[quote=“Omniloquacious”]The CEPD has summarized my suggestion in appropriate form and submitted it to the MOJ for the next stage of the reform process. The MOJ will review the suggestion, write up their response, and send it back to the CEPD. If they disagree with the suggestion, they must explain why.
[color=#0000FF]If they come out strongly against it, then it’s dead in the water and there’s no possibility of the law being amended within the near future.[/color] .
I’m sure there are as many Taiwanese who want to live permanently overseas while retaining their ROC citizenship as there are foreigners who want to live in Taiwan permanently while retaining their own citizenship. How about a one-on-one trade?
[quote=“Satellite TV”]
Good then go ahead and do it. You have nothing to lose and much to gain as UK Nationals can resume their nationality anyways.[/quote]
My job requires me to go to China periodically. I won’t be able to do that during the period of statelessness prior to getting my household registration. I’d ask for my UK passport back in the interim but I’m concerned the NIA has cottoned onto this (have they?).
[quote=“spaint”][quote=“Satellite TV”]
Good then go ahead and do it. You have nothing to lose and much to gain as UK Nationals can resume their nationality anyways.[/quote]
My job requires me to go to China periodically. I won’t be able to do that during the period of statelessness prior to getting my household registration. I’d ask for my UK passport back in the interim but I’m concerned the NIA has cottoned onto this (have they?).[/quote]
Don’t think it would be a case of “cottoning on.” If you got your UK passport back before your ROC one was issued, it would be none of their business. How would they even know? – unless you went through immigration while you were supposed to be stateless. I could see how that might be a problem, possibly.
Thanks for the update, Omni. (A masterful translation, BTW.)
I used to think that it wasn’t possible to get a more stuck-in-the-past ministry than MOFA. But the Ministry of the Interior is making me reconsider that.
[quote=“sandman”]
My job requires me to go to China periodically. I won’t be able to do that during the period of statelessness prior to getting my household registration. I’d ask for my UK passport back in the interim but I’m concerned the NIA has cottoned onto this (have they?).[/quote]
Don’t think it would be a case of “cottoning on.” If you got your UK passport back before your ROC one was issued, it would be none of their business. How would they even know? – unless you went through immigration while you were supposed to be stateless. I could see how that might be a problem, possibly.[/quote]
They require proof of renunciation prior to offering you the TARC. What if they require “continued proof of renunciation” or something similarly hilarious prior to allowing you off the TARC?
Yeah, I’m probably being overly paranoid. But I could have sworn I heard of something similar for nationals of one country…
[quote=“Satellite TV”][quote=“spaint”]Is it possible that the reason they must publish their reasons is so that there can be a counter-proposal addressing their concerns?
To be honest, this kind of idiotic response makes me want to get citizenship even more, just so I can wave it in the face of the asshats who made it so difficult in the first place.[/quote]
Good then go ahead and do it. You have nothing to lose and much to gain as UK Nationals can resume their nationality anyways.[/quote]
Exactly, so they’re really just excluding their biggest ally (The US), because most of us can resume with minimal effort (ok, Saffas actually need to go back and pretend whe’re there to stay - but that’s what getting an internationally recognised MA or PhD is for, right? ). So their entire point is moot, really.
[quote=“spaint”][quote=“Satellite TV”]
Good then go ahead and do it. You have nothing to lose and much to gain as UK Nationals can resume their nationality anyways.[/quote]
My job requires me to go to China periodically. I won’t be able to do that during the period of statelessness prior to getting my household registration. I’d ask for my UK passport back in the interim but I’m concerned the NIA has cottoned onto this (have they?).[/quote]
Not sure how the UK renunciation preocedure works, but you could be stateless for a very short time. As soon as you’ve renounced and get your TARC (Taiwan Area Residence Card) you can apply for a Taiwan passport as a Taiwanese National. Then, to go to China, all you need is a Tai Bao Zheng.
Problem is, you have a one year waiting period from when you get issued your TARC to when you get your Taiwanese ID Card. If you leave the country in that period you have to wait an additional year.
[quote=“bismarck”]
Not sure how the UK renunciation preocedure works, but you could be stateless for a very short time. As soon as you’ve renounced and get your TARC (Taiwan Area Residence Card) you can apply for a Taiwan passport as a Taiwanese National. Then, to go to China, all you need is a Tai Bao Zheng.
Problem is, you have a one year waiting period from when you get issued your TARC to when you get your Taiwanese ID Card. If you leave the country in that period you have to wait an additional year.[/quote]
You can’t get a Taibaozheng without an ID number (i.e. household registration).
The TARC and the Taiwanese passport do not, in and of themselves, confer nationality and hence one is considered “stateless” until one has completed the process of getting household registration.
The additional year for leaving the country is counted from the date of return to Taiwan (it’s like a reset button). However, the total length of time until eligible to apply for an ID card will not exceed two years no matter how many times you leave the country. I believe there’s also an upper limit to the length of time one can spend on a TARC before one MUST apply for an ID.
