Nanjing Massacre deniers

[XiangGangDuLi]

Did the Nanking Massacre happen

• Yes it did happen.
• Never happened!

Here is an interesting site I found which questions the massacre:

xanga.com/home.aspx?user=the_rightway

The second picture on NanjingMassacre’s xanga is this one:

The caption read “A soldier about to behead a child.” Yes, it does seem like this is the moment before the execution. However, there’s no picture of after the execution. There’s no photograph of the actual head removed or being removed. So, for all we know, this child may still be alive. There’s no evidence proving that this child was killed at all.

Next, look at the “soldier”'s uniform. It’s very unique. It’s short sleeved and there’s a huge bulky belt. I’ve personally never seen a uniform like that before. The Japanese army uniform during 1937 was definitely not short sleeved and was not white as it appears in this photo. Clearly, this is not a Japanese army uniform.

Finally, look at the soldier’s stance. Anyone who knows even a little about swords can tell that no experienced wielder of a sword would stand like this in order to behead someone. When beheading a person, or swinging a sword in any circumstance, the right leg will come forth, whether you’re right-handed or left-handed. You can clearly see in this picture that the soldier’s left foot is in front of the right foot. No Japanese soldier would have done this.

In addition, this picture is not even claimed by the Chinese as a Nanking Massacre picture. This is just a general picture depicting Japanese “cruelty.” Thus, the NanjingMassacre xanga, in using this picture as proof of Nanking Massacre, is using evidence out of context. Therefore, the author of NanjingMassacre xanga uses a dubious picture (most likely staged) that’s not even of the Nanking Massacre according to the Chinese. This piece of evidence receives a whopping -1000 on the my credibility-meter.

A person commented on my last post named SniperWZ. He said that my questioning of the Nanking Massacre is similar to the Holocaust-deniers. However, there are apparent differences between the questioning of the Nanking Massacre and denying the Holocaust. The Holocaust has been proven using primary documents (not photographs) and credible witnesses. There are still buildings with gas chambers and huge furnaces for mass cremations. The Nazis had tons of papers documenting their plans to eradicated the Jews as well as other minority groups. However, there are no Japanese government documents that reflect Japanese desire to eradicate the Chinese or any group whatsoever. There are no papers that show any intent on the part of the Japanese to commit mass murder. Immediately after the fall of Nanking, there were no newspaper articles or reportings of bad play by the Japanese army in Nanking. Documents only start to appear much later, after the events at Nanking. These documents are secondary in credibility to the primary documents which prove peace in Nanking. Denying of the Holocaust is very different from questioning the Nanking Massacre. There is enough hard evidence to substantiate the Holocaust but only vague circumstantial evidence, secondary/tertiary/quartiary evidence, and testimonies based on hearsay without fear of being implicated on perjury to substantiate the Nanking Massacres. The Holocaust didn’t even need to resort to using pictures as evidence; they had enough documents to prove it without them. You can’t use pictures as evidence to prove historical events anyway so I don’t even need to be doing this.

This is the relevant text from the most recent post, please scroll down on his website to find more disgusting posts. Note, the Taidu supporters on the blog comments.

[Mother_Theresa]

Kind of silly starting a poll on this subject. Might as well as ask how many believe the earth is round. Sure there are a scattering of flat-earth advocates around the world, in their tinfoil hats, but the overwhelming majority of people – even here on Forumosa – have more common sense than that.

I note that the critic you refer to is a Japanese denier of Japanese wartime atrocities.

But he does have a point when he refers to Chinese propaganda and lies. It’s my understanding that most authorities put the Nanjing death toll at somewhere between 100,000 to 400,000, but the PRC government claims it is ten times that, only giving credence to claims of wacko japanese conspiracy theorists.

[zeugmite]

There’s no point even responding to people like this. Not after this blatantly false statement

Immediately after the fall of Nanjing, there were no newspaper articles or reportings of bad play by the Japanese army in Nanjing.

Nanjing fell on December 13, 1937. A simple search on the New York Times archive shows

[quote=“NYTimes”]JAPANESE CURBING NANKING EXCESSES; Stern Measures Used by High Command to End Atrocities, Which Are Still Going On
By HALLETT ABEND, Special Cable to THE NEW YORK TIMES… New York Times (1857-Current file). New York, N.Y.: Dec 19, 1937. pg. 37, 1 pgs

Document types: article
Dateline: SHANGHAI, Sunday, Dec. 19.
Section: General
ISSN/ISBN: 03624331
Text Word Count 797
Document URL:

Abstract (Document Summary)
The Japanese Army’s high command has belatedly begun stern disciplinary measures intended speedily to end the chaos of looting, raping and killing that has made the Japanese entry into Nanking a national disgrace.

