Trying to take a wheel off yesterday I noticed what looks like a bead of weld on the conical face of one of the wheel (lug) nuts.
Due (l assume) to being tightened onto the wheel, with consequent wear and galling, it forms an oblate semi-speroid dimple on the cone surface.
Don’t remember noticing it before, but I’m not certain I’ve had that wheel off. Can’t remember seeing anything similar on any other car either.
I’m inclined to file it off, but I wonder why its there in the first place. Any suggestions?
I suppose it might have a “locking” effect. It seems unlikely to be accidental.
Coincidentally AFAIK, the wheel seems to be stuck (rusted?) on, which I don’t remember happening before either, though I’ve had it happen to brake disks.
I’ll have another look at it tommorrow, weather permitting. Perhaps I just need a bigger hammer.
Get a can of brake cleaner and some Liquid Wrench or if you can’t find that, WD40. Clean the crap out of this area it with the brake cleaner and paper towels so you can see what’s actually going on. If it is in fact a tack weld then you done got yourself a previous owner’s kludge. If it’s not just hit it with an impact or get a big enough breaker bar and it should come right off. This is a wheel lug nut we’re talking about, not an exhaust stud nut or something.
Lug nuts are generally simple to replace. You simply hammer them backwards and they pop out. You then pop your new one in from behind and then tighten a new nut onto it with some spacers in between or use the wheel instead. This is just to pull the lug into its seat. You can then rebuild the assembly.
As far as your wheel being stuck on, this is normal corrosion build up between the hub and inner wheel. You should rub this corrosion off both mating surfaces with some Emery paper and WD40. You should then put a slight layer of grease, preferably brake grease onto the hub area which mates with the wheel. This should reduce and further chance of sticking again in the future. Also use a slight amount of brake grease on your wheel nuts before tightening. Any low melting point grease will generally fly off and become very messy at high temperature so try to use specific grease wherever possible. Brake grease is generally either copper or alluminium compound
I got the nuts off OK, using a couple of bits of steel pipe as breaker-bar lever extensions.
I didn’t mean to imply the wheel nut was welded on, just that one of them had what looked like a bead of weld on its conical mating surface, which I thought strange.
Perhaps I could have been clearer, but I’ve lost/mislaid my camera accessories so couldn’t upload a picture.
Don’t have my club hammer to hand, so the wheels still on. Don’t have any brake grease either, but I’ll give the mating surfaces a clean when/if I get it off.
Still unclear as to the actual issue. Can you shoot a pic with your phone and link it? That should suffice. If it is a little ball there is a possibility that it’s actually a rolled up shard of thread, in which case it makes sense to at least replace the nut and if there is any visible damage on the lug, the lug itself.
As sulavaca pointed out, if the lugs need replacement, they should press or hammer or press right out.
If they are studs (ie: threaded in rather than press in) and are being tough, heating the area with a propane torch (MAAP is OK if you are careful but not OxyAcetelene unless you are extremely careful) and melting wax into the interface will help. You can use almost any wax, but there is also a specific wax that is used for exhaust manifold studs that can also help with a stuck wheel stud or lug. You can also use PB Blaster or Liquid Wrench if you don’t have a torch.
Interesting. Didn’t know about the melted wax trick. I didn’t see any damage to the studs, though, so I’m not sure I’ll need it, though I’ll have a more carefull look, with a mirror, later.
I’m not sure there is an issue. I just thought the “bead” (which is what it looks like) was odd, and I thought I’d canvas expert opinion before I tried grinding it off.
I don’t think its a rolled-up thread fragment. Looks too substantial.
I’ll pocket the pimpled nut and smooth one for comparison, and see if my gf fancies taking a picture of them (ooer Mrs)
Bit cold and nasty today so I’ll wait for better weather for further fiddling, and maybe do the tappets at the same time.(I’m clearly getting soft, given that I’ve lain under cars with snow around my ears back in the Old Country)
Don’t do that, just replace the lug nut. They’re really cheap and are not a place you generally want to do anything that might keep them from seating correctly.
Camera (Canon IXUS 115) is a minimal point-and-shoot. It has a macro function but no manual focus AFAIK. The auto-focus seems to “hunt” in macro mode and , if its focused on anything when I take the picture, its never the point of interest.
I would agree with this, assuming there is also no damage to the wheel rim and stud. It doesn’t seem like a biggie at this point from the images I have seen.
To be honest, and not to sound disrespectful, as I know many of my customers sometimes worry about all kinds of things, and especially if they are not mechanically minded, but this kind of issue is really a non issue and offers little or nothing to worry about if this is the extent of it.
If there are no other components affected, then simply change the nut.
On another note here, and I could be wrong as I can’t see clearly with no focus on the target in the picture, but that doesn’t appear to be weld from my perspective. From here it looks to be a transparent, or translucent bulge. If so, then that could simply be resin or some kind of glue. Either way, it still shouldn’t be an issue.
