Scooters


#1

Anyone know a good place in Taipei to go browsing for new scooters. I want a place where there’s a really big store with a lot of bikes, or lots of stores all together so that I can go and look at a lot of kinds. YenPing Bei Lu has almost only second-hand, but I want new.

Also, anyone recommend a biggish scooter. I mean good seat size, slightly bigger tires, little bit of leg-room, bit bigger than your Freeways and Jockeys, but now as big (or ugly) as a Majesty.

bri


#2

Kymco website
http://www.kymco.com.tw/english/html/models.htm

Personally I have a Dink 150LX, water cooled giving more Horse Power, and disk brakes that stop you dead in your tracks.
Cause it is water cooled the engine block is heavier so it is a heavy bike. But the engine should give less problems
Lots of power on take off though!!
Good at intimidating all those little 50CC and 125CCs as well!!!
Not too big, easy to get around in heavy traffic, and you can pop in the rear view mirrors if it is too tight.

Yahamha

Go for the monster, go for the Majesty!!!. Long Wheel Base gives smoother ride, plus more comfortable for the longer rides as you are not leaning over the handling bars and have some back support. 150CC engine, but its a big bike so its a drain on the engine a little. My Kymco will out run it on Keelung Road from a green traffic light start.
More difficult in heavy traffic as you cannot squeeze in and out of tight situations and the bike doesn’t have a great lock(how much it can turn the front wheel)
Wider wheels meaning they are more expensive, but the wheel width will not affect handling in the wet cause the bike is heavy


#3

If you are buying it new…then all you have to do is get your savvy Chinese friend to go with you to a registered bike dealer and try to beat down the price as low as possible.
And get a nice big lock for yourself and a disc brake lock. Most new bikes are fitted with alarms, but they are really annoying and the engine running would muff out the alarm sound


#4

Hey Bri, You just knew I had to reply, didn’t you?

Actually, the MaJESty is only 125cc, but it is also watercooled. It is underpowered compared to the Grand Dink (Zhukov, doesn’t the name embarrass you? ). Theft isn’t really a problem, though, as the fork locks are quite solid, and the new models have an integrated circuit chip in the key, so even if you had an exact replica of the key made, it still wouldn’t start the bike.

Zhukov is right about the Disk lock - it’s much better than the “U-Locks” that come with the bikes.

I rode the Dink and found that I had a much higher centre of gravity than on the MaJESty, and I couldn’t stretch my comparatively long western legs as much. I believe that the Dink does have a rear disk brake, though, which is a major plus. I find it fairly manoueverable, but I think driver experience is a major factor there…

Spoke to the good people at the BIG motorcyle shop on Jianguo South Road, and they told me July 1st is the kick-off date for big bikes in Taiwan. Look for the MaJESty 250, as well as a Suzuki Skyrider scooter (250 and 400).

If you’re looking for a reputable scooter dealer who speaks English, go to 119 Xinglong Road Section 1, the boss is Mr. Jian, and he speaks English. The number is 8663-7317. Drive safe…


#5

I never knew that about a majesty(the 125cc engine and water cooling)…true though about the higher center of gravity…in the Majesty you are sitting more into the bike than on it…but I found that feels strange…maybe its just getting used to a bike…
Dink…weird name… but I just call it a KYMCO 150 if anyone asks

The only thing with buying a 250cc or 400cc is where are you going to drive them to stretch their legs…not on the motorway(highway)…or are they going to be allowed on the highway?..otherwise you are going to be paying more money for better accleration and a couple of more cyclinders in your engine as you can’t go flat out on most Taiwan roads… still in all it would feel nice to be driving up Chung Shau E Road when alot more horsepower under you…
How about licenses…won’t you have to do a test to drive a 400cc?


#6

About a year ago I bought a 2ndhand Majesty for $40,000, and at the same time, found a good mechanic.
I have had no mechanical failures, but have made a few upgrades to the bike:
1./ new Electronic fuel injection ($3,000) for about 20% more power.
2/. new tyres, as the Majesty tyres are notorious for wet-weather riding ($4,000)
3/. various accessories ($2,000).

The bike has been fantastic for long trips, and it drives well with 2 people on it. I’m planning a trip to Hualien, but will probably use the new Airbus service (there’s already been a posting put onto this site).

