Boycott 85°C?

In the end, after some consideration, I’ve come to a similar conclusion. What good does a boycott of a Taiwanese business accomplish? Lost jobs. Minimum wage jobs, but much needed jobs. Closed stores in Taiwan, lost investments by franchisees. I know one who managed three stores. He barely sleeps, just to keep a profit as an SME employer.

If you don’t like their coffee go elsewhere. Their “stated” political position may or may not be truthful, but it makes no difference to Taiwan’s standing in the world, not the tiniest bit. If my job was on the line, I would probably swear on a stack of 毛主席語錄 books that Xi Jinping craps chocolate. These kind of statements are just regular b.s. face-saving or preventing profit losses. I don’t drink 85度 because coffee gives me the $h!Ts. I could care less about their public “apology.”

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This is exactly why China’s policies are as they are, since they operate under the assumption that Taiwanese won’t stand up for themselves under economic pressure.

Boycotts are an effective way for consumers to show dissatisfaction with a brand’s corporate behavior. For all the hemming and hawing about “Taiwan, China” this and “Chinese Taipei” that, I haven’t yet seen any Taiwanese groups take steps to organize a response.

Franchisees can keep their shops and rebrand. Half the breakfast shops around me used to be 麥味登, seems to be a pretty standard occurrence. Actually the 85C franchisees could take a page from the recent Sheraton fiasco.

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If this were a viable option for them, I’d certainly encourage it. Contractual obligations, rebranding, redecorating, protecting the intellectual property or proprietary rights of the corporation would all be hurdles for many franchisees, particularly in the short term. China is an elephant among mice, this they will get this kind of political kowtowing. If it didn’t have the power it has, this wouldn’t me an issue. At the end of the day, these minor indulgences to China are hardly the stumbling blocks to Taiwan “official” independence, such as UN recognition. Those missiles aren’t aimed at our local coffee shops. Off handed rhetoric by independent companies is no protection against a dictatorship aimed at materializing a one-nation policy through force.

It’s the “culture of defeatism” behind such kowtowing which is the problem. Taiwan should shit or get off the pot.

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I wouldn’t personally consider this kind of public move either “cultural” or “defeatist” but, rather “situational” and “pragmatic.” As much as I hold it as a truth that Taiwan is independent an autonomous in a defacto sense. No need to upset the apple cart when you have no rooks, bishops, or knights on the chess board. If a de jure state of independence is possible, it’s a ways away. Keep guarding the “king” if we are even under the impression we haven’t already been checkmated.

How is it pragmatic? Are you following the story? They were removed from chinese food apps after they kowtowed. So they gained nothing in china and possibly lost buisiness in taiwan. They could have given a response which pissed off neither side, maybe impossible on the chinese side but its lose lose there so what can you do?

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I’ll concede to this. I haven’t been following the story regularly beyond their initial announcement. I’m just (possibly ineptly) trying to put myself in the position of 85度 after the SHTF. They probably hoped their announcement would save locations and business in China. I’m just saying, further boycotting in Taiwan in only going to result in FURTHER loss of business and, thus, jobs for usually young people. Would a Taiwanese boycott send a loud or interesting enough message to anyone. Not China. Chinese news is filtered and adulterated to fit the regime. It might send an message to other TW companies facing similar situations but, again, who is listening outside of our small island(s).

Either that, or they just can’t hold their liquor…

I also have a hard time believing people giving away free drugs.

It’s the exact same with tea made in Taiwan, just a few per cent needs to be Taiwan origin.

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As much as I hate that local franchisees are going to take the hit, I’m glad they are taking a hit.

Please elaborate.

85C is a disgrace.

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The distinction between pragmatism and consequentialism is a fine distinction, but an important one. A pragmatist does what he thinks will work. A consequentialist tries to do what actually works.

“Loss leader.”

Get `em hooked. Standard practice.

so what you are saying is they thought losing business in taiwan but keeping it in china…would work? ok mate.

Not in the long run, it won’t.

The crocodile may eat you last, but it will eat you. Unless it dies first.

And if someone kills the crocodile, you don’t want to be the guy who fed it all those years.

What works in the long run is having a vision. Sucking up to the currently dominant monster is not vision.

But in the Far East, dragon lore does not involve slaying the dragon and rescuing the maiden. Maybe that’s why the West sped past them in the mid 19th century, despite China having many centuries of a head start.

Their stock value took a tumble. I don’t think the Chinese markets cares that much in actual life at the end of the day vs Weibo and they pissed off their Taiwanese consumers.

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That only brings a windfall to the owners. So no loss there.

Employees and investors are the only ones hurting.

I think employees are fine. They get the same pay regardless unless they get let go. But I don’t think that’s the type of job that’s a huge lost, probably just old ladies and students.

I don’t know the split the franchisees and the brand has in place. But I can assume the small business owners who decide to franchise with them are taking the big hit