🆔 New format for ARC/APRC number is not accepted--testing and reporting thread

[slawa]

Here is a link too

街利存回饋 人人3%無上限

[Andrew]

@Andrew

Actually, I wonder now if Richart’s foreigner account might be part of some kind of Discrimination 2.0 scheme for Taiwanese banks. Make a separate product just for foreigners so you can market yourself as being foreigner friendly, but then make it shit and heavily restricted so the foreigners can’t do very much with the account and can’t access the other benefits.

Actually, I just saw this at the bottom of the Richart page:

上述產品、權益及活動僅適用本國自然人(The product, rights, and campaigns mentioned in this website only apply to Taiwanese citizens)

I hadn’t noticed that before. Definitely going to be complaining about this now.

[jimbob132]

Knowing how corporate culture can be, the original Richart foreigner friendly app was probably designed by a new team with an eager Product Manager trying to design a foreigner friendly app, like declaring that you are only a tax resident of Taiwan, only to be later struck down by higher ups once word got out about the incorrect tax declaration and the team dispersed into different parts of the company.

[jimbob132]

I can’t create a post office account, and my local branch wasn’t much help. Are foreigners able to create an account in person? I mean a regular account and not a bank account. Trying to do some simple things like check mail redirection, mail status, etc.

[comfy123]

@jimbob132

I can’t reset my password with Cathay United bank through their mobile app or website. It says nationals only:

@Niurou

Yes because you’re an untrustworthy big nose who has to take 2 hours from your day to fill in forms at the branch to reset a password.

You can use your ATM card at the ATM or webATM and will take 2 minutes but still annoying

[jimbob132]

@comfy123

You can use your ATM card at the ATM or webATM and will take 2 minutes but still annoying

I don’t have an ATM card, I use the mobile app card less withdrawal and trying to live a card free life

[comfy123]

@jimbob132

I don’t have an ATM card, I use the mobile app card less withdrawal and trying to live a card free life

Same here. But you must have an ATM card lying around somewhere.

If not… ordering one over the phone is an option

[jimbob132]

@comfy123

Same here. But you must have an ATM card lying around somewhere.

If not… ordering one over the phone is an option

I don’t, in the bank opening application form I didn’t ask for one and no one gave me one.

I think it’ll cost some money to order one now. Maybe 100NT or something.

[comfy123]

@jimbob132

I think it’ll cost some money to order one now. Maybe 100NT or something.

It shouldn’t I would write an FSC complaint about this though and see where it leads.

[Andrew]

@Andrew

When my friend entered her details into the Fubon website on the shop’s phone, the registration wouldn’t go through, presumably because she’s a foreigner with an ARC number (the new one) – I’m not 100% certain about that at the moment, but it’s obviously the most likely reason.

The sales lady said she’d contact Fubon to find out what the problem was and how to fix it then call my friend back, and I butted in at this point to ask her to tell Fubon we’d be reporting them to the FSC if they don’t allow foreigners to register for the insurance because Article 62 Article 7 blah blah blah.

I think I’ve sorted this, at least in my friend’s case. The problem wasn’t so much that ARC numbers weren’t accepted, but rather that they’d decided to exclude foreigners from the insurance promotion (“限定18歲以上的台灣人”).

ChatGPT and I sent a Line message to the Landtop store saying we’d be filing a complaint with the FSC if it wasn’t resolved and asking for a contact at Fubon to discuss it with:

我的朋友最近在Landtop店購買了一部iPhone 15，但因為她是外國人，被排除在保險優惠之外。我想指出《入出國及移民法》第62條明文規定，不得因國籍、種族、膚色、階級或出生地點而歧視在台居留之人。同時，《金融消費者保護法》第7條規定，金融服務機構應遵循公平、合理和平等的原則。

我認為Landtop和富邦目前將在台外國人排除在這項保險優惠之外，違反了這兩項法律，如果問題無法解決，我們將向金融監督管理委員會提出投訴。然而，在第一個階段，我們希望能直接與Landtop和富邦聯繫解決這個問題。您是否能夠提供給我Landtop負責安排此促銷活動的部門的電子郵件聯繫方式，例如市場部門或法律/法規合規團隊的聯繫方式？

謝謝您的協助，我期待著盡快解決這個問題。

The store turned out to be pretty helpful after this and passed it to some manager who contacted Fubon and kept me updated. They said today that Fubon will send paper documents to the store to allow my friend to register for the insurance, so I guess that’s a positive result.

Again, at least in my friend’s case and for this specific store – though I also gather from this that the Fubon website/form that Landtop uses to register customers still won’t accept new ARC numbers. Once it’s been sorted for my friend, I think I’ll ask the store if the company as a whole (they have ~40 stores across Taiwan) intends to update its policy so as to not exclude foreigners by default.

