in English. When i speak English, they only reply in Mandarin.
They can understand everything i say in Mandarin, until i ask if they speak English, then they act like I am making no sense, and they can’t understand me.

I asked my wife about this, and oddly enough she said she has the same issue, with different languages.
She will approach someone and speak Mandarin.
They will reply in Taiwanese.
She then starts speaking Taiwanese.
They reply in Mandarin.

Is there a reason for this? Is there something very simple that I am somehow not noticing or overlooking?

2

Happens all the time. Plenty of threads on it here, here’s some recent ones:

forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtop … &p=1446131
forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtop … &p=1422868
forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtop … &p=1329746

3

I have seen those types of post, about someone speaking English to you even when you clearly are trying to speak Mandarin to them.
I have not seen one about my specific situation, where they just don’t want to speak the same language as you. Example, when i speak mandarin, they speak English. So when i switch to English, they switch to speaking Mandarin. So whatever language I am speaking, is the one they will not speak.

4

In the general scheme of this kind of behavior, it’s not surprising. But this was probably more of a random outlying event. He probably speaks English like that to a couple of foreigners here and there, without issue. Then all of a sudden you’re in his face asking him confusing questions (no offense intended here.) Now you ask him a question in English and put him on the spot, so he reverts to typical modesty by saying “a little” in Mandarin, lest you start trying to discuss atomic theory or Faulkner with him, or something.

Usually, it’ll just be people speaking English to your Mandarin, unless you want to go through that rigmarole again instead of just splitting with your food and smokes :slight_smile:

5

Well, it has happened more than once. Though, that is life.

Fair enough, I guess.

6

My analysis: The guy doesn’t speak much English, but feels obligated to speak English to you as a polite gesture. When he finds himself in over his head, he reverts back to Chinese.

You should choose one language and stick with it throughout the conversation to avoid confusing people who don’t understand what a foreigner is. :2cents:

7

[quote=“biggyweiting”]I have seen those types of post, about someone speaking English to you even when you clearly are trying to speak Mandarin to them.
I have not seen one about my specific situation, where they just don’t want to speak the same language as you. Example, when i speak Mandarin, they speak English. So when i switch to English, they switch to speaking Mandarin. So whatever language I am speaking, is the one they will not speak.[/quote]
That’s why you’re a foreigner. It HAS to be a different language. Otherwise, you and the clerk are of the same ilk. We can’t allow that now, can we? :no-no:

8

[quote=“Hokwongwei”]My analysis: The guy doesn’t speak much English, but feels obligated to speak English to you as a polite gesture. When he finds himself in over his head, he reverts back to Chinese.

You should choose one language and stick with it throughout the conversation to avoid confusing people who don’t understand what a foreigner is. :2cents:[/quote]

The OP did that, but the clerk refused to play ball. Taiwanese can just be real stuck up about languages…

9

[quote=“Incubus”][quote=“biggyweiting”]I have seen those types of post, about someone speaking English to you even when you clearly are trying to speak Mandarin to them.
I have not seen one about my specific situation, where they just don’t want to speak the same language as you. Example, when i speak Mandarin, they speak English. So when i switch to English, they switch to speaking Mandarin. So whatever language I am speaking, is the one they will not speak.[/quote]
That’s why you’re a foreigner. It HAS to be a different language. Otherwise, you and the clerk are of the same ilk. We can’t allow that now, can we? :no-no:[/quote]
EXACTLY! I was just gonna post this.

10

Its never bothered me. I speak what i want to speak to make myself understood. They can reply back in whatever so long as I understand them.

I do think though , as your mando improves there will be less responding in english.

11

That’s true but it’s still retarded behaviour.

12

I like to think my mandarin has improved a lot since being here. For example, I noticed that there was a lot of stuff I used to say and people wouldn’t understand me. Turns out the mainland mandarin and local mandarin in different, so I had to relearn a lot of the local ways of saying things. Kind of sucks actually because all educational material I find on learning mandarin is in “mainland” mandarin.

13

[quote=“biggyweiting”]I have noticed something that has been occurring more and more frequently.
The best way to describe what happens, is to just tell the story of the most recent occurrence.

I walk in to 7-Eleven
I grab two Taiwanese sweet teas, and a frozen meal.
I approach the counter, and hand the stuff over.
I say “Hello” in Mandarin (Ni Hao)
He replies “Hello” in ENGLISH
I say “I want the food heated, and I would also like cigarettes” in Mandarin
He replies “Okay” in ENGLISH
He heats the food, and grabs the pack of cigarrettes.
He tells me the total “NT$199” in ENGLISH
I pay him
He gives me my receipt and change and I say “Thank You” in Mandarin
He says “You’re Welcome” in ENGLISH
[/quote]

This is just basic politeness; he wants to make your life easier. 99% of shopkeepers in Taiwan talk to me in mandarin, so when one does speak English I really appreciate the effort.

To be fair, I’d be confused at this question too. He’s just spoken English to you for the length of a full conversation, then you ask “can you speak English”? Well of course he can, he just showed you, so now he’s confused and thinking you must be asking him something else.

Also there’s the possibility that your Chinese pronunciation or tones are not clear, so once you strayed from the script of an easy customer/clerk conversation (where he could guess what you were trying to say from context), he genuinely couldn’t understand your Chinese.

