I don’t see the slap in the face here. Chen made the requests at the last minute (two weeks before), and then essentially threw a hissy fit when he got Alaska and couldn’t compete with Ma Ying-jeou’s recent trip. The consequences are completely appropriate considering that he started it. 
Interesting the TI administration is laying the blame on the USA “leaking” their travel plans to the press.
Thus forcing them land in UAE since the PRC pressured the Lebenese in denying them landing rights.
…poor poor CSB…so now the USA are in cohoots with the PRC. We can’t trust the USA either. 
[quote=“Marvin”]I have no issues with Beijing leaving TW(with CSB) no political space, but I do think they should let TW join organizations like WHO[/quote]Well, even there… I think it’s very much a political issue.
Beijing has never tried to keep Taiwanese “experts” from participating in any/all WHO events. Taiwan’s in the WTO without too much fanfare, I’d point out.
The issue remains very much political. What legal terminology is used to refer to Taiwan? Is it a “member”, an “observer”… or is it a separate health region of “China”?
Like I’ve said before, it takes two to tango. It wouldn’t be a point of conflict if only Beijing cared about the political aspects. Taipei doesn’t want to join the WHO unless its identified as a separate political entity.
Does the US (Rice, Bush, etc.) make any decision regarding Taiwan without first giving some consideration to how it may affect other interests (China, Iran, etc.)? CSB says that the US needing China’s help with Iran is the motivation behind not wanting to give him face time in New York (which could easily outshine Hu’s tragic visit and Ma’s visit/evasion of Congressmen).
On the other hand, some Forumosa posters say CSB is being given a timeout to sit in the corner (of Alaska) because of the NUC’s ceasing. But, didn’t the ROC government consult with the US government for several days on the NUC decision before it was announced? Didn’t the ROC government reword its proclamation, bending to the will of the US? Didn’t the US declare the issue settled and not a change to their version of the status quo?
By the way, what airline is CSB flying? Wasn’t China Airlines supposed to change their name to Taiwan Airlines before this trip?
Looking ahead, once CSB retires in 2008, he can move to Washington DC and lobby the US government full-time.
No. After. Depends on which you took to be the first “announcement.”
And then made a bunch more statements contradicting the understanding.
Let’s assume the NUC issue is settled. That’s beside the point. Because it is the issue of CSB’s bankrupt credibility and diplomatic buffoonery that isn’t settled. The NUC thing is just a specific case. I don’t think anybody takes CSB seriously any more. I mean the State Department doesn’t even call him “President” or even “Mr. Chen” but “he.”
Chen flings “name-righting” like a booger every time an election comes around. Doesn’t necessarily mean he’ll have the balls to do it; doesn’t necessarily mean he won’t be stupid enough to actually do it, either.
Boy, he will just be the popular man in town, won’t he? Too bad he doesn’t speak English and loves himself too much to truly care about TI/ers. I mean, even right now…
Thanks for answering my questions.
Silly me; I thought the USA was consulted before the final proclamation was made in late February and that the international media misquoted government officials.
But, did I ask: “Is the President of the ROC contradictory, bankrupt of credibility, a buffoon on diplomacy, not taken seriously, ‘booger’ flinging, without balls, stupid, unpopular, non-English speaking, self-loving, and noncaring?”
Anything else? Please, let us know how you really feel. That way we can all see as clearly. 
Why should it?
Any elected US government is put into office for one reason: to serve the interests of the American people. Why should they service Taiwan ahead of American interests?
[quote=“cctang”] What legal terminology is used to refer to Taiwan? Is it a “member”, an “observer”… or is it a separate health region of “China”?
[/quote]
In the WTO it is “separate customs territory.”
The legal concept of separate customs territory comes from military occupation.
Taiwan is occupied territory, and the occupying power is the United States. See the San Francisco Peace Treaty. Importantly, the military government of the principal occupying power does not end with the coming into effect of the peace treaty.
The military occupation of Taiwan was delegated to the Chinese Nationalists, but the US maintains final control. United States Military Government authority over Taiwan is still active even today. (The ROC is a subordinate occupying power and a government in exile.)
