Coronavirus Open Thread 2021

Every time you pass someone, and you taste the funky garlic whatever they had for breakfast, you’re close enough to get exposed.

Mask-free, I am often surprised by scents I never had to endure having passed the same spot while wearing a mask. Also, I am severely near sighted, the fogging is a hassle, but if you get the right wire in your mask, it’s easy to contour it such that I can eliminate the fog effect.

The bigger challenge for me is the first day or so after shaving, every time I speak it starts dragging the mask down.

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I can never eliminate the fog effect, even with firefightinh N95 masks. My nose must be too abnormal.

I’d wish I’d smell that garlic…I smell the stale semi plastic sausage they had for dinner…or simple halitosis…with my mask on.

I just imagine how bad it could be without the mask…

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I don’t really want to kick off the whole mask effectiveness debate again, but my understanding is that the majority of the effectiveness of masks is protecting others from the wearer, not the opposite. When I’m wearing a surgical mask and I inhale/exhale, the vast majority of the airflow is around the sides of the mask, i.e., the path of least resistance, not through the fabric. That is, with the possible exception of somebody both (i) coughing/sneezing droplets directly in my face (I don’t remember this ever happening) and (ii) being an infected person in Taiwan (very low probability, apparently), the likelihood of me becoming infected while outside in Taiwan appears infinitesimal, irrespective of whether or not I’m wearing a mask.

I should stress here that I’m not anti-mask, and I wear them in all places where it’s mandated, inside shops, on public transport, in crowded areas like Ximen and Gongguan (again, which I generally avoid), and so on. I think masks should be compulsory in these circumstances. I just don’t see the point of wearing one in a situation like I’m in now - walking down a fairly quiet road at 10 p.m., passing someone every 30 seconds or so, the nearest people maybe 15-20 meters away, which is generally what I mean by being outside…

It’s extremely rare (i.e., I don’t remember it happening) that I get close enough to strangers to smell what they had for breakfast - I work at home, don’t have colleagues, don’t need to commute, seldom go out during the daytime, rarely eat in restaurants, and have generally been avoiding crowds since before social distancing became cool. And if I do get that close and they’re infected, I’m exposed in any case.

If coronavirus does really take off in Taiwan and more than, say, 1 in a million people in the street are infected (doesn’t appear to be the case, yet), I’ll reevaluate whether I should be wearing masks on the rare occasions where I’m in close proximity with several strangers. But for the time being, it doesn’t seem necessary.

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stop shaving and the leakage will increase, so like @Andrew said, it’s a moot point. Short of using some hi-tech memory foam gasket or glueing around the edges, I’ve yet to discover a convincing explanation of how to achieve a good mask seal. And with no secure seal, there’s really no trust in a mask, is there?

The point is that it will catch most (if not all) water droplets in our breath, thereby slowing down possible transmission of the virus through those droplets.

Cheers,
Guy

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The point is catching droplets to protect others, which can plausibly happen to a significant degree even without a seal.

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Ha! Beat you to it. :grin:

Guy

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I’ve been telling people that for over a year, and they still won’t listen. Just a matter of time until there’s a huge outbreak here and all those people who are anti-vaccine now are desperately trying to book appointments for the jab.

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With COVID-19 version 1.0, we’d see the elderly getting symptomatic and ending up in the hospital, with young people infected but asymptomatic.

With this later version, we’re seeing younger people and entire families getting whacked at once. The first Novotel worker who got ill, for example, is in his 40s. The authorities wanted to talk with him to try to determine how he got infected—but they can’t as he’s in isolation hooked up with a respirator.

It’s a different ball game now…

Guy

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Nobody thinks it’s “a joke”. At least from my own point of view, though, I’ve been questioning the basic assumption that humanity is going to come out on top (or that we can conquer this by throwing sufficient manpower, money, and technology at it). The nature of the universe is very much against that outcome.

