Those 3000+ peaks

Travel Taiwan Travel
1

I am interested in doing some high peaks in Taiwan, yet have learned that a class A mountain permit is required, which has some rather stringent guidelines of a guide being necessary, and at least three people in the group. Does anyone know of a way around this (hiking illegaly?) or saying one of the people in your party is a “guide”. I am looking to climb the peaks as a long hard day trip, up at 5 AM done by 7 PM. Much of what I have read, describe the hikes as multi day trips, but with a light loud and my fitness level I am able to do a 30 mile day, 20 with lots of climbing at altitude.

This also leads me to my second question which is running in Taipei. I was looking to run some races in the month of August, but could not find any, as it seems there are none during such a hot month. Also, does anyone know aout finding a running club/training partner. I run for a college team in the states and train quite seriously. 50+ miles a week, pace 6:00 to 6:45 miles.

Thanks so much!

2

Having done 2 out of the 3 very high “famous” peaks, I would not really do it in one day if it was my first Taiwanese hiking adventure. You would end up making it a 2-3 day adventure, as most organized groups are far slower than you are.

I would not mind doing Jade mt in one day in summer when weather cooperates, as long as I am in a good group.

Groups can be arranged through a shop such as “Deng Shan You” on Zhongshan N rd near Taipei train station.

3

I tried to do Chilaishan from Hehuanshan in a one-day. Didn’t make it and ended up kind of wasted. I was pretty fit at the time.

4

[quote=“greenea1”]I am interested in doing some high peaks in Taiwan, yet have learned that a class A mountain permit is required, which has some rather stringent guidelines of a guide being necessary, and at least three people in the group. Does anyone know of a way around this (hiking illegaly?) or saying one of the people in your party is a “guide”. I am looking to climb the peaks as a long hard day trip, up at 5 AM done by 7 PM. Much of what I have read, describe the hikes as multi day trips, but with a light loud and my fitness level I am able to do a 30 mile day, 20 with lots of climbing at altitude.

This also leads me to my second question which is running in Taipei. I was looking to run some races in the month of August, but could not find any, as it seems there are none during such a hot month. Also, does anyone know aout finding a running club/training partner. I run for a college team in the states and train quite seriously. 50+ miles a week, pace 6:00 to 6:45 miles.

Thanks so much![/quote]

There are no more Class A permits. Yushan requires a mountain permit and a guide.The guide must be registered. You can’t just fob you’re friend off. :loco:

The group I was supposed to go up with last month was going to do it in a day but that was a very long day requiring some hiking in the dark. In any case, it seems as if you should be able to find a guide to do it in one day. Why you would want to is a question best left to yourself to answer.

If you attempt to do Yushan alone and without the required permit you may be arrested. The park’s people have set a daily limit for environmental reasons so please respect the rules.

Many other mountains, like Syueshan (snow mountain) and Kuanshan, which are also over 3,000 metres no longer require Class A permits. You just need to register with the local police.

That said, summer is not the best time for this kind of activity. One, it is brutally hot which means you won’t be traveling light but actually quite heavy with 3-4 litres of water. Two, the weather is unpredictable, with morning fog and afternoon thundershowers and typhoons. If you get caught up top in a shower and a fog without proper clothing (again, because you are travelling light) you will be in big trouble).

If you talk to some experienced mountaineers they will tell you that conditins in Taiwan are not like back home. It is much rougher and unpredictable. If you are going to the high mountains by yourself then go prepared, which means taking the proper clothing and supplies in case you get stuck. No matter how fit you are you can’t make good time if the trail is slick from rain or if there is fog or 37 degree weather.

As for running, you shouldn’t be doing much of it in this weather. If fact my jogging manual recommends that you don’t jog if the temperature and humidity combined are over 150. So, a day like today with 95 degree weather and about 80% humidity is out for any prolonged exercise especially if you are a newbie. Your fitness level will not prevent you from getting heatstroke.

Welcome to Taiwan.