I chose the “Majesty” over the “Apex” because the engine is said to be more reliable, albeit less powerful. And because it looks better: however, I have seen some amazing “suped-up” Apex bikes. There are some great accessories and paint-jobs to choose from. The “Dink” seems to be bigger (overall size & engine) but I still prefer the Majesty.

My advice is to go for the 2ndhand model, but get it checked out by a reliable mechanic. I figure if it’s over a year old, then you shouldn’t pay more than $45,000.

Hope this helps, and good luck with the search.


#7

I had a Kymco Apex (is that the same as a grand dink?) for a couple of years, and loved it. Great power and stopping. The only problems were

  1. For some reason they put the gas tank opening in the front of the bike, and gas often overflowed when filling; and

  2. The side-view mirrors stuck out so far that the bike was almost half as wide as a car. It was so bad that most of the time I just pulled them in and didn’t use them. Never could see much point in looking back anyway, as I’d already been there.


#8

Thanks for your recommendations. Problem is I don’t like the Majesty (loathe it) or the Dink. Nothing personal, I just think that split seat design is incredibly ugly.

I want something a bit bigegr than the Jockey. Maybe Kymco’s Movie is big enough or a little bigger. Anyone any experience with this size? I saw a Yamaha (I think it was Yamaha - not Kymco) 150CC which was good, but the plastic was just too chunky and ugly.

Thanks for the Kymco site zhukov.

Maoman, where’s Xinlong Lu?

Still haven’t seen any big dealers.

Bri


#9

The other night I was buying a new visor for my helmet at a shop on Ba-de Rd., and the guy there told me that, while imported motorcycle sales will begin in July, larger-capacity domestically produced motorcycles would go on sale in January. Apparently domestic producers have been manufacturing the larger bikes and storing them in warehouses in preparation for the relaxed regulations expected after entry into WTO.

He also told me that there would be a new licensing system, with A, B and C-class licenses based on engine sizes. He didn’t go into too much detail as things are obviously still in the planning stage, but he did say that the licenses would be based on age, e.g. you’d have to be over 25 to ride anything over 150cc, over 30 to ride anything over a 250 and over 35 to ride anything over 400cc.

Granted, these ages sound rather advanced to me, and I’m not sure the shop owner wasn’t just guessing, but remember that they will most likely calculate ages in the Chinese fashion, which basically adds a few years to your age as calculated in the Western fashion, i.e. years from birth. I’m 32 now but by July I’ll be 35 by Chinese standards. In any case considering the quality of driving by most Taiwanese 18-year olds, some sort of age-based system would be a wise precaution. (Of course, if I were 18 I’d be railing against it ).

I think that the larger bikes should be allowed on the highways, but he wasn’t clear about that. Basically, I don’t need any extra horsepower in the city; my bike (a 1988 Yamaha RZR) is already fast enough, if not too fast, for city driving, and I usually drive at about 30-40%. But outside, say on the northern coast highway, I can just open it up and cruise at 110-130 kph, but it feels light and buzzy and tends to float at any speed over 130. It’s situations like that where I would appreciate the smoothness of a larger 4-stroke engine. Also in the mountains I wouldn’t have to push it as hard either and feel guilty about the smoke and noise, although since I got the engine rebuilt it doesn’t smoke excessively, certainly less than most 2-stroke scooters. In short, I wouldn’t go any faster in the city if I had a larger bike, it would just make cruising on more remote, country roads a more comfortable proposition.


#10

Xinglong Road is the second intersection south of Jilong and Roosevelt Roads. If you go by MRT, go one stop past Gongguan to the Wanlung Station and Xinglong Road is a hop, skip and a jump.

Bri, Have you checked out the Yamaha Force? It doesn’t have the split seat, the engine (only 125cc) pulls quite nicely, it has a flat floorboard (very useful), and I think the headlight design is kinda cool. It was my second choice for a scooter.

What I’d really like to get for Christmas is a Segway Human Transporter, aka “Ginger”! :slight_smile: Segway Human Transporter Home Page :sunglasses:


#11

Thanks for suggestions so far. I just have a few technical questions.

Is a rear disc brake really much of a plus, seeing as most of your braking is in front anyway?

What exactly is SBS (simultaneous braking system) and is it any good?

Ditto ‘electronic fuel injection’.

Cheers
Bri


#12

Disc brakes slow you down better with a more controlled slow down cause they can absorb more of the energy through the discs than hub brakes can.

