I am going there for brunch tomorrow. I will have a ‘not so big one’. I’m not sure whether I’m supposed to pretend to be a virgin or to try and rape a mermaid.
Finally, a chance to use and dispose of the office mermaid.
Bob
Are you saying I will be more successful with the mermaid shenanigans? Pft.
This guy sure is into demons, abortion, fetuses and spirits. :loco:
Wonder what he would make of a place like Bangkok.
I think he could better serve society by making an in depth report on modern day sex slaves/mail order brides around Asia.
Or maybe next time he can hang out in a locals club staffed with Russian hookers!
Carnegie’s must be pissed about this.
Anyone remember the email going around with the supposed Carnegie’s “Welcome To Taiwan” beer coaster?
I think I still have a pic of it but better not post it here 
Ah, those were the days my friend…lalalalalala
[quote]
Many Western males who frequent Carnegies speak little to no Chinese. Many Taiwanese women who go there prefer to, and indeed often insist on, speaking English, thereby adding to the Western atmosphere. Indeed, the majority of men and women who frequent Carnegies use their English names when speaking with foreigners. This too is part of the dual existence that Carnegies and other Western clubs offer in that Taiwanese people switch back and forth between using Chinese and English names and spoken communication. This usually reaffirms national and ethnic boundaries but it can also subtly undermines them, such as when a Taiwanese woman becomes more comfortable using her English name with her Taiwanese friends or when a Westerner can hold a conversation in Chinese. For the most part, however, Westerners enter Carnegies for a taste of home and Taiwanese go to sample what they perceive to be a Western transnational lifestyle. Many Taiwanese confirm the Westerners’ sense of superiority because in such settings they treat Westerners as markers of modernity and internationalism, and because in meeting Westerners on their own terms Taiwanese people are at a linguistic and cultural disadvantage.[/quote]
Why would the locals be at a disadvantage, when they all speak Chinese anyway, and they’re going to eat and drink? The wait staff is Taiwanese…and might I add, very pleasing to the the eye, both eyes in fact. 
I never had any sense of superiority at Carnegies…not after being dressed down about not making reservations properly, or repeatedly coming back in after I’ve packed up my family and left to…er…pay the bill. Nope. Not at all superior.
It’s funny that perfesser dingaling hits of the same old chords, “loser English teachers.” Perhaps he should have actually tried talking to the foreigners at these places instead of doing his Jane Goodall and covering his head with a leaf and “observing.” What a bunch of psuedo geek backslapping.
Will someone please link this thread to his university website? Let’s get his students involved. 
I tried to read through this, but the stupidity of this guy and his incredible ability to draw conclusions from his rectal area has forced me to give up. This work stinks.
Holes
In
Logic
[quote]
Thus, it is fairly evident that many women at these clubs try to project an image of being “good” to the extent that it is possible as a tactic to maintain the respect of others[/quote]
Maybe they just wanted to get rid of some pathetic foreign loser who is asking them “Come here often?”
[quote=“ab12ra12”]
Carnegie’s must be pissed about this.
Anyone remember the email going around with the supposed Carnegie’s “Welcome to Taiwan” beer coaster?
I think I still have a pic of it but better not post it here [/quote]
Actually, I am at best pretty ambivalent about it. When not regarded as an academic study, it is mildly amusing in parts.
Yes I do remember that WtT episode very clearly. I would be grateful if you didn’t post the pic again, not even for the benefit of Newbies as we didn’t do it and I really, really, really don’t want to have to go through the bullshit associated with it all over again, though I fear someone less considerate may think it’s funny to do so and we end up going off on a tangent. So, thanks in advance. It wasn’t a coaster BTW, it was a deliberately crafted poster designed to cause as much harm as possible, even beyond the confines of this business.
Cheers,
Bob
[quote=“TpeBob”][quote=“ab12ra12”]
Yes I do remember that WtT episode very clearly. I would be grateful if you didn’t post the pic again, Cheers,
Bob[/quote][/quote]
Don’t worry, I won’t.
As I remember though, Taiwanese were totally up in arms over that and then it was pointed out in the paper as a complete scam. Those Taiwanese who passed it onto me then suddenly didn’t want to talk about it.
Anytime something similar comes up in a conversation now, I only need to say, “Remember Carnegie’s?” 
[quote=“Huang Guang Chen”]Now I thought the door charge was supposed to keep the Cannucks and Saffies in the 7-11s scrambling to offer the xiaojies their free gifts. Have standards slipped?
HG[/quote]
Strange, I thought the purpose of the door charge was to keep the Aussies in the sheep pen…
Aiyo! I know NZ s a very insiginificant country but the people do have their own identity, no matter how poor the reputation. And anyway, you won’t be getting a kiwi into Carnegie’s for the simple reason that the only sheep in the place are on the menu.
HG
[quote=“Huang Guang Chen”]Aiyo! I know NZ s a very insiginificant country but the people do have their own identity, no matter how poor the reputation. And anyway, you won’t be getting a kiwi into Carnegie’s for the simple reason that the only sheep in the place are on the menu.
HG[/quote]
Hehehe…good one HG.
On the subject at hand though. Everyone seems to be flaming the author, and as an “academic” work I can kind of understand it. However, if I didn’t know any better I would have thought he had simply cut and pasted from the D&R Forum…
He hasn’t said anything that hasn’t been said (in abundance) on the D&R forum. But when it’s not Forumosans saying it, perhaps that’s where the anger is coming from. 
[quote]When the conversation shifted from such clubs in the abstract to a concrete experience, however, a strong sense of unease ensued.
I went to Carnegies once and I was so scared [by the Western men’s aggressive behavior]! I went there with two Taiwanese female friends one or two years ago—it was my friend’s birthday. But as soon as I walked in I panicked and ran away, I would never go to a place like that alone. (Ms. Li. December 9, 2003)[/quote]
I think Ms. Li falls into the, “It’s my first time. Really. I’m a virgin (with hand cupped over mouth). No, really. I promise. Tee hee. I so scare.”
Unfortunately, this piece has been taken offline. Would any one of you have saved a copy?
Let the past die.
The same author has a documentary out, “Dancing for the Dead”: www.imdb.com/title/tt1865338/
I actually thought it was pretty interesting. I read the earlier piece at one point and thought it was not bad. He was working on some of the contradictions in the club scene and trying to make sense of them. He’s at a fairly big department in the US (I haven’t met him but once met his department chair, I think).
Dating, courtship, and sex are all big themes in anthro, and this was an attempt to deal with a cross-cultural situation. I’d say it was more qualitative than quantitative, but that’s okay. Anthropologists also don’t have to anonymize everything. He should have had this go to an IRB for interviews, probably, but things were also a little looser back then, and it’s possible his Taiwanese affiliation (the university here) didn’t even have an IRB in 200? when he wrote this.
I found his work on popular religion to be really interesting. It’s not perfect, but if you look at his writing one of his themes is that people get really into the big institutional traditions and often ignore the local, rural/urban, popular traditions.