5

Lat time I went to climb jade mtn, I had to turn around due to very poor weather - I would do it with a very good experienced group, but sneaking in is not a good idea. There’s a checkpoint and they will at times check things thoroughly.

I have met Taiwanese who did it in one day - they set out at 3 AM though, as it’s more like a 16 hour hike than a 12 hour one.

they had a permit and all the gear needed.

6

[quote=“Mr He”]Lat time I went to climb jade mtn, I had to turn around due to very poor weather - I would do it with a very good experienced group, but sneaking in is not a good idea. There’s a checkpoint and they will at times check things thoroughly.

I have met Taiwanese who did it in one day - they set out at 3 AM though, as it’s more like a 16 hour hike than a 12 hour one.

they had a permit and all the gear needed.[/quote]

Good point Mr He. These are really long hikes so you shouldn’t be out there alone, without proper equipment, for that many hours.

7

I would not mind trying for Jade Mountain in one day, if I had the following with me:

Equipment suitable for an overnight stay, most of which would be dopped at Paiyun just in case. That would include food, sleeping bag, all weather gear a change of clothes and the like.

Water - but then again I would boil some at Paiyun or clean it with micropur, so 3-4 liters max would be what I would be carrying.

2-3 people intent to do the same.

Great weather, preferably setting off in October or November.

The courage to admit failure and turn around if something went wrong.

8

My spouse did a 3250meter climb 3 weeks ago in one day…Ping feng Shan.

They started the trek at 4am, hiked all morning, reached the summit at noon, hiked back out and did the last 3 hours in the dark. Didn’t sound like much fun to me and she was wiped out for 2 weeks straight afterwards.

The climb started at 2500meters, dropped to 1700, up to 1900, down again to 1700, around the base of the moutain a few times with various elevation changes and then up to 3250 and the summit.

2 in her group didn’t make it, and had to camp overnight.

Why the rush everywhere? It’s not just for climbing, but for damn near everything that you’d want to stop for and admire it’s beauty. When I go diving with the locals it’s the same thing…An underwater marathon.

What’s the point? :idunno:

9

MJB, that climb sounds a fair bit harder than the jade Mountain one.

10

[quote=“Muzha Man”]

There are no more Class A permits. Yushan requires a mountain permit and a guide.The guide must be registered. You can’t just fob you’re friend off. :loco:

The group I was supposed to go up with last month was going to do it in a day but that was a very long day requiring some hiking in the dark. In any case, it seems as if you should be able to find a guide to do it in one day. Why you would want to is a question best left to yourself to answer.

If you attempt to do Yushan alone and without the required permit you may be arrested. The park’s people have set a daily limit for environmental reasons so please respect the rules.

Many other mountains, like Syueshan (snow mountain) and Kuanshan, which are also over 3,000 metres no longer require Class A permits. You just need to register with the local police.

That said, summer is not the best time for this kind of activity. One, it is brutally hot which means you won’t be traveling light but actually quite heavy with 3-4 litres of water. Two, the weather is unpredictable, with morning fog and afternoon thundershowers and typhoons. If you get caught up top in a shower and a fog without proper clothing (again, because you are travelling light) you will be in big trouble).

If you talk to some experienced mountaineers they will tell you that conditins in Taiwan are not like back home. It is much rougher and unpredictable. If you are going to the high mountains by yourself then go prepared, which means taking the proper clothing and supplies in case you get stuck. No matter how fit you are you can’t make good time if the trail is slick from rain or if there is fog or 37 degree weather.

As for running, you shouldn’t be doing much of it in this weather. If fact my jogging manual recommends that you don’t jog if the temperature and humidity combined are over 150. So, a day like today with 95 degree weather and about 80% humidity is out for any prolonged exercise especially if you are a newbie. Your fitness level will not prevent you from getting heatstroke.

Welcome to Taiwan.[/quote]

The two mountains that you mentioned, are they in the same park as Jade mountain? Also, are they the only peaks in Taiwan that are over 3000 and a permit is not requred for, or are there many others?