[comfy123]

@Andrew

is and passed it to some manager who contacted Fubon and kept me updated. They said today that Fubon will send paper documents to the store to allow my friend to register for the insurance

Honestly @Andrew it is refreshing to see people like you not taking it laying down

I really hope more people will be like us and not take this

[Andrew]

@comfy123

I really hope more people will be like us and not take this

Yes, I hope so too. You and @Mataiou are among the ones who recently started this stuff off IIRC, so hopefully it’s leading to some changes (however gradual).

I’ve also recently been mentioning it to some foreign friends here. Most of them didn’t seem to realize there was even the option of complaining. I think one of them is intending to file (or has filed) an FSC complaint about Line bank.

[Mataiou]

FSC complaint about line bank is useless for the moment, did that already with FSC and FOI, so now in the process of a making an administrative appeal against the FSC for financial consumer rights infringement and dereliction of duty. Not a straight process, bit will keep u posted

[Andrew]

@Mataiou

FSC complaint about line bank is useless for the moment, did that already with FSC and FOI

You’re probably right, but I suppose one hope might be that the FSC starts taking these complaints more seriously as more foreigners complain?

@Mataiou

so now in the process of a making an administrative appeal against the FSC for financial consumer rights infringement and dereliction of duty. Not a straight process, bit will keep u posted

Yeah, I’d be interested to hear about that. Based on what I’ve read here, I’m not exactly optimistic about what will happen after the FSC complaint about Richart, but my suspicion is that they’ll provide the same three-point response and the FSC will consider the case closed… (especially if it’s just one complaint, which is why I’d like to encourage other Richart customers to complain too)

[Niurou]

@Andrew

I’m not exactly optimistic about what will happen after the FSC complaint about Richart, but my suspicion is that they’ll provide the same three-point response and the FSC will consider the case closed…

From my past experience, they will drag on an administrative appeal for years and then finally send a 3 pager of all the reasons they don’t agree with you. I would do it to just give them a hassle, but I figure it won’t get results. Props for people doing that though

[Andrew]

@fifieldt - another Taiwanese-only digital bank for your list here:

‘Online’ Bank’s xenophobic reasoning for denying "foreigners" the ability to open an account online

Here’s another one for the shitlist - Bankee. I’d never heard of it before, but just saw it being advertised on Facebook. A(P)RC holders not accepted. [markup_1000021568] [markup_1000021566]

Also, I think some of the entries might need to be updated?

Costco/Fubon credit card: Don’t know about old ARCs, but it was fine for me and others with the new ARC and only denies some services (inconsistently) to non-citizens (the photo/membership card, which can be pushed back on). Maybe they deserve a “C” or something?

JKOPay: Notwithstanding the Richart-related shittiness, I was able to register with my new ARC.

Rakuten Bank: I think they might be accepting foreigners now, at least for the credit card. I wasn’t able to find it again (Edit: found it - the ad showed up again the next time I opened Facebook ), but I saw a Facebook ad the other day where somebody asked whether foreigners were eligible and they responded with a link to an English site saying that foreigners were eligible but needed an annual income above NT$1 million (don’t know how this compares to the requirements for Taiwanese, but it seems a bit high). The “外籍人士須附居留證及護照” on this page and “外籍人士請填寫居留證號碼” on this page suggests that ARCs are accepted. I read also that the Rakuten card is popular among foreigners in Japan, so maybe that helped motivate the unexpected inclusivity…

Another possible entry:

Ambassador cinema app: I was able to register fine with the new ARC number, though it only accepts Chinese names so I had to use a fake one:

[fifieldt]

@Andrew

Costco/Fubon credit card: Don’t know about old ARCs, but it was fine for me and others with the new ARC and only denies some services (inconsistently) to non-citizens (the photo/membership card, which can be pushed back on). Maybe they deserve a “C” or something?

I still get “※Costco國外會員/外國人請透過紙本申請” when trying to apply online.

[fifieldt]

@Andrew

Rakuten Bank: I think they might be accepting foreigners now, at least for the credit card.

Wow, yeah! It looks like the credit card form will accept ARCs.

For bank account, still get the error: “僅限本國籍客戶線上開立臺幣帳戶”

[Andrew]

@fifieldt

I still get “※Costco國外會員/外國人請透過紙本申請” when trying to apply online.

Oh yeah, we can’t do it online, true. I was talking about applying in the store, which seems relatively easy compared with other Taiwanese banks.

[Andrew]

@fifieldt

For bank account, still get the error: “僅限本國籍客戶線上開立臺幣帳戶”

It’s pretty weird that they accept foreigners for credit cards but not deposit accounts. I wonder why none of the Japanese living here have complained to HQ.