[quote=“Taverncaptain, in another thread,”]Dinner & Show NT $2,500 & 10% Service Charge
[/quote]Why don’t you say $2750 ? Because that’s how much it costs, not $2500. 
[quote=“Big Fluffy Matthew”][quote=“Taverncaptain”]Dinner & Show NT $2,500 & 10% Service Charge
[/quote]Why don’t you say $2750 ? Because that’s how much it costs, not $2500. [/quote]
Different representations of equal values, methinks. 
I prefer my bills in hex: $ABE
[quote=“NeonNoodle”][quote=“Big Fluffy Matthew”][quote=“Taverncaptain”]Dinner & Show NT $2,500 & 10% Service Charge
[/quote]Why don’t you say $2750 ? Because that’s how much it costs, not $2500. [/quote]
Different representations of equal values, methinks.
I prefer my bills in hex: $ABE[/quote]
You might wanna ask Abe first before you do that.
[quote=“Big Fluffy Matthew”][quote=“Taverncaptain”]Dinner & Show NT $2,500 & 10% Service Charge
[/quote]Why don’t you say $2750 ? Because that’s how much it costs, not $2500. [/quote]
Hear hear. How ridiculous. What about NT$800 & 244% service charge? And so on. What is the point of this “service charge”? It must be non-taxable or something. There is no way anyone still thinks that makes the meal look cheaper, and I’m sure the boss here’s not doing it for that reason. His target demographic does not give a monkey’s about NT$250, so what’s it all about. Must be tax. I think it’s that no more than 10% of F&B revenue can be set off against hat purchases as long as it is called a “service charge” and recorded as a debit against Steak Tartares Payable. Or something.
The menu looks fantastic. Lovely traditional food with Jazz. Very tempting.
The added service charge is just common practice in Taiwan. I personally do not like it either but that is how pricing is generally done in Taiwan. Know it is not a cheap evening we are arranging for but the bands we have a guarantee for outstanding entertainment and for sure the food, cocktails and Moet Chandon Champagne make it a great deal.
Sorry, but that’s a bit lame. You’re not exactly differentiating yourself from the morass of Taiwanese eateries then are you? Come on, you know a “service charge” in a restaurant is a logical nonsense. You also know your customers don’t like it. Just don’t do it. Bob Marshall at Carnegies doesn’t do it, and when you go in there and it says something costs so much, then that’s what it costs. All that 10% nonsense does is create the vague perception on the part of customers that you might reckon they are stupid enough to think the cost is only NT$2,500, and to ensure that the tips to the staff are miniscule. It’s an intellectual fraud and it’s beneath a man of your intelligence and an establishment like Capone’s. And yes I have eaten in Capone’s and paid the service charge (of course) and I look forward to going back now that it is under new management and has such an enticing menu. But please dump ridiculous “service charge”. In a classy joint like this (sorry, just finished a James Ellroy novel) the customer likes to think the service is everything, not a ten percent tack-on at the end. I feel like some Taiwanese waiter is going to tell me at the end of the night “Yeah but you only paid NT$250 for the service! What d’ya expect?!”
Do hear what you are saying is something we might review in the future and of course in all, certainly the reason for it being applied widely (go to the Hyatt, Ruth Chris, Dan Ryan’s, etc.) is to make the price not too high and then add 10%. Point is that even we do say i.e. a dish costs 525 including service charge, customers ask if there is a service charge on top of it or think well that is more expensive. I do fully share your opinion on the subject personally but as said, following general practice. At the end, the customer (actually prefer to call them guests) should get a great meal, service and entertainment for a reasonable price regardles how it is broken down.
Usually the 10% isn’t worth it. Ya still get service that is sub-par.
I’d tip 5 cdn back home and get much better service on average than I would here.
BTW: as far as I am aware, the foreign establishments are already expensive as it is. Why not leave it up to the patron to tip?
Funny, when I go to the Hyatt and order a bottle of wine that is 300% above market price, it doesn’t make me feel that they’re tempering the price with my interests in mind and then recouping some loses from the extra 10%. 
Not directed at you TC; I’ve always been satisfied with value for money at each of your establishments, 10% or not.
Sorry, but that’s a bit lame. You’re not exactly differentiating yourself from the morass of Taiwanese eateries then are you? Come on, you know a “service charge” in a restaurant is a logical nonsense. You also know your customers don’t like it. Just don’t do it. Bob Marshall at Carnegies doesn’t do it, and when you go in there and it says something costs so much, then that’s what it costs. All that 10% nonsense does is create the vague perception on the part of customers that you might reckon they are stupid enough to think the cost is only NT$2,500, and to ensure that the tips to the staff are miniscule. It’s an intellectual fraud and it’s beneath a man of your intelligence and an establishment like Capone’s. And yes I have eaten in Capone’s and paid the service charge (of course) and I look forward to going back now that it is under new management and has such an enticing menu. But please dump ridiculous “service charge”. In a classy joint like this (sorry, just finished a James Ellroy novel) the customer likes to think the service is everything, not a ten percent tack-on at the end. I feel like some Taiwanese waiter is going to tell me at the end of the night “Yeah but you only paid NT$250 for the service! What d’ya expect?!” [/quote]
Well said, Miranda! :bravo:
I completely agree with you.