As far as going with a group and guide on a multi-day trip, what is my best bet as far as hooking up with a group? Go through one of the outdoor shops or throught this forum?

You words are certainly sobering. I must be careful not to be overconfident and get myself in a bind, when I really do not know conditions in Taiwan well at all, compared to the states.

11

They aren’t in Yushan. And yes, most mountains don’t require special permits anymore. Some require that you check in with local police, but that is more in case you go missing.

There are many mountains, like Syueshan (Snow Mountain) which people climb alone. But they bring proper supplies for a few days and they usually stay in the established mountain huts.

I have a question. Do you only want to climb the high mountains? There are lots of grueling long trails in the lower mountains. Right around taipei there are several trails around 20km or longer. Since the trails go up and down over hill and dale they are an extremely good workout. The 25km trail from Beitou to the Palace Museum in Shilin would be a hell of a hike for one day. I did half in one day and that was 6 grueling hours.

12

[quote=“Muzha Man”]

As for running, you shouldn’t be doing much of it in this weather. If fact my jogging manual recommends that you don’t jog if the temperature and humidity combined are over 150. So, a day like today with 95 degree weather and about 80% humidity is out for any prolonged exercise especially if you are a newbie. Your fitness level will not prevent you from getting heatstroke.

Welcome to Taiwan.[/quote]

Im not sure you even want to jog at all given how HOT it is in Taiwan right now… The military has strict guidelines about outdoor drills. Take the tempature (in C) and the humidity (in %), divide the humidity by 10, then add the 2 numbers together. If it exceeds 40, no outdoor drills period. If it exceeds 35 but not 40, then outdoor drills is allowed but with reduced clothing and under shade. There had been alot of cases where people get heatstroke from drills because of lots of clothing (and gears) and the HOT weather in Taiwan so they are real cautious (some units arent as careful as they should be and pays the price…) If you want to train running I’d do it either early morning (where its not as hot) or do it in an AC’ed gym on a threadmill… Remember if you do get a heatstroke and dont get help within minutes you will literally cook to death.

13

Sure, no problem. Go climb 3416 meter Hehuanshan, in Nantou County. I just did it on Sunday and I’ve got a whole new appreciation for Taiwan. The island is not all ugly and polluted; there are beautiful mountains with clean air and unspoiled scenery. :slight_smile:

I realize Hehuanshan may not be quite what you had in mind. It’s not a full-day hike. From the trailhead it took us about 2 hours round trip, with me pushing our baby in her stroller up the steep road to the summit (I’m sure very few people do that, but without a baby it’s no big deal). So, it’s not a hardcore trek, but it’s still a great adventure.

We arrived the day before and played around at the nearby ChingChing farm, which is touristy, but is still very nice: vast mountainside sheep pastures where you can stroll and enjoy the great panoramic views and if you have kids they’ll love feeding the sheep (they sell sheep food there) and playing on the cool Outward Bound-type obstacle course structures. There are lots of hotels in that area with great views of the mountains and farms, as it’s a big tourist attraction, but it’s still a terrific escape from Taipei.

The next morning we drove another 45 minutes or so up to Hehuanshan. Saw a few big bike riders who made the trek, even a few bicyclists ( :bravo: ) and lots of cars. But most people don’t get out and hike to the top. If you do go, put on lots of sunscreen, as the sun is extremely bright up there and it’s easy to get burned. And before you head back down the mountains, don’t forget to buy a box of the fabulous mountain peaches. Verrrry expensive but worth it.

I’d love to climb Chilaishan or some other peak in that area. I told my wife, next time we’re staying the first night at the long red-roofed hostels just over the top of Hehuanshan (on the Hualien side) and camping the second night in the mountains, perhaps en route to Chilaishan. Not camping that second night because I’m wimpy and can’t make it one day, but because I’d rather be camping out there then hurrying back to Taipei.