From your picture, that looks like a narrow taper, possibly a 19mm nut. I’m guessing the car is a small car, and likely Japanese, less likely Korean. I imagine its quite an old car from the size of the nut and wear to the nut surface. I also imagine its been quite a long time since that nut has been removed judging from the corrosion to the side surface, and the fact you mentioned the wheels were difficult to remove.
If I am right at all, then I would suggest you also remove the rear wheel drums [as its likely to have them] and inspect the rear brakes. You will possibly need to do some cleaning and adjustment back there. I would also strongly suggest you remove the rear shoes and clean the backing plates, and lubricate those backing plates with brake grease. You can also double check your handbrake cables and levers at the same time. If I am right so far, then I can give you further pointers on what to look out for.
I would agree with this, assuming their is also no damage to the wheel rim and stud. It doesn’t seem like a biggie at this point from the images I have seen.
To be honest, and not to sound disrespectful, as I know many of my customers sometimes worry about all kinds of things, and especially if they are not mechanically minded, but this kind of issue is really a non issue and offers little or nothing to worry about if this is the extent of it.
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Fair enough. Just thought it was strange. I’m pretty sure its weld.
Wheel wouldn’t budge hit with a club hammer or levered. Ended up driving over a speed bump with the lug nuts finger-tight.
That budged it, though there might have been some minor damage to the threads.
Dont have any brake grease. AFAIK I’ve only seen it for sale here in big tins containing 500,000 years supply, presumably because they’re intended for pros.
I did my sunflower oil/beercan-in-a-drill-chuck thing on the hub, and then a cats-cradle of PTFE plumbers tape around the studs, and a layer of aluminium foil on the wheel, to hopefully reduce the chance of it sticking again.
I suppose its possible this’ll reduce lateral friction and cause extra load/wear on the studs.
If my wheel comes off, and I survive, I’ll let y’all know.
I’ll need some brake grease (Coppaslip is the make I know) before I do the back brakes (even I’m not too comfortable improvising in there) so if I can’t find an alternative I’ll have to buy one of the huge tins.
I guarantee almost nowhere is professional enough to supply this. It took me quite some time to find an industrial supplier for our workshop and as far as I know we are the only workshop which uses it on all brake strips and services to properly keep them lubricated and relatively free from corrosion. We also, always add it to drum-wheel mating surfaces to help prevent the situation you have suffered.
[quote=“sulavaca”]You will need to ask around for 消音油
I guarantee almost nowhere is professional enough to supply this. It took me quite some time to find an industrial supplier for our workshop and as far as I know we are the only workshop which uses it on all brake strips and services to properly keep them lubricated and relatively free from corrosion. We also, always add it to drum-wheel mating surfaces to help prevent the situation you have suffered.[/quote]
gf found this. Not Coppaslip but seems to be for the same application, and the quantity (though still a few thousand years supply for me) isn’t too huge.
Well done.
Now you need to use some emery paper and a wire brush to clean your drum-wheel mating surfaces before applying it.
For drums, you should remove your rear brake shoes, rub, down and clean the mating surfaces, and then apply the grease. For calipers, you need to remove the pads, rub down and clean the pad metal edges as well as caliper fixings, then apply the grease.
You can also add a little grease to the wheel nut studs before screwing the nuts back on.
I thought she’d located some in Taiwan ( as she has in the past for other relatively obscure items) but it turns out that’s an Amazon item and fairly pricy once shipped.
Nice of her to look though, and it’d do at a pinch.
I thought she’d located some in Taiwan ( as she has in the past for other relatively obscure items) but it turns out that’s an Amazon item and fairly pricy once shipped.
Nice of her to look though, and it’d do at a pinch.[/quote]
If you really need to purchase some and if you are in Taipei, I can ask my colleague to order some for you in his next order, which typically goes in once a month. As I said, it’s a very difficult thing to obtain typically and I’d be surprised if you come across it easily. If you do, then I’d be very happy to learn where you get yours from just in case it’s more local to us. We order ours from an oil supplier. They order it especially for us from their foreign supplier. According to our Agip Rep., we are the only purchaser of this product he knows of.
I have seen one other specialist garage use very small tubes of this, which sometimes come with certain brake pad brands, but that’s all.
It’s frustrating I know, as brake grease is as common as toothpaste back in the U.K. Taiwan just isn’t that professional I’m afraid.
The same goes for LM grease which we use for C.V. joints. It’s not simple to order as almost every garage and supplier in Taiwan will insist that HM grease does exactly the same job. Which obviously it doesn’t.
Honestly, you have to have a lot of patience when sourcing some of the most basic stuff in Taiwan. So good luck!
Found some on the shelf in Kaoshiung. Looks like the real thing. 450NT, IIRC, for 500g, which is quite a lot more than I need.
Mr S, if you are interested in this as a possible supply source I can find out the address and phone number, which I don’t currently know, though of course I know where the place is. Long way from Taipei though, and probably not worth messing with if you’ve got an established supply.
The rust on the tin rim suggests it doesnt exactly leap off the shelves