[quote=“spaint”][quote=“Satellite TV”]
Good then go ahead and do it. You have nothing to lose and much to gain as UK Nationals can resume their nationality anyways.[/quote]
My job requires me to go to China periodically. I won’t be able to do that during the period of statelessness prior to getting my household registration. I’d ask for my UK passport back in the interim but I’m concerned the NIA has cottoned onto this (have they?).[/quote]
Gov Attache did just this. He renounced, then I advised him to re-apply for his British passport ( he didnt know he could but I know there is a clause you have to be given your UK Nationality back if you dont get full citizenship of the other country within 6 months ) which he used to go to China. It just meant it took more than 1 year to get his ID card. But now he has both ROC and British passports.
[quote=“Satellite TV”]
Gov Attache did just this. He renounced, then I advised him to re-apply for his British passport ( he didnt know he could but I know there is a clause you have to be given your UK Nationality back if you dont get full citizenship of the other country within 6 months ) which he used to go to China. It just meant it took more than 1 year to get his ID card. But now he has both ROC and British passports.[/quote]
Yeah, that’s exactly what I’d like to do, actually. Just concerned about getting caught out when I upgrade from a TARC.
[quote=“Satellite TV”]
You cannot get a Taibaozheng with a TARC you need the ID Card number.[/quote]
[quote=“spaint”][quote=“Satellite TV”]
Gov Attache did just this. He renounced, then I advised him to re-apply for his British passport ( he didnt know he could but I know there is a clause you have to be given your UK Nationality back if you dont get full citizenship of the other country within 6 months ) which he used to go to China. It just meant it took more than 1 year to get his ID card. But now he has both ROC and British passports.[/quote]
Yeah, that’s exactly what I’d like to do, actually. Just concerned about getting caught out when I upgrade from a TARC. [/quote]
Get caught for what? You only have to show you have renounced, which you have already done.
[quote=“Satellite TV”][quote=“spaint”][quote=“Satellite TV”]
Gov Attache did just this. He renounced, then I advised him to re-apply for his British passport ( he didnt know he could but I know there is a clause you have to be given your UK Nationality back if you dont get full citizenship of the other country within 6 months ) which he used to go to China. It just meant it took more than 1 year to get his ID card. But now he has both ROC and British passports.[/quote]
Yeah, that’s exactly what I’d like to do, actually. Just concerned about getting caught out when I upgrade from a TARC. [/quote]
Get caught for what? You only have to show you have renounced, which you have already done.[/quote]
To paraphrase what I said a mere page ago, I’m concerned that they’ll implement an extra hoop to jump through.
Right now, you take a health check to get candidature, then you renounce, take your proof of renunciation to get a TARC, wait “1 year” then have to take the health check again to get household registration. Given the stupidity of having a health check when you’re already “stateless” (though a Chinese national), it wouldn’t surprise me to have the NIA decide that you need to prove (again) that your renunciation is still in effect.
The NIA does love closing its loopholes. The one you used, for example (getting divorced after renouncing, prior to obtaining household registration), would appear to no longer be available, given the information offered in the thread on SE-Asian brides here: Movement to push for dual citizenship for immigrants
As long as the career path of politician/businessman/gangster retiring to California remains the norm for Taiwan’s upper echelons there is really no need for them to grant anything to people who don’t vote.
Given that none of them want to live here any longer than it takes to manipulate the stock/housing market to their huge financial advantage it’s hardly surprising that they’re not too bothered about internationalising Taiwan. It’s much more profitable to get into bed with China, for example.
It’s fine to allow a load of country bumpkins to import brides/slaves from poor countries because it keeps them too busy/docile to bother voting. The thinking is that if a few Westerners want to get ROC citizenship, something that the plutocracy itself doesn’t really value, then they must be bums and therefore not worth having in the country at all.
[quote=“sandman”][quote=“spaint”][quote=“Satellite TV”]
Good then go ahead and do it. You have nothing to lose and much to gain as UK Nationals can resume their nationality anyways.[/quote]
My job requires me to go to China periodically. I won’t be able to do that during the period of statelessness prior to getting my household registration. I’d ask for my UK passport back in the interim but I’m concerned the NIA has cottoned onto this (have they?).[/quote]
Don’t think it would be a case of “cottoning on.” If you got your UK passport back before your ROC one was issued, it would be none of their business. How would they even know? – unless you went through immigration while you were supposed to be stateless. I could see how that might be a problem, possibly.[/quote]
You can go through the airport stateless on your TARC.
[quote=“Satellite TV”][quote=“sandman”][quote=“spaint”][quote=“Satellite TV”]
Good then go ahead and do it. You have nothing to lose and much to gain as UK Nationals can resume their nationality anyways.[/quote]
My job requires me to go to China periodically. I won’t be able to do that during the period of statelessness prior to getting my household registration. I’d ask for my UK passport back in the interim but I’m concerned the NIA has cottoned onto this (have they?).[/quote]
Don’t think it would be a case of “cottoning on.” If you got your UK passport back before your ROC one was issued, it would be none of their business. How would they even know? – unless you went through immigration while you were supposed to be stateless. I could see how that might be a problem, possibly.[/quote]
You can go through the airport stateless on your TARC.[/quote]
If you have a TARC you’re not really stateless anymore as you’re a Taiwanese National with a Taiwanese passport, no?
[quote=“bismarck”]
If you have a TARC you’re not really stateless anymore as you’re a Taiwanese National with a Taiwanese passport, no?[/quote]
It’s a technicality. You are considered stateless by (e.g.) the UK government right up until you’ve acquired household registration and a real ID number.
). So their entire point is moot, really.