For anyone who’s lived in Taipei or another ugly city of Taiwan for several years and hasn’t yet gotten out into the mountains, like me. . . JUST DO IT!!! It’s very nice up there.

14

Great to see another convert. But MT, you don’t need to travel so far to see beautiful scenery and enjoy fresh air. It’s much closer to town.

That said, I hope you took some precautions before heading up the mountain with your child. In other words, you had a rainjacket, warm clothing, water, sunscreen, and some food. Yes, it’s a short hike but fogs roll into that area quickly, and thickly. You can easily get stranded, wet, cold, and find yourself in big trouble.

Why not head out with the hiking club one weekend and see some of the beautiful spots we get to usualy within half an hour of the city?

15

Thanks Muzha Man. I’m not a recent convert to mountain climbing. I’ve done lots of hiking in the US and the Himalayas, but just hadn’t gotten out into Taiwan’s mountains yet (aside from Yamingshan, the animal peaks in Taipei, etc.).

Taiwan’s big peaks have long pulled at me but (a) I’ve felt too busy between work and family, (b) I don’t like the idea of a long drive in Taiwan (in addition to the periodic trips to the inlaws in Chiayi), and (c) I’m put off by all the talk of permits and guides. I’ve always just set off into the mountains with no more preparation than buying a map, talking it over with the guys at the outdoor store, and packing my bag.

A few years back I did the 3-week Annapurna Circuit in Nepal, climbing to almost 6,000 meters without a guide or porter (maybe 2/3 of the people I met along the way did likewise). That’s a dangerous climb, people die up there from altitude and exposure and one needs to use extreme care (which I did). So I’ve been sceptical about the need for a guide in Taiwan. But I’ve seen people like Sandman and yourself, who seem to know such things, insist that even for experienced mountaineers one would be foolish not to use a guide in Taiwan. Strange that Taiwan’s peaks would be more hazardous than the Himalayas, but you guys seem to know your stuff, so against strong hesitation, I guess I believe it.

As for joining up with the forumosa hiking club, I’ve been reading those posts from time to time, getting ready for a lull in my life so I can join you (though I don’t have either a thong or a bikini). So, I’ll see you out there soon. Thanks.

16

Surely I didn’t say that, did I? Oh well, even if I did, I wasn’t intending to include experienced mountaineers, cuz most here aren’t. I’d say if you’ve done something like the Annapurna circuit solo without mishap you’d be fine – probably. Otherwise, unless you’re very confident in your ability to self-rescue and navigate, a guide would be best, especially for some of the more remote peaks that require a long walk-in.

On another note, I MIGHT be organizing something soon with Makalu Gau (the bloke who survived a night in Everest’s Death Zone in 1996). He’s a very nice guy indeed and has asked if me and the wife want to climb something pretty with him. If it comes off it will be way cool – a strictly non-tourist route ascent with a friend of his who is a VERY famous American climber. I’ll post nearer the time if it will be possible to make it a slightly bigger party.

17

Actually I never said anything about experienced climbers either. Mostly I have warned people not to just go off by themselves into the woods they are unfamiliar with especially without any preparation or equipment in case things go wrong. Remember the guy a few months ago who wanted to climb Yushan solo in a day and wanted to keep his weight down so planned to only carry a light pack? That’s the kind of dude we’re trying to warn. If an experienced hiker wants to go up solo, but will have a tent, food, and the proper clothing for the conditions, then I’d say have fun for the most part, though as Sandman said, a gudie is best for areas you don’t know and for the safety in numbers factor.

18

Sorry guys. I didn’t mean to misquote you.

Anyway, the point may be somewhat moot for me as I’m unlikely to climb rugged peaks hauling along an 18-month old child, though my first peak in Taiwan – Hehuanshan – has inspired me. In fact, it got me researching baby carriers like this

so maybe the whole family can go backpacking together (assuming my wife can carry her fair share). Either that or leave the child behind.

Sandman, your trip sounds great. I hope it goes as planned.