this is a question related to taiwan’s military service policy for any who knows anything about how this works.
i was born in taiwan and have a cdn passport and a tw passport. i entered tw with my tw passport. i have yet to reclaim my tw citizenship. as an overseas chinese, i believe the rule is that you have to leave the island every four months. does this apply if you do not reclaim your tw citizenship? if you overstay your four-month window and try to leave taiwan, will you be detained and forced to put in 2 yrs of service? Also, if anybody knows how the military tracks people down to enlist them, please let me know as i am looking to find any way out of this.
i am trying my best to avoid military service at all cost and am looking to know what my options are.
quote:Originally posted by murphy:
[b]i was born in taiwan and have a cdn passport and a tw passport. i entered tw with my tw passport. i have yet to reclaim my tw citizenship. [/b]
You can have an ROC passport without ROC citizenship?
What Murphy is actually referring to is that he has an ROC passport but does not have an ROC ID card.
The ROC has something of a dual citizenship system, depending on whether or not the citizen in question has “Household Registration” in the ROC area.
Those with “Household Registration” in the ROC area obtain an ID card, those without such registration do not. Without an ID card, a citizen’s rights to live in the ROC are severely restricted. Full details on relevant regulations (most of which violate the ROC Constitution) may be found in the Immigration Law.
Note: Foreigners cannot obtain “Household Registration,” although an ARC may be used as proof of “Residency Registration.”
at this point, i have a taiwan ID number but no ID card. I am not sure but i think the policy is that if you do not have the card, you are not officially a citizen (correct me if i am wrong).
I have a Taiwanese friend who is starving himself to death, so that he won’t have to go to military. I don’t really think this is a healthy way to get out of it, but what ever we try, we can’t talk him out of it…
What guys do in my country is to use psychological reasons, let’s say unable to use a gun, claustrophobia or the like. It usually works…
What an extraordinarily stupid idea. He’s probably causing health problems for the rest of his life so he can make a little more money for two years’ time. Just do the service and get on with your life, I say. If you’re an ABC/CBC/whatever and you can’t stomach the service, then maybe you should reconsider your plans to live here and reap all the benefits of citizenship.
[quote=“mesheel”]I have a Taiwanese friend who is starving himself to death, so that he won’t have to go to military. I don’t really think this is a healthy way to get out of it, but what ever we try, we can’t talk him out of it…[/quote]maybe safer than serving in the army. Don’t 500 people die every year in the Taiwanese armed forces ? During peacetime…
BFM:
This reminds me of the time I was down at Tainan Airport (which was a purely military base in 1965) and I was watching some ROC’s run the obstacle course. A young recruit was trying to leap up and crawl over a high log obstacle. He couldn’t do it so the Noncom in charge would beat the shit out of him and then make him try it again. Of course the recruit still could’t do it so the nomcom would smack him around some more and send him back to try it again. After the third time I was extremely relieved that the people I was with finished their business and we could leave. To this day I wonder if that poor kid survived without any major disability. PS: We were strictly enjoined from interfering with anything. In those days the military run things, NO IFS, ANDS, OR BUTS.
[quote=“Guest”]This is a question related to Taiwan’s military service policy for any who knows anything about how this works.
I was born in Taiwan and have a Canadian passport and a Taiwan passport. i entered tw with my tw passport. I have yet to reclaim my Taiwan citizenship . . . . . [/quote]
A passport is internationally accepted as proof of citizenship. There is no such procedure as “reclaiming citizenship” for a person who is already a citizen.
Please read the ROC Constitution. All nationals/citizens of the ROC are fully equal.
As a Chinese, of course your military service requirement is not something to be avoided. It is your duty, and should be accepted with honor.
I hope that this message answers your questions. In summary, please refer to the ROC Constitution. Your objection to serving in the military is without legal basis (according to the ROC Constitution) . . . . . unless of course you take the point of view that the sovereignty of Formosa and the Pescadores was never transferred to the ROC, and hence under international law, the ROC’s effective control over these areas is purely military occupation, in which the implementation of mandatory military conscription policies over the local populace is in violation of the Geneva and Hague Conventions.
What exactly is your point of view? Is the ROC in Taiwan a “legal government” internationally speaking), or not?
As a Chinese, of course your military service requirement is not something to be avoided. It is your duty, and should be accepted with honor.[/quote]
Actually, that’s not quite accurate. Taiwan currently allows for conscientious objectors and others who would prefer not to serve in the military to make other contributions in terms of national serivce. On the other hand, if it is not military service you are objecting to, but service in the name of your country in any way shape or form, , than that is another issue entirely, and perhaps you need to reconsider your allegiances.
Male Taiwan citizens who are not in “Overseas Chinese” status are liable for military service if they return to Taiwan between the ages of 18 and 40. Those with “Overseas Chinese” status are also subject to military service UNLESS they departed Taiwan before age 15 and (1) never returned for a visit of more than four months and (2) shorter visits do not total more than one year. Individuals who may be affected by this law should contact the nearest TECO/TECRO office for details. Dual nationals currently in Taiwan can contact the Overseas Chinese Affairs Commission at 02-3343-2600 or write them at 15F, #5 Hsu Chou St., Taipei for more information.
Possession of U.S. citizenship does not prevent Taiwan citizens from being subject to this law. In general, if an individual is considered to be a Taiwan citizen at birth, he retains that status even after acquiring U.S. citizenship. Under Taiwan law, he may not renounce his Taiwan citizenship until after age 40.
It should be noted that such laws are not unique to Taiwan. South Korea, Greece, and Israel, for example, have similar laws that subject returning dual nationals to compulsory military service. The United States Government cannot protect dual nationals from compulsory military service.
I didn’t know that you have to be above 40 to renounce your Taiwanese citizenship…
It’s interesting that they have such a law since foreigners are requested to renounce their citizenship in order to obtain a Taiwanese one.
Other countries with similar law as Taiwan would not be able to immigrate here unless they are above 40… Why do Taiwan want to get older immigrants? Isn’t it better to get them young so they can pay more taxes?
The ‘must be 40 to remounce Taiwanese citizenship’ rule is obviously to stop dual citizenship holders such as ABC’s renouncing their ROC citizenship, staying in Taiwan as a foreigner and thus avoiding military service. Interesting.
I wonder if I came from country X which says ‘citizens of X cannot renounce their citizenship beofre 40’ and wanted to get a Taiwan passport, would the Taiwan government let me have it, or require me to do the impossible.
Or to put it another way, someone form a country with exactly the same laws as Taiwan would be unable to obtain Taiwanese citizenship. Typical.
Sure Swedes can renounce their citizenship, however they don’t allow a former Swede to be stateless. If the new country where you want to immigrate requires you to be naturalized the Swedish government can make a paper stating that this person will be naturalized as soon as the new citizenship is approved.
It’s doubtful that Taiwan approves this, since Poagoa had to go to H.K. for six months to clear the red tape to re-enter Taiwan once he got naturalized.
However… sneaky as I am… if the Taiwan government would accept a paper from the Swedish gov saying that they would naturalize me ASAP I get my Taiwanese citizenship. Then when I get it (being Taiwanese) cancel my termination since the Taiwan law grants dual passports for Taiwanese citizens.
This is probably the reason why they would ask us to naturalize first, then apply…
I think British nationality law would allow you to temporarily give it up to claim local nationality. Then you can rescind the cancelation of your citizenship and reclaim your British nationality, too. However, consult a lawyer if you are interested in doing this! And I hear you can only do it once!
You can do it mor ethan once, but only the first are you guaranteed to be allowed to rexclaim British nationality, each subsequent time would be up to the discretion of the Home Ministry.
