Went to get me a new ride. It does not have a kickstart. Now I have noticed a lot of new scooters don’t have one.
What’s up with that?
Same reason most new cars don’t come with a starting handle any more?
[quote=“bigduke6”]Went to get me a new ride. It does not have a kickstart. Now I have noticed a lot of new scooters don’t have one.
What’s up with that?[/quote]
I quote:-
“New things are no good.”
Applies to the missing starting handle too.
I noticed this too, and I’m pretty sure it’s a money-saving technique on the part of the manufacturers.
It probably would also benefit the scooter shops, as you’re forced to get a new battery or fix whatever…
[quote=“shawn_c”]I noticed this too, and I’m pretty sure it’s a money-saving technique on the part of the manufacturers.
It probably would also benefit the scooter shops, as you’re forced to get a new battery or fix whatever…[/quote]
For a lot of the scooters, the kickstart “hole” just has a plug in it. How much is a kickstarter anyway? Very cheap I would think.
But they make lots of scooters so the saving will add up, and, probably more importantly, the average customer is an 18 year old fashion-fuckwit who, if they think at all, thinks that kickstarts are sooo “yesterday”.
I had perhaps the last car to be sold with a starting handle, the Mk1 Lada, generally regarded as a joke in the UK, but quite a bit tougher than your average SUV.
For the MK2 they’d rather pathetically attempted to follow fuckwit-fashion and had taken it out. The dogs on the end of the crankshaft were still there, just no hole in the bumper and radiator, and no handle in the toolkit. I doubt this was done to save money, which wasn’t a big factor in the Soviet system.
Basic flaw of consumer[strike]capital[/strike]ism: The punter is a prat.
My scooter, a SYM GT Evo 125, has no kickstarter, and no hole where it used to be. Perhaps the internals are still there, but they definitely replaced the cover with a new style… in fact, I’m pretty sure it’s the same engine as some of the older models, as they sound exactly the same.
But still, one less metal stick and one less process on each scooter probably does add up…
I got the answer for why there’s no kick-starter on newer scooters (a “laoban” told me). Fuel-injection engines aren’t able to be started with a kick-starter, so they left 'em out.
Also, I got another question answered, which was, “Why do those young douchebags have open yellow plastic pipes hanging off of their air filter boxes?” And the answer is that the plastic pipe is supposed to collect dirty liquid that accidentally got into your air filter box… and it’s supposed to be emptied at the scooter shop. Those douches, however, just let the dirty liquid drop onto the street, which is against environmental regulations.
Well, I have built a few beetle engines in my day. They were simple as shit. Don’t know much about them new fangled ideas such as fuel injection, except my car and scooter have them.
The concept is simple enough, and if I am not mistaken, fuel injection was used as far back as WW2 fighters. But I still do not understand why a scooter with FI cannot be kick started.
I have a feeling it has more to do with the engine management computers that they use these days? Could be wrong though. Just a suspicion.
If I am not mistaken, I have seen scooters with fuel injection and a kick starter. Maybe I am wrong,but will check when I am out on the road next.
In the below pic of a motorbike with fuel injection, that sure looks like a kick starter to me?
What shawn_c said doesn’t seem to hold true.
A brief glance at the street will tell you that all new Hartford（哈特佛) 雲豹s and 小雲豹s are both FI and come stock with kick-starters.
Here’s a photo. I believe whether or not FI and kick-start can coexist depends on the type of battery employed and whether or not the required wiring is there.
Never trust a scooter shop laoban.
Aw…and you started out so well. 
[quote=“shawn_c”]
Also, I got another question answered, which was, “Why do those young douchebags have open yellow plastic pipes hanging off of their air filter boxes?” And the answer is that the plastic pipe is supposed to collect dirty liquid that accidentally got into your air filter box… and it’s supposed to be emptied at the scooter shop. Those douches, however, just let the dirty liquid drop onto the street, which is against environmental regulations.[/quote]
I think (though I don’t know much about scooters so I could be wrong) that this is also bullshit. I’d bet that’ll be the crankcase breather, and the blowby is supposed to go back in the engine, where it gets burnt.
“Cooler douches” have special little anodised aluminium “exhaust pipes”, in parallel with the main exhaust, to vent the crankcase blowby to atmosphere. I don’t know if this has any real/non-cool benefit. Perhaps a tiny reduction in pumping losses?
EDIT: I suppose it might also keep the back of your intake valve(s) a bit cleaner. ENDEDIT
Some performance cars have aftermarket “catch cans” in the crankcase ventilation circuit, some of which do need to be emptied. I THINK this applies particularly to turbos, presumably because the boost pressure increases blowby during the intake phase of the cycle.
I’d doubt any scooters need these, though there’d be nothing to stop you fitting one, if you thought it was “cool”.
I am not sure why new motorcycles don’t have one. I can state from experience that starting any scooter over 125 cc with the kick starter is a joke. If the battery is so dead that it won’t turn over, you are wasting your time. I have had my battery go dead twice in the last few years, mostly because I only use it about once a month. I depend on my electric to do the small runs. Thus, I ended up trying to start it with the kick start. An absolute waste of time. Now, I start it every few days and at least let it warm up. I also try to actually use it for a few k every month or so. When the battery starts to sound sluggish, I drop by the dealer and have him put it on the charger for an hour while I do my shopping. No kick-starter for a motorcycle seems VERY strange. I’ve been able to start some fairly large bikes with it so, maybe it is the new electronic fuel supply that caused the change.
Presumably what he meant, was that if it has electronic fuel injection and the battery’s flat, then there’s no way you’ll start it on the kick-start. That said, EFI needs a lot less juice than a starter.
I think there have been motorcycles without kickstarts for quite a long time, pre FI even.
IIRC I looked at a Honda CG125 in a UK dealer a very long time ago (EDIT:probably about 10 years, actually, so not so very long. ENDEDIT) just so I could piss off the salesman by sneering at its lack of a kickstart.
I’d say they are, if anything, less dispensible with a scooter though, since you don’t have the option of push-starting a scooter because of the automatic transmission.
I’ve started scooters on the kicker, but it does seem to be a lot more difficult than with a motorcycle.
Perhaps one of these would be useful?