It’s entirely possible that these new variants are a direct result of waging misguided wars against something that - left to its own devices - would have no pressure to evolve in that way. We’ve now moved from sticking our fingers in the dyke to building a whole new dyke (via vaccines), and one wonders what the outcome of that is likely to be.

There will inevitably be an uncontrollable outbreak in Taiwan. It’s a matter of when, not if. While I agree that Taiwan should get on with providing vaccines to those who want them, that’s probably not going to leave the country unscathed.

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I would say that in developing countries the situation is different…but the talk is the same.

line
When Covid-19 arrived in Tanzania, Mr Magufuli called on people to go to churches and mosques to pray. “Coronavirus, which is a devil, cannot survive in the body of Christ… It will burn instantly,” he said.

He declared Tanzania “Covid-19 free” last June, saying the virus had been eradicated by three days of national prayer.

He also mocked the efficacy of masks, expressed doubts about testing, and teased neighbouring countries which imposed health measures to curb the virus.

“Countries in Africa will be coming here to buy food in the years to come… they will be suffering because of shutting down their economy,” he said, according to the Associated Press.

Tanzania has not published details of its coronavirus cases since May, and the government has refused to purchase vaccines.

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You know, when you’re feeling a bit down about the situation here, and you see stuff like that, well . . . it certainly puts things in perspective.

I hope the people of Tanzania can get better leadership than what that guy provided. :slightly_frowning_face:

Guy

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My niece worked at a hospital in Tanzania for a few weeks in her 3rd (4th?) year at medical school. She thought it would be an enlightening experience.

Apparently, it was that, although not in quite the way she expected …

Tanzania is probably doomed.

Copy/pasting the whole thing, as link may not work for some.
Quite a number of excellent points made in the excerpt.

It has become commonplace to describe the speed with which vaccines were devised for Covid-19 as unprecedented. But it was not.
The first New York Times report of the outbreak in Hong Kong—three paragraphs on page 3—was on April 17, 1957. By July 26, little more than three months later, doctors at Fort Ord, Calif., began to inoculate recruits to the military.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
~

by Niall Ferguson

Updated April 30, 2021 4:40 pm ET

(How a More Resilient America Beat a Midcentury Pandemic - WSJ)

“Bliss was it in that dawn to be alive,/But to be young was very heaven!” Wordsworth was talking about France in 1789, but the line applies better to the America of 1957. That summer, Elvis Presley topped the charts with “(Let Me Be Your) Teddy Bear.” But we tend to forget that 1957 also saw the outbreak of one of the biggest pandemics of the modern era. Not coincidentally, another hit of that year was “Rockin’ Pneumonia and the Boogie Woogie Flu” by Huey “Piano” Smith & the Clowns.

When seeking historical analogies for Covid-19, commentators have referred more often to the catastrophic 1918-19 “Spanish influenza” than to the flu pandemic of 1957-58. Yet the later episode deserves to be much better known, not just because the public health threat was a closer match to our own but because American society at the time was better prepared—culturally, institutionally and politically—to deal with it.

The “Asian flu”—as it was then uncontroversial to call a contagious disease that originated in Asia—was a novel strain (H2N2) of influenza A. It was first reported in Hong Kong in April 1957, having originated in mainland China two months before, and—like Covid-19—it swiftly went global.

Unlike Covid-19, the Asian flu killed appreciable numbers of young people. The age group that suffered the heaviest losses globally was 15- to 24-year-olds.

Like Covid-19, the Asian flu led to significant excess mortality. The most recent research concludes that between 700,000 and 1.5 million people worldwide died in the pandemic. A pre-Covid study of the 1957-58 pandemic concluded that if “a virus of similar severity” were to strike in our time, around 2.7 million deaths might be anticipated worldwide. The current Covid-19 death toll is 3 million, about the same percentage of world population as were killed in 1957–58 (0.04%, compared with 1.7% in 1918-19).

True, excess mortality in the U.S.—now around 550,000—has been significantly higher in relative terms in 2020-21 than in 1957-58 (at most 116,000). Unlike Covid-19, however, the Asian flu killed appreciable numbers of young people. In terms of excess mortality relative to baseline expected mortality rates, the age groups that suffered the heaviest losses globally were 15- to 24-year-olds (34% above average mortality rates) followed by 5- to 14-year-olds (27% above average). In total years of life lost in the U.S., adjusted for population, Covid has been roughly 40% worse than the Asian flu.

The Asian flu and Covid-19 are very different diseases, in other words. The Asian flu’s basic reproduction number—the average number of people that one person was likely to infect in a population without any immunity—was around 1.65. For Covid-19, it is likely higher, perhaps 2.5 or 3.0. Superspreader events probably played a bigger role in 2020 than in 1957: Covid has a lower dispersion factor—that is, a minority of carriers do most of the transmission. On the other hand, people had more reason to be afraid of a new strain of influenza in 1957 than of a novel coronavirus in 2020. The disastrous pandemic of 1918 was still within living memory, whereas neither SARS nor MERS had produced pandemics.

High school students in Washington, D.C., September 1957.

PHOTO: EVERETT COLLECTION

The first cases of Asian flu in the U.S. occurred early in June 1957, among the crews of ships berthed at Newport, R.I. Cases also appeared among the 53,000 boys attending the Boy Scout Jamboree at Valley Forge, Penn. As Scout troops traveled around the country in July and August, they spread the flu. In July there was a massive outbreak in Tangipahoa Parish, La. By the end of the summer, cases had also appeared in California, Ohio, Kentucky and Utah.

It was the start of the school year that made the Asian flu an epidemic. The Communicable Disease Center, as the CDC was then called, estimated that approximately 45 million people—about 25% of the population—became infected with the new virus in October and November 1957. Younger people experienced the highest infection rates, from school-age children up to adults age 35-40. Adults over 65 accounted for 60% of influenza deaths, an abnormally low share.

Why were young Americans disproportionately vulnerable to the Asian flu? Part of the explanation is that they had not been as exposed as older Americans to earlier strains of influenza. But the scale and incidence of any contagion are functions of both the properties of the pathogen itself and the structure of the social network that it attacks. The year 1957 was in many ways the dawn of the American teenager. The first baby boomers born after the end of World War II turned 13 the following year. Summer camps, school buses and unprecedented social mingling after school ensured that between September 1957 and March 1958 the proportion of teenagers infected with the virus rose from 5% to 75%.

The policy response of President Dwight Eisenhower could hardly have been more different from the response of 2020. Eisenhower did not declare a state of emergency. There were no state lockdowns and, despite the first wave of teenage illness, no school closures. Sick students simply stayed at home, as they usually did. Work continued more or less uninterrupted.

With workplaces open, the Eisenhower administration saw no need to borrow to the hilt to fund transfers and loans to citizens and businesses. The president asked Congress for a mere $2.5 million ($23 million in today’s inflation-adjusted terms) to provide additional support to the Public Health Service. There was a recession that year, but it had little if anything to do with the pandemic. The Congressional Budget Office has described the Asian flu as an event that “might not be distinguishable from the normal variation in economic activity.”

President Eisenhower’s decision to keep the country open in 1957-58 was based on expert advice. When the Association of State and Territorial Health Officials (ASTHO) concluded in August 1957 that “there is no practical advantage in the closing of schools or the curtailment of public gatherings as it relates to the spread of this disease,” Eisenhower listened. As a CDC official later recalled: “Measures were generally not taken to close schools, restrict travel, close borders or recommend wearing masks….ASTHO encouraged home care for uncomplicated influenza cases to reduce the hospital burden and recommended limitations on hospital admissions to the sickest patients….Most were advised simply to stay home, rest and drink plenty of water and fruit juices.”

Dr. Maurice Hilleman, seen here in the lab in 1963, played a key role in the development of a vaccine for the Asian flu in 1957.

PHOTO: ASSOCIATED PRESS

This decision meant that the onus shifted entirely to pharmaceutical interventions. As in 2020, there was a race to find a vaccine. Unlike in 2020, however, the U.S. had no real competition, thanks to the acumen of one exceptionally talented and prescient scientist. From 1948 to 1957, Maurice Hilleman—born in Miles City, Mont., in 1919—was chief of the Department of Respiratory Diseases at the Army Medical Center (now the Walter Reed Army Institute of Research).

Early in his career, Hilleman had discovered the genetic changes that occur when the influenza virus mutates, known as “shift and drift.” It was this work that enabled him to recognize, when reading reports in the press of “glassy-eyed children” in Hong Kong, that the outbreak had the potential to become a disastrous pandemic. He and a colleague worked nine 14-hour days to confirm that this was a new and potentially deadly strain of flu.

Speed was of the essence, as in 2020. Hilleman was able to work directly
with vaccine manufacturers, bypassing “the bureaucratic red tape,” as he put it. The Public Health Service released the first cultures of the Asian influenza virus to manufacturers even before Hilleman had finished his analysis. By the late summer, six companies were producing his vaccine.

It has become commonplace to describe the speed with which vaccines were devised for Covid-19 as unprecedented. But it was not. The first New York Times report of the outbreak in Hong Kong—three paragraphs on page 3—was on April 17, 1957. By July 26, little more than three months later, doctors at Fort Ord, Calif., began to inoculate recruits to the military.

Surgeon General Leroy Burney announced on August 15 that the vaccine was to be allocated to states according to population size but distributed by the manufacturers through their customary commercial networks. Approximately 4 million one-milliliter doses were released in August, 9 million in September and 17 million in October.

This amounted to enough vaccine for just 17% of the population, and vaccine efficacy was found to range from 53% to 60%. But the net result of Hilleman’s rapid response to the Asian flu was to limit the excess mortality suffered in the U.S.

A striking contrast between 1957 and the present is that Americans today appear to have a much lower tolerance for risk than their grandparents and great-grandparents. As one contemporary recalled, “For those who grew up in the 1930s and 1940s, there was nothing unusual about finding yourself threatened by contagious disease. Mumps, measles, chicken pox and German measles swept through entire schools and towns; I had all four….We took the Asian flu in stride. We said our prayers and took our chances.”

D.A. Henderson, who as a young doctor was responsible for establishing the CDC Influenza Surveillance Unit, recalled a similar sangfroid in the medical profession: “From one watching the pandemic from very close range…it was a transiently disturbing event for the population, albeit stressful for schools and health clinics and disruptive to school football schedules.”

Perhaps a society with a stronger fabric of family life, community life and church life was better equipped to withstand the anguish of untimely deaths than a society that has, in so many ways, come apart.

Compare these stoical attitudes with the strange political bifurcation of reactions we saw last year, with Democrats embracing drastic restrictions on social and economic activity, while many Republicans acted as if the virus was a hoax. Perhaps a society with a stronger fabric of family life, community life and church life was better equipped to withstand the anguish of untimely deaths than a society that has, in so many ways, come apart.

A further contrast between 1957 and 2020 is that the competence of government would appear to have diminished even as its size has expanded. The number of government employees in the U.S., including those in federal, state and local governments, numbered 7.8 million in November 1957 and reached around 22 million in 2020—a nearly threefold increase, compared with a doubling of the population. Federal net outlays were 16.2% of GDP in 1957 versus 20.8% in 2019.

The Department of Health, Education and Welfare was just four years old in 1957. The CDC had been established in 1946, with the eradication of malaria as its principal objective. These relatively young institutions appear to have done what little was required of them in 1957, namely to reassure the public that the disastrous pandemic of 1918-19 was not about to be repeated, while helping the private sector to test, manufacture and distribute the vaccine. The contrast with the events of 2020 is once again striking.

It was widely accepted last year that economic lockdowns—including shelter-in-place orders confining people to their homes—were warranted by the magnitude of the threat posed to healthcare systems. But the U.S. hospital system was not overwhelmed in 1957-58 for the simple reason that it had vastly more capacity than today. Hospital beds per thousand people were approaching their all-time high of 9.18 per 1,000 people in 1960, compared with 2.77 in 2016.

In addition, the U.S. working population simply did not have the option to work from home in 1957. In the absence of a telecommunications infrastructure more sophisticated than the telephone (and a quarter of U.S. households still did not have a landline in 1957), the choice was between working at one’s workplace or not working at all.

Last year, the combination of insufficient hospital capacity and abundant communications capacity made something both necessary and possible that would have been unthinkable two generations ago: a temporary shutdown of a substantial proportion of economic activity, offset by massive debt-financed government transfers to compensate for the loss of household income. That this approach will have a great many unintended adverse consequences already seems clear. We are fortunate indeed that the spirit of the vaccine king Maurice Hilleman has lived on at Moderna and Pfizer, because much else of the spirit of 1957 would appear to have vanished.

Despite the pandemic, people thronged the beach and boardwalk at Coney Island in July 1957.

PHOTO: ASSOCIATED PRESS

“To be young was very heaven” in 1957—even with a serious risk of infectious disease (and not just flu; there was also polio and much else). By contrast, to be young in 2020 was—for most American teenagers—rather hellish. Stuck indoors, struggling to concentrate on “distance learning” with irritable parents working from home in the next room, young people experienced at best frustration and at worst mental illness.

We have done a great deal over the past year (not all of it effective) to protect the groups most vulnerable to Covid-19, which has overwhelmingly meant the elderly: 80.4% of U.S. Covid deaths, according to the CDC, have been among people 65 and older, compared with 0.2% among those under 25. But the economic and social costs, in terms of lost education and employment, have been disproportionately shouldered by the young.

The novel that captured the ebullience of the Beat Generation was Jack Kerouac’s “On the Road,” another hit of 1957. It begins, “I had just gotten over a serious illness that I won’t bother to talk about.” Stand by for “Off the Road,” the novel that will sum up the despondency of the Beaten Generation. As we dare to hope that we have gotten over our own pandemic, someone out there must be writing it.

This essay is adapted from Mr. Ferguson’s new book, “Doom: The Politics of Catastrophe,” which will be published by Penguin Press on May 4. He is a senior fellow at the Hoover Institution at Stanford University.

Doom and gloom if you want it.

That’s pretty much the definition of “news”.

Media outlets generally don’t publish stories on oil refineries not exploding, uneventful car journeys where everyone arrives safely, or a dude who went to his boring office job then came home instead of detonating a suicide bomb in a crowded market, either.

I suspect a key factor in the ‘keep calm and carry on’ attitude of those times was :

a) The fact that Eisenhower was a highly experienced military leader. He knew what it looks like when the shit actually does hit the fan. Today’s leaders are squishy, pampered people whose memorable times of crisis may have included not having sufficient money to buy a new car.

b) The fact that the general population were only 12 years out of a major global catastrophe. Again, they had some perspective against which to gauge a tragic but manageable death rate.

And the problem now is because the government didn’t procure much of a supply, any outbreak now will rip through the population like wildfire making up for all the time it lost over the past year. This while other economies open up.
I hope they can get everyone contact traced and everything under control

I noticed last night while checking Taiwan on Worldometer that cases in Laos are also taking off (a single day jump of >100 cases, from a previous cumulative total of ~800 cases):

I’m assuming that the country’s numbers are massively under-reported due to limited testing/resources and that it’s spillover from Thailand. Vientiane seems to be in lockdown, and Cambodia is apparently facing similar problems:

I lived in/travelled around Laos for a couple of months a few years ago. Nice country. Poor medical infrastructure, though - I think the usual advice for tourists who get sick in Laos is…go to Thailand (far better, cheaper healthcare).