TavernCaptain, please do consider these suggestions. If Carnegies can do it, why can’t the Tavern and Capone’s?
Instead of following what all the other places are doing, you can lead the way.
Just price, say, a buffet at NT$500, instead of NT$450 *plus 10 % service charge = NT$495.
I think anyone who is going to pay NT$450 won’t have a problem with paying NT$500.
Just be thankful it’s easy enough to work out the 10%.
In Singapore it is not generally stated as a percentage but as a “++”. I think it amounts to 15%.
I also think the 10% is a load of old crap, but in saying that I am sure any discerning diner knows how the game is played, and can easily work out the true cost of the meal without expending too many brain cells. At the end of the day, if the 10% charge was abolished, it would be absorbed in the cost of the item anyway = no difference.
To be fair to the Captain, this discussion about service charge is OT to the intent of the thread (which should be specifically about Capones), and perhaps should be split off as an independent thread.
I agree this should be split off as a service charge discussion. I don’t want to say anything further because I don’t want TC to think it is a criticism of him personally or his establishments.
Look at hotels in Indonesia: you have the 11% government tax plus a 10% service charge. Service charge in a hotel. I had a go at the GM of the Ritz Carlton there and he said the SC was so guests weren’t confused about tipping. Nonsense. You’re still going to tip people anyway, so it’s just a way of confusing guests into staying with you because they’re too busy to mess with this kind of nonsense. My calculation was $989 became $1,197 - a substantial difference. I now book through a website that quotes a final bill with all local charges and bullshit included. 
I just booked a flight from Sydney to NZ where the taxes, surcharges and departure fees etc cost more than the fare. (like 4000nt worth of fees :s )
[quote=“Truant”]Just be thankful it’s easy enough to work out the 10%.
In Singapore it is not generally stated as a percentage but as a “++”. I think it amounts to 15%.[/quote]
It’s not just the service charge but also tax, hence the double-plus.
I think in Malaysia it was 10% tax and 5% service charge.
A very good reason to just include the service charge in the amount quoted is that when you go out with friends and everyone is calculating their part of the bill, it’s so much easier. In most of Taiwan, most establishments (in general) do not have service charge and people will forget to add it when calculating their share.
It’s so much simpler that way.
And just use nice round numbers 
I don’t believe in service here. Frankly, I rather just take it up the ass once instead of over and over (Thanks to the Canadian government).
Don’t make us think after a large meal and even larger quantity of drinks.
[quote=“Rascal”][quote=“Truant”]Just be thankful it’s easy enough to work out the 10%.
In Singapore it is not generally stated as a percentage but as a “++”. I think it amounts to 15%.[/quote]
It’s not just the service charge but also tax, hence the double-plus.
I think in Malaysia it was 10% tax and 5% service charge.[/quote]
Try Quebec: General Sales Tax 7% 
Provincial Sales Tax 7.5%
Tips/Service !5-20%
The one thing about service charges there, though, is that it actually goes to the wait staff, rather than into the pocket of the proprietor like it does here.
I have just had an offline discussion about my statement above, which can be read to imply that those establishments that don’t charge their customers the 10% actually inflate the prices to cover it.
I was referring in fact to an assumption that any restaurants converting from the ‘+10%’ system to a ‘no service charge’ system would be inclined to do this.
However, it has be rightly pointed out to me that not all restaurants work on this theory. In actual fact, some have well established the model of a pure, honest ‘no service charge’ approach to set themselves, and their food apart from the rest.
My apologies for any implications made to establishments that take pride in their ‘no service charge’ policy, while maintaining reasonable, uninflated prices.
To many customers, this is appreciated and is often reciprocated by their repeated loyalty in dining at such places.
As I hae atated previously, the “service charge” is a load of crap. Up the price if need be, but don’t try to assuage your conscience by calling it a " service charge," Its a a damn addition to the bill, be honest and call it that.
Pesonally, I have refused to pay it, while delineating my TIP on my bill in establishments in other countries. When questioned about this, I have offered the alternative - accept my TIP on its line, or remove my tip and take my payment as is. My TIP has alwas been accepted.
I think this “service charge” is a remnant of past days. And should be treated as such.
Pay your staff a commensurate wage and they should accept gratuities due their service.
It’s an American thing originally, meaning 10% tip, but because in Taiwan nobody tips except some foreigners, and because our staff is underpaid we need to add the 10% service charge so they make a little more money and therefor want to stay on a while longer. Establishments can not include it for tax reason … if they did they would have a 10% gross sales figure, and they couldn’t pay the staff 10% black money (tips) … 
perhaps some establishments don’t even pay it to the staff and put it in their own pocket, meaning 10% black money in the bosses pocket … makes a difference of a Benz or Lexus per year … 
Oh, and never mind but the service is non excisting … or bad at the best, but anyway, pay up.
10% service charge = a rat f**king. :fume:
It pisses me off even more when there is no “service” when I pay the service charge.