Does your girlfriend/wife like shopping?

Life Dating & Relationships
41

[quote=“No Nutella”]I just had my first experience in the fancy Department stores here. I went with my GF’s family to a big store in Taipei for “New Years shopping.” My jaw is still resting on the ground as an aftereffect of my reaction to the prices in this place. :astonished:
[/quote]

I have the same reaction no matter what country I am in. My brain just does not compute how anyone would spend so much money on such (well to me anyway) ridiculous stuff. I honestly don’t get how these stores survive, but then I guess that there must be a lot of people with a lot more money than sense. I remember working with a girl in Taiwan who had a NT$10,000 purse. I mean, what the f!*!. What the hell is the point in that? I can’t even see how it appeals to vanity as for nearly all of it’s life it remains hidden. Maybe it had some amazing facility that I’m not aware of, but as far as I know, a NT$200 - 500 wallet works the same way a NT$10,000 one does. Makes me very confused :s

42

I’m reading a book now called “Trading Up” and it talks about this very thing. People are willing these days to pay up in one category of goods and cut back in others to find the money to buy them what they want.

The reason for doing this is that there is a substantial emotional connection to the item purchased.

I know this is true in our house. My wife has a Gucci wallet and a Coach handbag. I have my notebook Asus PC.

YEAH BABY!

It makes me veryyy happy. Her stuff makes me happy. We’re not big shoppers but we know what we like.

:slight_smile:

so dont think so much. This phenomenon is more common than you might think.

43

[quote]The reason for doing this is that there is a substantial emotional connection to the item purchased.

I know this is true in our house. My wife has a Gucci wallet and a Coach handbag. I have my notebook Asus PC.
[/quote]

I can understand having an ASUS notebook because I think quality is important with electronics and mechanical items, otherwise you are just throwing good money after bad.

But buying things like a $30,000 chair or a $104,876,987,890,99 powder puff and maskara set kind of really make no sence to me.

And what is it with brand names? When I was at school, people bought brand names because they thought they would be admired by their peers. The NIKE bags, the Addidas trainers and whatever. To “fit in” you had to have these fashion accessories.

I see the same thing in adult culture - The Gucci bags, the Channel Lipstick - it’s all just a show of one upmanship and face.

“Look at me, I’m wearing a Ralph Lauren shirt.” Big deal.

Maybe I just lack class, but I’m glad I’m on the outside looking in than on the inside looking out, clutched by rich corporations grasps as I sucumb to the latest advertisements for the latest phone, handbag or aftershave. Everyone telling me what I should have.

I’m also glad I don’t have to trapse around depatment stores for half of my waking hours just so I can find the most “in” fashion statements.

44

I don’t think you lack class, but maybe a little perspective. The luxery items that people buy are emotionally significant tp them…not necessairly to you or me.

A 30,000 chair? I’d like to sit in one, but I wouldn’t pay that much for one. Gucci and Coach are high quality items. It’s not just a brand to some people. BMW is a fantastic car. I’d like to drive one. And maybe I could afford the payments on a BMW if I didn’t have a pc, or adsl, or beer, or books.

I think you are giving yourself extra and uncessary stress by saying that people who do buy luxury items are ALL in some kind of fashion war, or the “in” war.

You said, “I see the same thing in adult culture - The Gucci bags, the Channel Lipstick - it’s all just a show of one upmanship and face.
‘Look at me, I’m wearing a Ralph Lauren shirt.’ Big deal.”

Well, for some people it IS a big deal. It makes them feel good to have the ability to get what they want. It may literally make them happier.

A divorced women buys herself expensive jewerly…why? Because who else will? It makes her feel good to reward herself for working hard.

I also hate shopping and I refuse to go with my wife unless it’s in 101, because then I can go and spend 2000NT on books in Page One. LOL

She buys bath soap and face cream.

I didn’t buy books that would make people think I’m smarter. She didn’t buy face cream to show off her tastes.

Instead of thinking how shallow people are for getting something outrageous, why not compliment them on it. Great shirt. Nice care. Nice perfume. If they truly value their purchase, maybe they’ll smile and tell you why.

:slight_smile:

45

[quote]I think you are giving yourself extra and uncessary stress by saying that people who do buy luxury items are ALL in some kind of fashion war, or the “in” war.
[/quote]

I didn’t say all

I have often asked people why. My brother is a good example of someone who takes fashion a bit too seriously. After along conversation he couldn’t answer the original question I asked him: Why do you always buy designer brands?
They didn’t necessarily make him feel good. They certainly made him scrimp and save for petrol, food and other “necessities.”

Like you I have an ASUS computer. I didn’t buy it because it is "ASUS."I bought it because it was the best, most functional laptop for the budget I had. If there was an unamed brand of the same calibre and functionality then I would just as likely have bought that. The name ASUS didn’t sway my decision.

You say top name brands are quality. I beg to differ.
I have a selection of shirts for work. One of them is Hugo Boss. Most of the buttons have had to be sown back on after coming off, the colour has faded and the stitching is coming apart at the top of the sleeve. I have another shirt that I bought which doesn’t have a name and it has, so far. lasted twice as long. It was about 4 times cheaper too.

I used to drive a Merc in Malaysia which was about 2 years old. Apart from a fiat Punto and a Transit Van, it was the worst car I had ever driven. It handled like a bag of spanners, had a tendancy to drift around corners and was a wallet breaker at petrol stations. The ergonomics were equally crap and the seats were uncomfortable.
Yet I see in Taiwan that there is a prestige in driving this car - a percieved value and a glimmer of selfworth in the eyes of the driver.

I’m not sure about BMW :s

Any brand name trainers I have bought have given up on my after about 3 months, but other less well known brands have lasted for longer.

What I really want to put forward are a couple of points:

1). Do people really buy things to make themselves feel happier or to compete in a fasion war.
Why do people feel better - is it because they spent a ridiculous amount of money on something that is clearly not worth it, or is it because they can show their friends and family that they are afffluent enough to be able to afford such items? Do they buy the items because they are really made better and are of higher quality, or is it because of the name tag?

2). If people do feel happy when they fork out for expensive designer goods, is it because they have bought into a group, perceived social status or something that was previously exclusive to them? - are theycompeting?

3). Do large designer brand companies make people feel like lesser members of society if they don’t have the necessary fashion accessories; do they trade groups of people off against each other for business?

[quote]A divorced women buys herself expensive jewerly…why? Because who else will? It makes her feel good to reward herself for working hard.

[/quote]

I can understand this example.

What I am trying to get at is the tendancy of people to buy named brands rather than buying things because they really want something or they really believe there is a value to what they are buying.

Buying expensive things is one thing, but buying expensive named items is, I’m sure, just a method to feel that one belongs to a certain exclusive group.

46

OK, this is a very interesting point examined in “Trading Up”

You said, “Buying expensive things is one thing, but buying expensive named items is, I’m sure, just a method to feel that one belongs to a certain exclusive group.”

Now what luxury producing companies are learning is that people are willing to spend more on things they like. Right. They are also learning that so many people are doing this that the whole concept of “exclusivity” is being undermined. lol

Buy a Rolls Royce, and you are truly exclusive…and showing off IMHO. Buy a beemer…hmmm…hard to say. Maybe in Taiwan people buy into the exclusivity ideal, but in the states, would it be the same? Or are people just get wiser about the things they spend money on?

Of course, the answer is most likely a mixture of these two theories. It makes for a good debate.

47

[quote]
…Maybe it had some amazing facility that I’m not aware of, but as far as I know, a NT$200 - 500 wallet works the same way a NT$10,000 one does. Makes me very confused :s[/quote]

You need to pay more attention to the details. How about cars. You can get a nice one for 20000 euro or for 200000 euro. Both drive…

48

[quote]Of course, the answer is most likely a mixture of these two theories. It makes for a good debate.
[/quote]

It does indeed.

A RR is definately showing off. In Britain, a BMW would only be a status symbol to certain groups of people; and consequently so, to certain ethnic groups also.

I think people are wising up. They get wiser as they get older. Now marketing seems to be at kids, teenagers and young adults who want to be real adults.
I think the older you get, the wiser you get.

I would tend to agree.

One thing that I do like though is having things made for me and my significant other. A new suit tailored for you is worth the money and money well spent - no one else can buy it in the high street.
Having jewellry made is also great. Having it designed, made and sent to you is worth the wait - the satisfaction is here for me, not just the act of spending the money.

Is “Trading Up” readily available in bookshops here? It sounds like an interesting read.

49

A NT$ 30,000 handbag or similar outragous priced dresses/shoes are similar to “penis-extenders” - they can hardly afford it, but like to show it off.

I should know, I am one of them.
-I would love to have a Lamborgini or Ferrari.

50

I think there are two aspects to this discussion:

#1. Why do people buy stuff that to others seems rediculously overpriced? This is a big topic touched upon by many here. Its hard to talk about it in an unbiased way. Personally, I agree with a lot of what Dangermouse said, buying high-quality items is one thing (such as a computer) but buying name-brand for name-brand’s sake is quite another, but this of course is my opinion.

As for material possesions bringing happiness, the question that begs to be asked is: how deep does this happiness go? Is it merely superficial? To answer this question concerning someone other than ourselves would be rude and judgmental and actually quite impossible.

An interesting read on the subject or why people buy expensive name brand stuff is Naomi Klein’s “No Logo” although a readers reaction to it is usually based on their preconcieved views on the mass marketing and globalization debates.

what I am more interested in is #2. How do people afford this stuff? Funkymonkey offered some insight into the how Taiwanese do it, money is a family affair passed down between generations and the current generation is selling the farm. But isn’t it true that most of the money most families have has come to them in the last few decades, and this is the source of their disposable income? (this is my assumption, please enlighten me if you know otherwise.)

This sounds interesting. In my case maybe I would spend a relatively high amount of money on a nice meal or artwork and forgo the trendy clothes. But the point is that I don’t have money to spend on either and I just wonder how others seem to have so much. People talk a lot about how in debt Americans are these days, how is the same not true in places like Taiwan? Is it because the cost of living for other neccesities (food, housing) is so much lower?

Out of curiosity, in this theory of “trading up,” what are some of the things people give up?

51

I was talking to my wife about this today: brand name buyers and emotional buyers. She had an interesting POV about Taiwanese who buy brand names: age and the perception that having brand named stuff creates.

If she sees a middle aged woman with a Gucci purse, she won’t think twice about it. The woman can afford it. The woman probably has the money to buy it and quite possibly worked for the money to pay for it. Same as a forty year old man with a beemer.

Now when she sees a young person sporting brand name things, she gets an entirely different feeling. How the hell did they come up with the cash for that Coach bag? AND the shoes and the…? She feels that young people ARE into the look at me and my brand name stuff, and may not have earned it themselves. Many young folks are spoiled in Taiwan.

Now some young urban professionals surely can contradict this, and rightly so. They may have newer, higher paying jobs, and so can afford the good stuff. But still, there’s a part of me that feels, if the time comes that they CAN’T still afford this stuff, they are gonna be really bummed.

Back to the book: it depends on the person to determine what things he or she will give up. I give up good ground coffee. I drink folgers ground beans…blech! Some of you drink Starbucks every day. 95 NT for a cup of coffee is cheap at Starbucks but still WAY more than I’m willing to pay all the time. I give up on the sporty brand name clothes. I still get the brand, just at discounters, clothes with blemishes, miss sticthes, etc, but still the same basic quality. Just got a great sweater by Abercrombie and Finch for 560NT.

What you give up really depends on who you are.

52

This transgresses from brand name clothes and goods right the way across the board to music and popular culture. I think JdSmith is correct when he says it is mostly youngsters who buy into the name thing and older people who have more of an eye for “quality” rather than what they think people would admire them to have, such as brand name items.

I draw music into the topic because I see younger people following trends in music. The fashion aspect often follows this medium.

Music is also a fashion. I often wonder how many people who buy popular music don’t actually like it, such as some of this awful (in my opinion anyway) dance, trance, R&B and techno music, and in Taiwan, what I call WATSONS music, which is the trashy version of popular western music with Taiwanese lyrics (often played at 100 decibels from WATSONS speakers) .

It seems as people get older and move away from their teenage peers and the pressure that goes with it, they realise what they really like and start to take less of an interest in pleasing everybody else and more of an interest in pleasing themselves.

I agree. But are the preconceived views of the reader really what they believe in, or what they are told to believe by mass media, mass marketing and globalisation? It’s a very big vicious circle.

53

[quote=“Dangermouse”] I think JdSmith is correct when he says it is mostly youngsters who buy into the name thing and older people who have more of an eye for “quality” rather than what they think people would admire them to have, such as brand name items.quote]

Actually, my wife saw that. :notworthy:

I completely missed the age factor. :blush:

54

OOOPS. Have I got you into trouble?

55

Nope, just giving my wife her props! :slight_smile:

56
  1. Why do people buy this stuff?

I’ve talked with my wife about this and for many Taiwanese women, a Coach or Gucci bag has an air of sophistication and style about it. Women think they can get this transferred to themselves by buying the bag.

  1. How do they afford it?

Many of them are fakes. And for the real ones - credit cards. Credit card use in Taiwan is extreme. Young women in particular run up absolutley enourmous bills on perhaps a dozen different cards. That’s one reason there’s never a shortage of ‘jiudian’ girls, karaoke girls etc.

Brian

57

[quote=“Bu Lai En”]1) Why do people buy this stuff?

I’ve talked with my wife about this and for many Taiwanese women, a Coach or Gucci bag has an air of sophistication and style about it. Women think they can get this transferred to themselves by buying the bag.

  1. How do they afford it?

Many of them are fakes. And for the real ones - credit cards. Credit card use in Taiwan is extreme. Young women in particular run up absolutley enourmous bills on perhaps a dozen different cards. That’s one reason there’s never a shortage of ‘jiudian’ girls, karaoke girls etc.

Brian[/quote]

I would preface the “women” with "some"and then I’d agree.

The second part: this is why my wife thought “Where the hell do they get the money to but that stuff?” The same phenomenon happens in Japan where young girls and women will turn a trick or three to buy a LV bag. However, I don’t think my 37 year old sister in law is running up her debt or whoring to buy all the stuff she has. She works and she has the dough, and she spends it.

I don’t believe that the “transformation experience” is the reason more mature women buy luxury items.

Figuring out people’s emotional connection to the things they buy is hard. I just spent 60US$ buying two grateful Dead tee-shirts. My wife thought it was ridiculous, but I love them. :slight_smile: I also do not think they make me look any more sophisticated, he says wiping his nose on his sleeve.

But I think you miss the point a bit, saying that some of the bags are fakes. The point is that people are more willing to foot the bill for the real goods, and more and more people are doing this, because they find a deeper sense of emotional pleasure from good, expensive, purchases.

Does this make them all luxury buyers shallow? Or are these luxury purchases emotionally self-medicating, and therefore a positive social event?

58

An interesting read guys…I cannot understand this culture of buying luxury items. 30,000, 50,000 … 80,000NT$ for a LV logo bag that is NOT even leather… :noway: :noway: …I just don’t get it…

I am glad to see that the luxury designers have toned down their logos in the past year or so, but I still dislike having a logo so obviously displayed. As the fashion trend is now to minimize the logos, some of these goods have been at considerable discount (80%), but the very nature of the luxury business is not to window advertise this. If you went into the store you would see the sales merchandise discreetly displayed before it is shipped out to the outlets.

I like quality and I know what I am looking for. If I see clothing items at a department store, (Sogo), I want to look at the inside seams, and the finishing touches around buttons, zippers… Those details are what determines the quality, not necessarily the logo. To me this is really important because it is too common for the the factory to stitch on a famous label and jack up the price. Consequently, shopping is not a pleasureable experience for me here; sales people do not really appreciate it when I look closely at the quality of the goods. For me the red signs go up.

Paying attention to the details is one of the distinguishing factors in the luxury goods market. They use good, solid quality closures, fixtures, rivets, links, zippers, snaps, hooks… on their bags. I am sure we have all bought something that we liked and after a few uses the hardware starts to discolor, or breaks or is somehow unusable. When a good quality product begins to wear, all the hardware, etc are still in place. It is not exclusive to the luxury market, but they tend to use the best materials and then charge a premium for it.

The same principles hold if I am looking for furniture or a car. I hope I am not off topic here. Basically my point here is that when I find something that I like, that I need and at the price I am willing to pay, I do not feel that I am giving anything up.

59

[quote=“robi666”][quote]
…Maybe it had some amazing facility that I’m not aware of, but as far as I know, a NT$200 - 500 wallet works the same way a NT$10,000 one does. Makes me very confused :s[/quote]

You need to pay more attention to the details. How about cars. You can get a nice one for 20000 euro or for 200000 euro. Both drive…[/quote]

Sorry, but I expect a whole shitload of difference between a 20000 euro car and a 200000 euro car. Think size, speed, stereo, seating, electrics, computers etc etc. Now what about the purse. Holds money. Holds credit cards. What else does this NT10,000 purse do? :wink:

60

[quote=“butcher boy”][quote=“robi666”][quote]
…Maybe it had some amazing facility that I’m not aware of, but as far as I know, a NT$200 - 500 wallet works the same way a NT$10,000 one does. Makes me very confused :s[/quote]

You need to pay more attention to the details. How about cars. You can get a nice one for 20000 euro or for 200000 euro. Both drive…[/quote]

Sorry, but I expect a whole shitload of difference between a 20000 euro car and a 200000 euro car. Think size, speed, stereo, seating, electrics, computers etc etc. Now what about the purse. Holds money. Holds credit cards. What else does this NT10,000 purse do? :wink:[/quote]

Nothing more than a NT$1500 purse does lol… good one Butcherboy