---

Japanese Atrocities Marked Fall of Nanking After Chinese Command Fled; NANKING INVADERS EXECUTED 20,000 Mass Killings by the Japanese Embraced Civilians–Total of Chinese Dead Was 33,000 THE CONQUERORS RAN WILD Deep-Rooted Hatred Instilled by Barbarities–Burning by Chinese Caused Vast Loss
By F. TILLMAN DURDIN By Air Mail to THE NEW YORK TIMES… New York Times (1857-Current file). New York, N.Y.: Jan 9, 1938. pg. 38, 1 pgs

Document types: article
Dateline: SHANGHAI, Dec. 22.
ISSN/ISBN: 03624331
Text Word Count 5774
Document URL:

Abstract (Document Summary)
SHANGHAI, Dec. 22.–The battle of Nanking will undoubtedly go down in history as one of the most tragic episodes in modern military annals.

---

JAPANESE COLONEL IS NOT DISCIPLINED; Hashimoto, Who Commanded Yangtze Area When Panay Was Sunk, Still in Field HANGCHOW DRIVE PUSHED Foreigners in 2 Cities Warned to Get Out–Terror Reign in Nanking Detailed Ask Foreigners to Leave Terror Reigns in Nanking Civilians Bayonetted National Flags Torn Down Autonomous" Board in Nanking 300 Refugees Quit Hankow Sun Fo to Tour Europe
By HALLETT ABENDWireless to THE NEW YORK TIMES… New York Times (1857-Current file). New York, N.Y.: Dec 24, 1937. pg. 7, 1 pgs

Document types: article
Dateline: SHANGHAI, Friday, Dec. 24.
ISSN/ISBN: 03624331
Text Word Count 1609
Document URL:

Abstract (Document Summary)
Colonel Kingoro Hashimoto has not been recalled. It is learned on the best authority that he is at present actively in the field, leading his troops with batteries of mountain guns in the Japanese advance upon Hangchow, south of Shanghai.

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REIGN OF DISORDER GOES ON IN NANKING; SUGGESTS A MUTINY; Looting and Other Scandalous Behavior of the Japanese Unchecked by Officers
New York Times (1857-Current file). New York, N.Y.: Jan 25, 1938. pg. 1, 2 pgs

Document types: front_page
ISSN/ISBN: 03624331
Text Word Count 1199
Document URL:

Abstract (Document Summary)
Conditions in Nanking under Japanese rule remain lawless and scandalous, according to advices reaching Shanghai yesterday, and foreigners, except diplomats, are still barred from the city.

---

NANKING DISORDER REPORTED WANING; Japanese Say Discipline Is Being Restored in Army by Severe Punishment
By HALLETT ABEND, Special Cable to THE NEW YORK TIMES… New York Times (1857-Current file). New York, N.Y.: Jan 31, 1938. pg. 4, 1 pgs

Document types: article
Dateline: SHANGHAI, Monday, Jan. 31.
ISSN/ISBN: 03624331
Text Word Count 527
Document URL:

Abstract (Document Summary)
Despite continuing reports that looting, raping and disorders are not yet checked in Nanking, the Japanese here say conditions are distinctly improving. Responsible Japanese authorities do not make attempts to gloss over the facts,[/quote]

Note that the news by January, 1938, was heavily filtered by the Japanese occupation regime. The true extent of the massacre was not fully revealed until later.

I think in all cases like this, the denier’s motive is more relevant than what is denied. Is the denier doing this for the sake of accuracy in history? No. The denier is doing this because the denier doesn’t want to believe it.

[Jack_Burton]

[quote=“Mother Theresa”]Kind of silly starting a poll on this subject. Might as well as ask how many believe the earth is round. Sure there are a scattering of flat-earth advocates around the world, in their tinfoil hats, but the overwhelming majority of people – even here on Forumosa – have more common sense than that.

I note that the critic you refer to is a Japanese denier of Japanese wartime atrocities.

But he does have a point when he refers to Chinese propaganda and lies. It’s my understanding that most authorities put the Nanjing death toll at somewhere between 100,000 to 400,000, but the PRC government claims it is ten times that, only giving credence to claims of wacko Japanese conspiracy theorists.[/quote]

MT, for the love of Jeebus, please ignore his posts. Maybe he’ll stop. kinda like this one South Park episode where all the kids ignore Cartman, and he thinks he’s a ghost, but can only communicate with one kid who becomes a medium for him.

Which reminds me of this one time in band camp…

Kinda like this one time in a galaxy far far away…

on a dark and stormy night…

there was a knock at the door…

I turned the corner and…

He said to me…

What in the name of God’s green earth…

Are you out of your friggin mind…

Don’t you know who you’re talking to…

I’ll be damned…

This is not what it looks like…

Don’t move or I’ll shoot…

Ready? One, two, three…

[TainanCowboy]

Oh…that Nanjing massacre…

[Dragonbones]

Nanjing doesn’t exist. Pure communist fiction.

[Mucha_Man]

[quote=“Dragonbones”]Nanjing doesn’t exist. Pure communist fiction.
[/quote]

You are correct, sir. Nanjing was spelled N-a-n-k-i-n-g back then so ipso facto there was no “Nanjing Massacre.”