14

[quote=“aphasiac”][quote=“biggyweiting”]I have noticed something that has been occurring more and more frequently.
The best way to describe what happens, is to just tell the story of the most recent occurrence.

I walk in to 7-Eleven
I grab two Taiwanese sweet teas, and a frozen meal.
I approach the counter, and hand the stuff over.
I say “Hello” in Mandarin (Ni Hao)
He replies “Hello” in ENGLISH
I say “I want the food heated, and I would also like cigarettes” in Mandarin
He replies “Okay” in ENGLISH
He heats the food, and grabs the pack of cigarrettes.
He tells me the total “NT$199” in ENGLISH
I pay him
He gives me my receipt and change and I say “Thank You” in Mandarin
He says “You’re Welcome” in ENGLISH
[/quote]

This is just basic politeness; he wants to make your life easier. 99% of shopkeepers in Taiwan talk to me in Mandarin, so when one does speak English I really appreciate the effort.

To be fair, I’d be confused at this question too. He’s just spoken English to you for the length of a full conversation, then you ask “can you speak English”? Well of course he can, he just showed you, so now he’s confused and thinking you must be asking him something else.

Also there’s the possibility that your Chinese pronunciation or tones are not clear, so once you strayed from the script of an easy customer/clerk conversation (where he could guess what you were trying to say from context), he genuinely couldn’t understand your Chinese.[/quote]

I don’t see how it was confusing. I am in a Mandarin speaking country, so i am speaking Mandarin in the local shop. After he has given me a series of one and two word English responses, I am not sure if he actually speaks English, or if he is looking for an opportunity to practice, so I ask him straight out “Do you speak English?”
I doubt my Mandarin pronunciation was so bad he could not understand it. I am actually frequently told that I have very good pronunciation (with a few exceptions). Considering this, though, I asked him the question “Do you speak English” in two different ways, the more traditional way, and the common local way. He responded the same to both. It is also not “obvious that he speaks English” because he himself said he only speaks a little bit, and he told me this in Mandarin, not English.

15

I went to a beef noodle shop last night where they used to hand me the menu(which is all in Chinese) and get me to tick what I want. This isn’t a problem. The last couple of times they’ve rushed out to get the English speaker to deal with me. I suspect it’s one of the few times He gets to practice his English.

16

If foreigner can’t speak Mandarin, then I use english. However, if he/she can speak Mandarin, then I use Mandarin. It is just that simple.

17

Unfortunately it almost never that simple.

In Taiwan many people want to use their English when why can, whenever they can. They don’t want to hear a foreigner speaking Chinese because it somehow annoys them and reminds them their English should be better and they should practice their English. They somehow take that the fact that a white foreigner speaking Chinese is a challenge to them.

So that’s what they do. It’s not to do with politeness. It’s doing what they want to do.

It’s also not related to their use of Taiwanese or Chinese for instance if somebody speaks Taiwanese they assume you will reply in Taiwanese, not Chinese, if you can speak Taiwanese. They don’t care about politeness in the majority.

Look at the driving behaviour, this country is 100% about me. They are not thinking about you.

18

[quote=“headhonchoII”]Unfortunately it almost never that simple.

In Taiwan many people want to use their English when why can, whenever they can. They don’t want to hear a foreigner speaking Chinese because it somehow annoys them and reminds them their English should be better and they should practice their English. They somehow take that the fact that a white foreigner speaking Chinese is a challenge to them.

So that’s what they do. It’s not to do with politeness. It’s doing what they want to do.

It’s also not related to their use of Taiwanese or Chinese for instance if somebody speaks Taiwanese they assume you will reply in Taiwanese, not Chinese, if you can speak Taiwanese. They don’t care about politeness in the majority.

Look at the driving behaviour, this country is 100% about me. They are not thinking about you.[/quote]

The very fact that you are able to speak Chinese makes you even more of a stranger danger to them. They realize they cannot gossip about you behind their backs, they are suddenly exposed to someone they consider an outsider, no matter how integrated you may be. Hell even naturalization does not protect you from it. Sure the government treats you like a local, but the ROC ID makes you even more of a stranger to many locals: “Why is that foreigner a citizen??”

19

When I first came here my wife had a breakfast shop and I used to help her out, I used to have many Mandarin/English conversations in the shop, if the customers spoke in English all the better for me, sometimes it was quite funny the way the conversation panned out but we used to get there in the end and thats all that mattered. I had one guy who just wanted to speak French even though he knew I was English so I just played along with him and another guy who could speak Spanish but not English so we ended up having a conversation in Chinese/Spanish all good fun at the end of the day.

20

I find that in more corporate places, like tourist centers, mall shops, convenience stores, and fast food joints, the employees will usually try their best to speak English with me, even when I only use Chinese. It used to bug me, but now I just look at it as their taking advantage of a possibly rare situation for them—whether to practice English or simply to do their job as they’ve been trained to do.

The employees at food stalls and small mom-and-pop businesses, however, will usually end up speaking Chinese with me after their initial supply of English has been exhausted.

My best source of Chinese practice, though, doesn’t come from commercial businesses—where quick and efficient communication, no matter how it’s done, is usually paramount—but from the Taiwanese friends I’ve made and do things with. These are the locals that you want to connect with, not just for language practice, but for enriching your life while here. :2cents: