We have recently purchased a house. It is over 20 years old and requires a bit of remodelling. It is mostly painting, protection from the elements, replacing bathrooms and installing a kitchen (the previous owner didn’t need a kitchen so did away with it to create a larger living room).
Throughout the whole process the whole attitude that I am getting from tradesmen, family members and anyone else who wants to give some input is “差不多”。 This is my new home – surely people should be doing their very best to assist me to establish a nice home for me and my wife.
One of they biggest stickling points is the different interpretations over the term DIY. I was brought up on DIY, and remember spending many a weekend working with my parents fixing up the family home. Although it was hard work and meant missing out on some leisure time it was still worth it. I also have a strong interest in DIY and enjoy watching tutorials on Youtube.
However all of the Taiwanese people think it is crazy that I am even considering doing any of the work myself. Their attitude is that I should let other people earn my money and spend my time relaxing, going out, and not worrying about the house. As well as the usual ”你想太多了” comments my wife has also invited friends of friends over to provide quotes. These people have told me that I am incapable of taking up some bathroom tiles, removing a toilet and painting the interior of my house. Of course – they say that I should entrust all of this to them (for a charge). My wife sees these people as friends; I see them as trandesmen, so naturally our perceptions are very different. It’s all driving me insane.
Having seen the quality of work that is sometimes done here in Taiwan I don’t want to spend my money on a poor job and have to fix it later. I would rather try and do it myself now and get it right. Obviously I understand that I can’t do everything myself.
Whilst I understand that labour is very cheap in Taiwan compared to back in the UK, I still want to try and save a bit of money and have a go myself. Is this really such a bad thing? Why is it so hard for Taiwanese people to understand this?
I don’t own a home and perhaps never will, but this is the exact problem I had trying to customize my wedding. There were all of these cookie-cutter options available at very reasonable prices, but nothing that I would have been happy with. Like your home, it was my wedding, and I don’t want to look at pictures 20 years down the line and be unable to tell if they are from my special day or someone else’s. Here are some things I found that I suspect apply to your situation:
[ul]The request is so unusual that the system can’t accommodate it. This means some tools or decorations you need to buy will be hard to find or totally unavailable, and if available may not offer a wide selection of choices for you.[/ul]
[ul]You will exhaust yourself because nobody will know how to help you since what you are doing is just so foreign to the Taiwanese lifestyle. Many will be willing to help, but perhaps not able.[/ul]
[ul]You will get little sympathy if you show up to work late because you had to deal with some unexpected problem. “See, I told you you should have left it to a professional!”[/ul]
[ul]But in the end, you will be so glad you did things your way and happy every time you lay eyes on your own achievement, and whenever you show your work off to somebody you will be overflowing with pride.[/ul]
For some things, like installing an entire kitchen, I think you should consider professional help unless you really know what you’re doing. That could prove dangerous down the line what with gas pipes and all. But for the rest, if you know what you’re doing, just go out one day unannounced and buy your stuff, come home, and start working on it. Your family will either help out or get out of the way… hopefully the former.
I think it’s hard for them to understand because very few Taiwanese people, and especially I suspect younger people, can do this - DIY has simply not been part of their lives. As a result they believe it’s something incredibly difficult and arcane (which, um, to me, it is!). It’s the same reason my students are amazed that I’m capable of making a sandwich with homemade bread for lunch. They’ve simply never clued in that some things are really, really easy.
Now, before you get too far into this, keep in mind what tools you have available. I can’t do home renovating. My father’s attempts to teach me such things were (hell, still are!) met with passive aggressive sulkiness. But I do recall that lots of his projects involved extended time spent in the work room getting pieces sawn to fit, and enough sawdust floating through the air that we probably were in danger of blowing up the house. Do you have those tools available? And by the time you invest in the tools, would you actually be saving any money? I suspect doing it yourself would be more expensive, and would undoubtedly be more time consuming. And yet, of course, it may still be worth it. You get what you pay for - and I’ve found few opportunities in Taiwan to pay for quality with this sort of thing.
Congrats on the new home! I remember you were debating whether or not to purchase just a few months ago. Looks like you finally decided to take the plunge. Hope you got a good deal on the house.
How much free time do you have on your hands? Remodeling is very time consuming, but if you’re genuinely interested in DIY and putting in the sweat for a quality result, then knock yourself out. It’s your house. You’re the owner. Don’t let others sway you. But if you don’t have the time and don’t have the necessary tools for the work (there’s nothing like The Home Depot in Taiwan AFAIK), as well as a place to store all the tools after you’re done using them, labor is cheap here. Just hire reliable workmen, and do your part as a strict supervisor. Don’t be afraid to tell them to redo something that’s not up to standard. You’re their laoban after all.
I feel you, MK. I have the same attitude. And it’s really incompatible with Taiwan. Life is much easier here if you don’t care about the “details,” such as if the place where you live is actually a cockroach-ridden den with prisonesque-barred windows.
Mind you though, you’re not gonna save money going DIY but it’s probably the only way to get acceptable-quality workmanship. I think you’ve already decided what to do, so go for it and make it look nice but conserve your energy and money. Houses here are perishable items with an expiry date, and they start rotting apart as soon as they’re built anyway. And whatever you do in your new apartment, it’ll already be miles ahead of the typical identikit interior.
If and when you hire someone to do the stuff you can’t, don’t hire a family friend/neighbor. When things go bad because they don’t know how to follow instructions or use cheap material to cut costs you’ll be able to chew them out because they are total strangers instead of having to maintain pleasantries because the contractor is the husband of your wife’s second cousin’s neighbor’s dog stylist.
I own a house in LA. Over the past 25 year or so, I first hired out to do the work, but I soon realized it is cost prohibitive, plus I have to deal with many dishonest contractors. I decided to pick up all work except some very labor intensive or elaborate electric work. I built my whole kitchen myself later on.
I now own an apartment in XinZhu. I will never do any more work myself in Taiwan. I would need to prepare the tools, the materials, and spend time/labor to do the work. I rather hire out and enjoy the time out doors.
It is not a right or wrong decision. It is simply how you want to trade your time with money.
I also grew up in a DIY household, but my dad was terrible at fixing stuff. Whether it was indoor plumbing, cars, or a lawnmower, he’d cuss up a storm all afternoon and end up calling over buddy to help sort out the mess. I guess it’s a face thing for some people. Why should I pay someone else when I can just do it myself? (It could have also been an elaborate plan to get together with a friend for beers.)
As with anywhere, there are both good and bad contractors in Taiwan. If you’re concerned with the quality of their work (family friend or not), then I think it’s totally reasonable to ask them to show you a place they’ve remodeled in the past. Similar to checking out a case study or design portfolio. Don’t go to a place that was done within the past 3 years, go visit a house that the contractor remodeled 5-10 years ago. Even how they handle the suggestion gives a good indication of their confidence and skills:
“Can I check out one of your past projects?”
“Sure, no problem. Feel free to visit ____ or _____ to get an idea of our work.”
“Can I check out one of your past projects?”
“What for? Come on, we’re family! You can trust me.”
This shows that you’re simply looking to find the best possible supplier. Whether in Taiwan or not, people understand that this is an expensive undertaking and due diligence is necessary.
I don’t know about installing a new kitchen, but when it comes to painting, it’s much cheaper to do it on your own. The tools and paint are actually not that expensive. I had some “professionals” over here who wanted 20k TWD just for painting my tiny 17 ping shoebox of an apartment (others were more expensive). Plus they were the chabuduo-kind. So, I guess if you really have an eye for the little inaccuracies, then leaving the painting to someone else could lead to some nerve wrecking consequences. I agree with the commenter above that the main consideration probably is “your time vs. your money.” Otherwise just get the stuff and start somewhere. Painting a house can be fun if it’s not done in a rush.
Count your time, count your money,
but don’t forget to ask your honey (= your wife).
Time to buy materials and DIY versus having it done by others with various degrees of success.
You could ask around in your local park for some local references to outsource the difficult jobs, and do the DIY jobs -you like to do, have time to do and don’t want to spend to spend too much money on- by yourself.
I feel the OP’s pain and share it. One of the biggest fights me and my wife had was over the plastic flexy pipe connected with electrical tape that the…cough, cough…“contractor” put under our kitchen sink. “That’s how we do it in Taiwan.” Gag.
I worked for a contractor right out of high school and then did construction. i don’t know everything but I know BS when I see it. They also put in bricks and used as little mortar as possible to hold them together but now the family naturally complain that the rooms are cold in winter and let in drafts. It’s absurd. If you point this stuff out, it’s like talking to a wall. That’s because few people here understand of appreciate DIY. No one really does it.
You have to find a good contractor and there are a few out there. But the smoking guy whose shirt is covered in binglang stains is usually the one hired.
Just go for it. If you like DIY, that is. Even if you are not a professional plumber, learn the skills, apply them, and sit back and enjoy your own accomplishment. Haters gonna hate. Maybe it is because I’m a cheapskate, or maybe my taste is different, but I couldn’t’ find the furniture I want when I moved into my new house, so I made a bed, sofa, dining room table and other odds and ends. I’m not really good at it, but they are fully customized as to what I wanted. I also built a cabin in the mountains in Hsinchu. Without any power tools, because it is off the grid. It;s not perfect, but it’s mine, and For me, the biggest problem is getting the right materials and supplies I want. I don’t care what people think. So, do it. If you f**ck up, call a professional then, but at least you tried!
Now that I live in Malaysia I long for the attention to detail and the professionalism of workets in Taiwan. Here chabuduo is combined with mañana but lo it all costs you as much as in the west.
People don’t even bother to show up here and don’t seem to care much if they get your contract. You guys have it so lucky.
“house proud” - does this word / concept even exist in Taiwan?
Taking the train in Japan I was amazed at the individuality of the different houses, painted different colors with different outside decorations etc, a concept that seems totally foreign in Taiwan. I get the impression people don’t care about spending money on their housing here, regarding it a waste of time and precious money. It’s not like anyone invites friends over anyway; in my experience restaurants are for socializing, while houses are just for sleeping, cooking, watching TV and hoarding boxes of junk like old newspapers and vitamins.
I’d never heard it in English before now. I assure this is as foreign a concept to the Taiwanese as the burqa.
Your impression is very spot-on. People don’t invite others over largely because the homes here are just too small for all the people and their stuff to fit in comfortably. Sure, you can cram five or six friends into a living room with seating for four… but why?
What I find interesting is that this doesn’t appear to be a traditional trait, but something more recent. People always showed off their wealth in their houses (especially the interior) and what is more, during the 1920s and 1930s we saw shop owners spending money to keep their facades up to date with the latest worldwide trends (art deco at the time).
What happened to this? We do see a lot of small shops with lovely interior design, highly personalized, we see hundreds of beautiful guesthouses all over, and certainly upper middle class families have nice interiors (when I bought an apartment it was bare cement because everyone redesigns anyway).
But what happened to allow such shameful development in most places? I would guess, crazy unregulated post-war development that coincided with a government that didn’t give a shit, a populace that had no say (civic groups on urban design began to form as soon as martial law was lifted) and the general shittiness of post-war architecture around the world.
Wish a few by-laws could come in to require painting and cleaning but the funny thing is when I have mentioned this to Taiwanese friends they are shocked, thinking it is worse than martial law, and they cannot believe such laws exist in the free west.
When in doubt, blame education. The KMT was very eager early on to convince the populace of the need to retake the mainland (just look at how many people born around mid-century have the personal name Guangfu!) and, I posit, this encouraged a civic policy of completely ignoring outward appearances as long as things ran well enough, the economy grew, and the army stayed strong. People, I think, were so indoctrinated with this concept that their home was just a small, remote part of a great nation, and combined with the fact that their senses were so assaulted with the way things were planned here to the point of numbness, that they began to believe there was no point in making Taiwan look nice. Just my theory.