In terms of the World Health Organization (WHO), Taiwan should apply for membership as an associate member under the United States. That would be the correct legal formulation.
Hartzell, I think you’re being a bit irresponsible in presenting your fringe personal opinion in a factual tone here.
Are you actually saying that Taiwan belongs to the US until the US says it doesn’t? If that’s the case, I
Is Chen going to stopover in Alaska on his return trip from Latin America? It’s going to be double the trouble if he decides to take the scenic route again, this time eastwards from Latin America back to Taiwan.
Am I wrong or Ma is considered here a little too much? Hell, if the Mayor of a Town is as important as the president of a country, then the world is completelly crazy…
The US cannot let Chen go there because of their two-face politics - one that smiles and one that tells you to go to hell - thats how they do with every single country in this world - China included. In one hand they support Taiwan (for all the possible and imaginable reasons) and in the other they support China (again…). So it is clear on their politics the way they will allways treat the rest - in their best interests…
I bet that if Chen would go to US to talk with Boeing to buy 200 airplaines, they would have a red carpet…
I doubt it, since allowing CSB to use 200 Boeing’s as a ticket into the US, would just invite mainland China to replace 2000 Boeing’s with 2000 Airbus’s (expected number of jets over the next decade).
But yes, you have made a point (even if it is an obvious one): if Taiwan had the economic/political significance of mainland China, the US would allow CSB to visit.
As far as the importance of Ma YJ: Ma’s not just the mayor of Taipei. He’s also the most popular politician on Taiwan, and widely seen as the next president of the ROC.
Pan-blue legislators are pointing out the CSB ‘long march’ might’ve violated ROC aeronautical safety rules. The 37 hour total flight time is longer than the 30 hour cap placed on all flights, even if there were three crews (6 pilots total) onboard.
In actuality Chen is a lame duck president with less than two years remaining on the job. Plus he has an 18% approval rating.
Therefore it would make sense for the US to invest in Ma, who holds the greatest potential in enhancing cross-strait relations, which would make it less likely for the US to be mired in a conflict.
[quote=“reztrop”]In actuality Chen is a lame duck president with less than two years remaining on the job. Plus he has an 18% approval rating.
Therefore it would make sense for the US to invest in Ma, who holds the greatest potential in enhancing cross-strait relations, which would make it less likely for the US to be mired in a conflict.[/quote]
This is where you can see democracy or not…
In a true democracy, people would be more concerned on how another country is making your president look like a “lame duck” than with the fact that a mayor of a town could go anywhere they want…
If I am not wrong, the protocol on receiving presidents and mayors is quite different isn’t it?
Anyway, and again, this story shows how young democracy in Taiwan is, and how people have still to learn that, for better or worse, the ones elected are the representative ones, not some guys who pretend to be…
Also, in a “old” or not-so-old democracy, the DPP government had allready gone to elections again, stating that the current “minority” government is impossible to put on practice, and that the reforms that they proposed to the people and that may be one of the reasons they were elected cannot go pass the LY. Instead, they make fools of themselves by holding as much as they can to the power. By this, they only go down to the KMT level…
No worries. Ma has freedom to move about because his is only a city mayor/ head of a party.
Once/if he becomes president, he’ll be running into the same troubles as CSB, especially if he does not behave per the PRC’s wishes.
Well that’s not going to happen, is it? 
“Will the ROC be a puppet of PRC under the KMT rule?”
don’t loose the next episode on “The story of democracy on Formosa Island”
[quote=“mr_boogie”]“Will the ROC be a puppet of PRC under the KMT rule?”
don’t loose the next episode on “The story of democracy on Formosa Island”[/quote]
No, No, I think I’ve seen this show in AXN - it’s called “Lost”
Oh, I thought it was going on on some more oldfashioned channel…
It is funny to see how these 2 parties are all cuddlies now hehehe - maybe we should offer them a copy of Hearts of Iron 2: Doomsday, for them to play one against the other, for the sake of the old times…