I should think that the back brake contributes more to your slowing down than the front brake.Ususally you use the back brake first and then the front, when the back has got its teeth stuck into the disc or hub, otherwise if you use the front brake more you are more likely to be thrown else loose some steering control

simultaneous braking system- a processor/chip somewhere on the bike can sense the pressure on the back and front brakes. If it goes above a certain allowance relative to the other brake, the brake with the higher pressure is relaxed by opening a value in the cervo for the brake fluid, and the other brake is increased till they balance -like ABS in a car

‘electronic fuel injection’- most cars are chipped meaning they have this little processor that regualtes the timing and the carbeurator(spelling?)

Timing has to do with the fuel going into the cyclinder and when the spark plug ignites the fuel

Older engines in cars would have used a vaccuum(Induction) in the cyclinder to suck in fuel from the carbeurtor when the value opened. This is not really economical as the fuel can come in as bigger droplets so meaning on combustion, all the fuel does not get burned.
With fuel injection, the petrol is sprayed in as a finer mist so getting burned more efficently giving more power, and less pollution. The carbeuretor can also be better controlled also meaning you are getting the correct mix of 02 and Petrol for optimum combustion

Too much petrol and it doesn’t have enough 02 meaning petrol doesn’t burn correctly.

Some of my friends screwed with this chip and got amazing results; but Honda wouldn’t give them a new engine when they blew it out of the car


#13

Since everyone here’s talking about scooters. I am curious to know the answer to something I was asked by a motorbike shop. I got it roughly translated from my Chinese friend. The guy was talking about scooters and he wanted to know, which one I would prefer, a 2 storke or a 4 stroke.

My question, what’s a 2 and a 4 stroke. Has it to do with putting in 92 or 94 gasoline?
Which is more expensive and better to drive?


#14

The difference is the engine.

Cars use a four stroke engine. The term four stroke comes from the number of times the cylinder goes up and down for the engine to burn the petrol and empty the engine of the smoke - Induction, Compression, Ignition and Exhaust.

This means however when you increase the speed of the engine, the engine has to work harder and has more difficulty effectively completing all these strokes. This is ok though as allot of engines do not have to run quickly and only cruise at 3000-5000 Revs. 4 stroke engines will give out if you go over 8000-10000 for a prolonged time, cause of damage to the head of the engine.

2 strokes- here the oil that lubricates the moving held at the bottom of the engine. Since there is no head ( the thing that controls the valves that open and close to let the petrol in and the smoke out)the engine is lighter and smaller and can rev higher.

Along the sleeve of the cylinder there are two flaps. One to let the fuel mixture from the bottom of the engine in and the other to let the smoke out.
The result being that you half the number of strokes.
Induction and compression become one stroke and Ignition and Exhaust become one stroke adding to 2 strokes.

2 stroke engines run much faster, but are smoky, nosier, and they make this, clang clang clang sound!!!. They are commonly used in high performance bikes(TT racing), and you can drive them at higher revs and a little harder. You can also put this synthetic 2 stroke oil in, that burns at a higher temperature. It leaves this sweet smell behind and will give you better acceleration, you can be popping wheelies at the green lights!!!

Also for 2 strokes, power is given every 1 revolution of the shaft(the spinning bar that comes out of the engine) while with 4 strokes, it is 2 revolutions of the shaft. Cars overcome this by having 4 or 6 cyclinders, meaning the power to the shaft is more constant.

I think they are in the process of banning 2 strokes as they pollute the place pretty badly with a blue dirty smoke.
Better to get a 4 stroke bike!!

There are not really any two stroke bikes. What you buy is a bike with either a 2 or a 4 stroke engine. The size of the engine can vary between 50 and 1100CC and performance can vary greatly within 2 strokes depending on what way they are tuned.

92 95 98 has to do with the type of petrol. One is unleaded and the others have different octanes. The higher the octane the more power


#15

Still looking for my new scooter and just have a couple fo little questions if anyone knows.

Do you think you’d really notice the difference in speed/power on a 150CC over a 125CC. I particularly want starting speed so I can be first away at the lights and not have any other morons in front of me. I’m talking about 'not as big as majesty/apex/dink monstrosity bikes here

Why would a Japanese made bike be necessarily better than a Taiwanese model.

Does the digital ‘dashboard’ (like on the Force) offer any advantages other than looks and does it make it hard to repair?

Do you agreet hat a rear disc brake might actually make a bike less safe as it owuld be prone to skidding more?

