Remember, guns don’t kill people, people kill people.
Having the right tools for the job makes it a helluva lot easier though.
[color=green]Mod note: The discussion is so broad that it has been split into three threads: The news event (V Tech shootings) in general and all about the shooter and victims (here); a thread for general gun control discussion, and what went procedurally wrong (i.e., why weren’t the police able to stop him earlier?). --DB, Open Mod[/color]
Blame the kid who shot them.
Precisely.
The blame always gets cast far and wide.
[quote]Sen. John McCain says the shooting rampage at Virginia Tech does not change his view that the Constitution guarantees everyone the right to carry a weapon.
“We have to look at what happened here, but it doesn’t change my views on the Second Amendment, except to make sure that these kinds of weapons don’t fall into the hands of bad people,” McCain said Monday in response to a question. [/quote]
I don’t doubt that there are legitimate uses for handguns, and I’m (surprise FredSmith) not against the 2nd Amendment.
But, that said, what is the government, the NRA, the gun people’s answer to how “these kinds of weapons don’t fall into the hands of bad people”.
I’ve definitely become jaded to this sort of incident. I read the headline and felt “how awful” but then went on with my life. Ten years ago, I think I would have given it a lot more thought.
I think that guns need keys. Preferablly a DNA match on the hand grip.
That won’t stop real criminals from buying guns without locks, but that would help prevent someone from grabbing another person’s gun and going on a rampage. It would also prevent people from being killed with their own weapon when someone breaks into their home. Unless they’re a really bad shot.
[quote=“Taiwanderer”]
Within my family & circle of friends & ex-employees,at LEAST 4 lives were saved because I was a legal owner of a firearm.[/quote]
And just think–if those 30+ dead people had been carrying guns in the first place, they would all be alive today!
[quote=“Flicka”][quote=“Taiwanderer”]
Within my family & circle of friends & ex-employees,at LEAST 4 lives were saved because I was a legal owner of a firearm.[/quote]
And just think–if those 30+ dead people had been carrying guns in the first place, they would all be alive today![/quote]
i ain’t sayin’ nothin’…already had a 2 page flame war binned by the mod today…
Well, you can keep it tame.
I think, the bear, the problem is that to Americans, the whole firearm issue is loaded with baggage and a long mind numbingly legalese struggle. It’s a symbol, like the stars and stripes. For us, for the most part, a firearm is an ugly brutal tool reminiscent of mostly poor rural places places we no longer care to live.
What I find weird about this, though, is the opening of the west and frontier history is often cited as lending the firearm undue prominence in the US, but as far as I see it, and excluding a civil war, for the most part rural society in Australia and NZ were equally frontier, gun-toting and murderous.
HG
[quote=“Huang Guang Chen”]For us, for the most part, a firearm is an ugly brutal tool reminiscent of mostly poor rural places places we no longer care to live.
[/quote]
So that’s why you live HK instead of Oz? 
So the answer to the gun killing is more guns?
Sweet, but somehow I’m reminded of this tune, I’m sure you know it.
HG
There was an old lady who swallowed a fly.
I dunno why she swallowed that fly,
Perhaps she’ll die.
There was an old lady who swallowed a spider,
That wriggled and jiggled and wiggled inside her.
She swallowed the spider to catch the fly.
But I dunno why she swallowed that fly -
Perhaps she’ll die.
There was an old lady who swallowed a bird;
How absurd, to swallow a bird!
She swallowed the bird to catch the spider
That wriggled and jiggled and wiggled inside her.
She swallowed the spider to catch the fly.
But I dunno why she swallowed that fly -
Perhaps she’ll die
There was an old lady who swallowed a cat.
Imagine that, she swallowed a cat.
She swallowed the cat to catch the bird …
She swallowed the bird to catch the spider
That wriggled and jiggled and wiggled inside her.
She swallowed the spider to catch the fly.
But I dunno why she swallowed that fly
Perhaps she’ll die
There was an old lady who swallowed a dog.
What a hog! To swallow a dog!
She swallowed the dog to catch the cat…
She swallowed the cat to catch the bird …
She swallowed the bird to catch the spider
That wriggled and jiggled and wiggled inside her.
She swallowed the spider to catch the fly.
But I dunno why she swallowed that fly
Perhaps she’ll die.
There was an old lady who swallowed a goat.
Just opened her throat and swallowed a goat!
She swallowed the goat to catch the dog …
She swallowed the dog to catch the cat.
She swallowed the cat to catch the bird …
She swallowed the bird to catch the spider
That wriggled and jiggled and wiggled inside her.
She swallowed the spider to catch the fly.
But I dunno why she swallowed that fly
Perhaps she’ll die.
There was an old lady who swallowed a cow.
I don’t know how she swallowed a cow!
She swallowed the cow to catch the goat… She swallowed the goat to catch the dog…
She swallowed the dog to catch the cat…
She swallowed the cat to catch the bird …
She swallowed the bird to catch the spider
That wriggled and jiggled and wiggled inside her.
She swallowed the spider to catch the fly.
But I dunno why she swallowed that fly
Perhaps she’ll die.
There was an old lady who swallowed a horse -
She’s dead, of course.
[quote]One law enforcement official said Cho’s backpack contained a receipt for a March purchase of a Glock 9 mm pistol. Cho held a green card, meaning he was a legal, permanent resident. That meant he was eligible to buy a handgun unless he had been convicted of a felony.
Roanoke Firearms owner John Markell said his shop sold the Glock and a box of practice ammo to Cho 36 days ago for $571.
“He was a nice, clean-cut college kid. We won’t sell a gun if we have any idea at all that a purchase is suspicious,” Markell said. [/quote]
2nd Amendment or not, what’s to be done?
[quote=“Jack Burton”][quote]One law enforcement official said Cho’s backpack contained a receipt for a March purchase of a Glock 9 mm pistol. Cho held a green card, meaning he was a legal, permanent resident. That meant he was eligible to buy a handgun unless he had been convicted of a felony.
Roanoke Firearms owner John Markell said his shop sold the Glock and a box of practice ammo to Cho 36 days ago for $571.
“He was a nice, clean-cut college kid. We won’t sell a gun if we have any idea at all that a purchase is suspicious,” Markell said. [/quote]
2nd Amendment or not, what’s to be done?[/quote]
Require a psychological test/background check for would-be gun buyers?
[quote=“Mother Theresa”][quote=“Jack Burton”][quote]One law enforcement official said Cho’s backpack contained a receipt for a March purchase of a Glock 9 mm pistol. Cho held a green card, meaning he was a legal, permanent resident. That meant he was eligible to buy a handgun unless he had been convicted of a felony.
Roanoke Firearms owner John Markell said his shop sold the Glock and a box of practice ammo to Cho 36 days ago for $571.
“He was a nice, clean-cut college kid. We won’t sell a gun if we have any idea at all that a purchase is suspicious,” Markell said. [/quote]
2nd Amendment or not, what’s to be done?[/quote]
Require a psychological test/background check for would-be gun buyers?[/quote]
They require learner’s permits for cars? how about for guns too. You could restrict them to ammo purchases ie blanks for a probationary period. haha.
How about, at a minimum, a safety class (this doesn’t prevent the above, but is still useful for preventing accidents)
And possibly some of them would have been shooting each other (or others) over some stupid argument previously. It’s easy to make the “guns are good for self-defense” argument but you have to consider the implications: more weapons around increases the risk of more people using them or causing more accidents and missuse.
There I thought there was a reason why some schools have security guards and metal detectors and won’t allow any kind of weapons …
And how often do they happen ‘everywhere’, compared to America?
Bloodthirsty people will use anything they can get their hands on to kill people. It’s not about guns per se. Take all the guns off the streets and they will poison Tylenol, put insecticide in water, start fires, drown children, commit mass suicide, gas subways, acid burn women, machete rivals to death, derail trains, blow up cafes and hijack planes to kill.
And bloodthirstiness is certainly NOT an American phenomenon. These people want to inflict their sufferings on the world? Fine. But it is our choice to let them have a profound negative effect on us.
Fuck these nutjobs. I’m happy and I’m going to work. 
And I’m going to do my extra special best to make everyone around have a great day!
Peace
It’s my right, to PARTY!
Go knock yourselves out, dudes!
[quote]Virginia Gun Giveaway to Go Ahead Despite Massacre
They are calling it the “Bloomberg Gun GiveAway”. On Thursday two gun shops in the state of Virginia will stage a prize draw. Anyone spending more than $100 in either Bob Moates’ stores or Old Dominion Guns and Tackle will be entered, and the first prize a free handgun or rifle worth $900.
The draw has been devised as an act of defiance against the mayor of New York, Michael Bloomberg, who is suing two Virginia gun shops, including Bob Moates, as well as 25 stores in other states, for allegedly selling guns too freely and thus fuelling violent crime. In a sting operation last year, Mr Bloomberg sent a team of undercover investigators into Bob Moates and other stores to expose how regulations on sales were being openly flouted.
Despite yesterday’s tragic events at Virginia Tech, a clerk at Bob Moates said the draw would still go ahead. It will underline the unbending adherence of many Virginians to the right to bear arms - the state has been ranked as the second easiest in the country in which to buy guns - in the face of renewed calls for tighter gun control. [/quote]
“This is my rifle that is my gun, ths one’s for killing and that one’s for fun.”
HG
news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070418/ap_ … world_view
an interesting article on gun laws, responses of other countries, and so forth.
Well, handguns are used for more than self defense. They’re also for target practice, and some folks just love going out to a shooting range and firing away. I’ve done it on various occasions myself. This is said without any intention to defend the sales to this disturbed individual, but rather just in the way of explanation. If you love to go out to the shooting range every weekend and fire off a few score rounds, it’s economical to buy the ammo in the hundreds. I used to practice marksmanship at a range, as did my roommates and brother (who placed fifth nationally and was captain of the West Point pistol team, woo hoo, go bro!), and the ammo for that needed to be in quantity. So the mindset framed in ‘self defense’ terms is a bit limited, although it’s certainly understandable that someone might phrase the question that way.
I’m trying to get my head around this. What percentage of the population are regular target shooter/hunters?
HG
I used to do a lot of target practice back home.It was fun.Loads of fun.Shooting is a sport for many people.Nothing wrong with that.The bonus is that it’s a sport that can aid in self preservation.But I do agree that closer tabs need to be kept on people such as the whacko that committed this heinous act.