the fact the partizan movement in Ukraine was fighting everyone. They were nationalists. They wanted everybody out their territory, nazis, soviets, etc. so yeah, it’s horse balls.
it’s hilariously ironic that dude claims his grandfather(a bandora) wasn’t a nazi fighting the nazis. Because he was one of the GOOD guys.
BUT the current Ukrainian’s defending their homeland are ALL nazis and none of them had the choice his grandfather had during ww2 in nazi occupied territory.
The major large partisan anti-nazi movement was in Yugoslavia. Josip broz Tito of Yugoslavia fought the ustasa(nazi) and cetnik(Serbian nationalist movements in Yugoslavia.
You don’t have to be a Nazi to be a white supremacist, but you can’t be a Nazi without being a white supremacist.
Poland occupied parts of Ukraine after the Polish Ukrainian war right after WWI, and the rest were occupied by the Soviets. So the OUN and its predecessors actually started by fighting the Poles and the Soviets back in the 1920s.
I don’t understand how driving out Polish and Russian influence from Ukraine counts as “white supremacy.” It seems like a favored Russian talking point to conflate Ukrainian Ultra-Nationalism with “white supremacy” and “Nazism”. There are definitely overlaps, but not any worse than ultra-nationalism in Russia, and it certainly wasn’t a popular political position in Ukraine prior to the 2014 or the 2022 invasions, as the main ultra-national political party wouldn’t get enough vote to even get a seat in the parliament.
For me, the annexation of Crimea by itself is enough to dismiss all the excuses (could find more, like Georgia and Chechnya, but not necessary). It’s a land grab, for riches and glory. The rest is distraction.
Some people here just can’t admit to supporting actual Nazi so they have to play mental gymnastics in their mind. I know my ancestry very well, as do the Western Ukrainians, and they are quite proud of it.
The only people that seem to take issue with it are their supporters in the West.
That’s why I find it hilarious in an absurd sort of way that most of Ukrainian supporters are self proclaimed socialists and liberals, who would have been anti war when Bush was leading America to invade everyone, but when Obama got into power and kept invading the middle east decided to change along with him.
What it really shows is that we have NPCs that will follow the mainstream narrative regardless of their hypocricy and people that can think for themselves, and really all the evidence I presented in my previous posts only has a chance to convince those types of people.
Like here, I show clear evidence how Western media manipulated the narrative.
I show a video from Western media interviewing a woman who just escaped Azovstal, and then part of the whole interview saying that she and her family were held hostage by the fascists there, and that Ukraine as a state is dead to her, which by the way is the same sentiment I feel.
Is there one person here that can say that they have been lied to about this ONE blatant thing? Just this one thing, can someone here write down and say they were wrong, Azovstal was a hostage situation by the Ukrainian fascists and they should all be burning in hell instead of traveling the world as national heroes. Anyone?
I don’t think supporting Ukraine is supporting actual Nazis, despite the history and Russian propaganda. It is easy to see mental gymnastics all over the place.
But of course you know your ancestry better than any of us, and it isn’t our place to question that. If your grandfather fought for freedom and against invasion in WW2, as mine both did, I hope we can find some common ground there.
I’m not supporting the minority of ethno-supremacist Ukranians that allegedly want to wipe out Russia, I think the idea is a bit silly. I’m supporting victims of unnecessary Russian aggression. I know you see it differently, and neither of us should speculate on the other’s motivations, intelligence, or understanding of what is really happening here. Thank you.
Thanks Obama. Anyways, geopolitics is not simple.
OK. Don’t refer to posters as NPCs. You have your narrative, I have mine, there are plenty of other people who have still different understandings of what is going on. “Those types of people” are your fellow community members, and if you don’t want to be a part of this community, that can be arranged.
So many fakes. An image and even a video can be easily altered/staged, to create online outrage.
There were some videos of masked men in some cellar with dim lighting saying they will commit war crimes or similar. Could have been filmed in any place of the world.
Or shaky videos of acts that seemed like a war crime with certain arm tapes and uniforms. Similarly could have taken uniforms from fallen soldiers and staged a video to discredit the opposite side.
Take all examples posted here with a grain of salt.
But some have a mountain of evidence from many sources, which is not possible to fake:
I’m almost convinced most of it are lies. I obviously don’t know for sure, and maybe no one will, but considering the Ukrainian regime, and Western media are relentless liars and were doing everything they can to spur NATO to join the fight against Russia at the time, and also that
There are videos of the Mayor happily celebrating in Butcha with no mention of bodies or atrocities. (Days before The Butcha story broke, and after the Russians had left)
Videos of Ukrainians driving through Butcha, and convoys of Police sweeping the city with no mention of bodies. (Days before The Butcha story broke, and after the Russians had left)
And that ALL the evidence of Butcha came after the fact, and not during, which means no one bothered to post one of these videos of Russians killing civilians before Butcha became a thing.
Like I said in my actual post, I don’t deny some war crimes were committed by Russians, it’s inevitable in war, and so are mistakes and civilian casualties, but in Ukraine it’s systemic, and all the evidence I can present comes from Ukrainian sources themselves, such as them proudly killing and abusing soldiers, or showing them throwing bodies of women and men into mass graves (Yeah, this was a thing a Ukrainian fighter proudly posted)
If you look at the war crimes Ukrainians post by the way, the Russian soldiers they kill have their hands tied behind their back, and have white arm bands just like a lot of the Butcha victims: Telegram: Contact @readovkanews (graphic)
I wouldn’t put it past Ukrainians to have killed some civilians themselves either through the course of fighting, or because they saw them as Russian supporters, and then spinning it for propaganda with the help of the West.
Moldovan / Georgian heritage, but Ukrainian Russian culture, and living in Australia, but I can’t call myself Ukrainian now without being disgusted a little by those words.
I feel just like the woman I posted. That Ukraine as a state is dead to her and her family, and she will never return to it.
I might go back to Odessa depending on the situation, but I am hoping Russia is able to take it, without destroying it hopefully, but I’d honestly would rather see it leveled to the ground and taken than have it in the hands of the pieces of trash running the place.
When I talk about Ukrainians negatively, I’m specifically talking about the Western Ukrainians. That tying people to poles naked and beating them is exclusively the “Ethnic” Ukrainian thing.
I feel about Ukraine like this woman at the end, and more so:
Careful what you wish for. Nukes are becoming more likely in this conflict, and such posts won’t age well beside pictures of civilians with their skin melted off
I edited the part to be more specific, but they are the ones who are most brainwashed and radical, hateful and cruel. And I put “ethnically” in commas specifically because it’s them who think they are somehow genetically superior to those that aren’t of “pure” ethnic, slavic blood.
Maybe I wasn’t specific enough, which is my bad, but I’m addressing a very specific subset of Ukrainians, the majority, but ofcourse not ALL, that come from the West.
I was just reading some of the comments on the video I just posted, and this was one of them, and describes exactly what Ukrainians I’m talking about:
(Here in Germany a 4 star hotel offered free rooms last summer for Ukrainians. They had a separate line only for Ukrainians at the breakfast buffet. I didnt know and as I tried to grab bread a woman told me very arrogantly „excuse me this is only for Ukrainian people“ while smiling and nodding. As if its a law of nature. Truly ungrateful impressions all over)