Bri


#16

Still looking for my new scooter and just have a couple fo little questions if anyone knows.
Do you think you’d really notice the difference in speed/power on a 150CC over a 125CC. I particularly want starting speed so I can be first away at the lights and not have any other morons in front of me. I’m talking about 'not as big as majesty/apex/dink monstrosity bikes here

Its maringally faster and a newer engine will aid this. But it also comes down to the size of the bike and how much weight the engine has to pull

A 2 stroke will beat a 4 stroke with the same size engine off the line anytime. It depends on the tuning of the engine also. If you want accleration, go for a 2 stoke high performance bike, but they are usually noisy. A scooter is not built for that purpose, but cause of the small wheels, giving an apparent higher torque so the start off is better, but as you get up to about 40KPH, it is running on higher revs and looses the little kick most 4 strokes bikes get at 4000-5000rpm(optimum performance). A normal motorbike will catch up at this point, go up one more gear and overtake. You can keep the throttle opened full on your scooter to keep up but this will damage the engine over time. another trick is to cut off the exhaust pipe and take off the air intake. This will give you much more power as there is a restricter in the exhaust pipe and the intake slows down the air getting into the engine


Why would a Japanese made bike be necessarily better than a Taiwanese model.

Difference between Japenese and Taiwanese is Quality and Reliabilty. The Japanese led the world for years in production control and quality investigation. They also have much more resources for design and testing. Look at Mugen Honda, Yahamha, Toyota, and the Subaru Impreza WRC


Does the digital ‘dashboard’ (like on the Force) offer any advantages other than looks and does it make it hard to repair?

The digital dashboard should not fail. Its like any electronic device, such as a computer or an alarm clock. Its the display that is electronic. The speedometer is still a wire that goes to the front wheel and an inducer coverts the turns into a displacement in the speedometer box thingy.

I prefer the conventional one as you always get the pleasure out of watching the arm climb up and up through 20-30 -40 etc. Electronic speedomters look like a stopwatch, and like KITT from Knight Rider


Do you agreet hat a rear disc brake might actually make a bike less safe as it owuld be prone to skidding more

Mine skids sometimes but i think it comes down to learning how much to pull the lever. Overall it stops much quicker than a drum brake.


#17
quote:
Originally posted by Bu Lai En: Do you agree that a rear disc brake might actually make a bike less safe as it would be prone to skidding more?
Disc brakes are [b]always[/b] more desirable than drum brakes. The only reason some riders don't skid when they jam on the drum brakes is that the brakes are too soft, and are incapable of locking up. They would also be incapable of any real braking power. Theoretically, disc brakes could be locked up, but you wouldn't want to do that unless you wanted to dump your bike, which incidentally is always a safer manoeuvre than hitting a stationary object. This can be done by locking up the rear brake. I've done it before (on purpose), and it wasn't so bad. A little road rash, and a scraped up scooter, but no real damage to my self or the bike. Locking up the front brake results in a different kind of wipeout, one which I would not like to try.

Bri, if you ever change your mind about the MaJESties, the 250cc version comes with ABS, which makes it impossible to lock up your brakes.

Regarding your other questions, Zhukov is bang on.


#18
quote[quote] but you wouldn't want to do that unless you wanted to dump your bike, which incidentally is always a safer manoeuvre than hitting a stationary object. This can be done by locking up the rear brake. I've done it before (on purpose), and it wasn't so bad. A little road rash, and a scraped up scooter, but no real damage to my self or the bike. [/quote]

Hmmm. The time I skidded and hit the road (doing 30 in the rain trying to avoid a car that pulled in front of me) I broke my foot real bad and am still having problems 6 months on. The time I hit the side of a taxi (doing 90 when it pulled in front of me) I got a couple of scrathes. So not always true. Also, if they cause you to skid, but don’t actually touch you, they’re not going to stop. If it happens again and I’m going slow and actually have the presence of mind, I’ll deliberately hit them rather than swerve and skid.

Thanks for your comments both of you.

Bri


#19

Bri, the key word is stationary, ie not moving. Before you go around deliberately hitting objects at any speed, do a little physics experiment with, say, a couple of hard-boiled eggs. Throw one against the wall. Roll the other one along the floor at the same speed. Inspect the damage to both. Then decide which is safer.


#20

Ha ha. I missed that key word. I’ve never had a problem with stationary objects though, it’s those damn moving objects (mostly taxis) that get me.

Bri