Ewcp

Arts & Sciences Religion & Spirituality
1

I know this is a very old post but…

I think they may be one and the same. At least, around the area where East West Culture Project has their headquarters, I get approached often asking if I’m interested in “yoga”, “meditation”, “Buddhism”, “Chinese tea” or “qigong” by lively young foreigners or starry-eyed Taiwanese who want to recruit me to come to classes. Not likely. I’m a bitter, cynical, happy atheist. You couldn’t drag me to a meditation or qigong course! The most common hook among all of these seems to be the qigong angle, and every time it turns out these people are with EWCP.

Frankly, it’s a bit creepy. It happens all the time and other foreign friends - all women - say it happens to them too. Not the guys.

After some time I finally got to learn what EWCP is allegedly all about. I have been told a lot of horrifying stories about it being, basically, a real cult. We’re talking indoctrination/mind control/sleep deprivation/decide for you (all with “compassion” and “love” of course) who your friends can be. Keep you busy all the time, keep you thinking that if you just continue to donate money, recite your mantras day and night (lots of stuff to do all night so you’ve never quite had enough sleep, ever) and do everything The Master asks for, that you’ll attain enlightenment: the real deal. This “Khenchen Rinpoche” fellow doesn’t seem to be identifiable. Also goes by “Master Wang”. He doesn’t seem to be Tibetan at all and nobody seems to know his real, full name. They apparently target expats - especially lonely, single, female expats, but really anybody they think will be easily indoctrinated and can “do” something for them, including men or “rich” expat wives. :fume: There seem to be a lot of Taiwanese involved too. Some of the people who approach me are definitely local.

Anyway, this is all from stories I’ve heard - all “allegedly” or “so I’ve been told” but my feeling on the whole thing is :thumbsdown:. I would be a little stronger on these points but I want to keep it to the facts, what I’ve heard, and avoid “slander”.

But you wouldn’t know that from their website, and I can’t prove it either except for the stories people have told me. The website makes it look like a lovely group of creative, intelligent international types ready to be your best friends. But I have heard quite differently. Make of that what you will.

  • posted anonymously because nobody wants to end up in the crosshairs of a vengeful, angry, real-deal cult (if that is what they are, and I suspect it is)
2

I have a bunch of friends deeply involved with EWCP and have gone to several of their events (dinners, movie nights, etc.). I’d say whatever information you’re getting is a bit skewed… coming from a secular perspective it seems a bit cultish to see people behaving with any sort of reverence toward a guru figure… but it hardly seems that threatening. Usually when I see the big cheese he seems sublimely amused at all the fuss, a slight smile on his face. He dresses like an ordinary guy and mainly talks about standard Buddhist topics, nothing zany. It really does seem like a jolly bunch of westerners and (mostly westernized) Taiwanese people seeking wisdom and finding a bit of community in the urban jungle of Taipei. But hey, maybe that’s just what they want me to think… :wink:

3

Uhmmm I almost end up taking some yoga classes at that center. Generaly I have a low consideration for sects and cults and people involved, and more if they come from a totally different background and culture. It’s like “hey, my culture/religion was full of shit, but I found the truth in this neat, perfect other culture/religion only because it’s totally different from the one back in home!”.

Back in the day I took a free yoga class in a center in my home town. They lost me when they start to speak about masters who were already dead but were going to teach us through the instructor and shit like that. Still I could take yoga classes at EWCP, but it would be awkward, i guess.

4

What I’ve heard, and also my general impression from those recruiters who keep bugging me, is that that “a jolly bunch of Westerners seeking wisdom and finding a bit of a community” is exactly how they present themselves, and exactly how people who go to the peripheral events, or are very new to the organization, or who never get more deeply involved, see it (and how the group wants them to see it). They wouldn’t be able to “hook” you if they looked like dingbats, and of course “The Master” wouldn’t talk about anything too crazy around these new people, because again, nobody’s going to join an organization that looks cultish from the outside.

I can’t prove he’s a fraud or that this is a cult, it’s just my impression from stories I’ve been told. I think my view on this is probably right. Others will probably disagree. Okay.

Google him, though. You’ll find a lot of different people with the honorifics “Khenchen” and “Rinpoche”, none of whom seem to be him. His personal website pops up, which gives his full name (“Khenchen” or “Kenchen Mawei Wangqiu Longli Jiacuo Rinpoche”) - Google that and you don’t get anything but a mention in the Taipei Times - written by someone in the EWCP - and that same personal website. Make of that what you will, as well.

My perception of them is from a few people I know who’ve been very deeply involved and gotten out, and had some really harrowing stories to tell. People who I know from totally different areas of my life, who would have no reason to know that I knew each of them separately. All telling similar stories. Plus a few former coworkers who, when involved with them, always looked tired, withdrawn, a bit “out of it”, sleep deprived.

Would the personal stories of people who’ve been in that group and had awful, cult-like experiences before getting out be “skewed”? Yes, of course.

Do I believe them? Yep. Similar stories from people who had no way of knowing I knew others like them, and why would a few people I’ve met make a concerted effort to lie about their experiences? Or if they did - maybe they were just vengeful or bitter about the EWCP - why would they all tell such extreme stories?

5

I used to know one of their yoga instructors and she was a normal person. When she decided she wanted to leave and go teach elsewhere, they wished her luck and gave her a good reference. Fairly uncultish behavior.

6

There’s no way to disprove what you say… and neither of us have much direct experience. I would simply caution anyone out there from reading too much into what’s been said… I tend to be quite skeptical of anything cult-like and this one didn’t trigger any red flags for me. I also know a bunch of people who have been with the group for many years and none of them exhibit strange behavior or regrets. Two of those people I’ve known for more than ten years, so I would hope I’d be able to tell if they were knee-deep in some kind of weird cult. I suppose all that can be said is YMMV.

7

I used to know one of their yoga instructors, too (probably not the same one). We worked together when she was teaching yoga classes at EWCP but that was not means to an employment.

When we worked together, she seemed fine at first. Happy, healthy, enthusiastic. A few years later she had become erratic, canceling classes at the last minute and constantly being “sick” or showing up very late. Management didn’t like her because she was very fickle about the times she was willing to work - beyond reasonable scheduling expectations - so it was hard to give her classes. The last time I saw her she had dark circles under her eyes, pale skin and greasy, unwashed hair.

Neither of us work there anymore, I don’t know what became of her.

I know at least one member who was pushed into opening a business for the purpose of hiring others in the group who needed ARCs, as well as potentially expanding their circle of recruitment. I can’t speak for the yoga teacher you know or knew, though.

I’m not writing all this to try and say “you can’t join them. they’re a cult, if you join them they’ll program you and ruin your life.” People can do whatever they want. From what I have heard some people go to their events and never get sucked in further, and some people have different experiences.

However Ive heard enough stories from people who have had very bad experiences indeed and can find so little non-EWCP information on this “Master Wang” guy that I do believe there is a dark side to the group. I will be steering clear of it and I would advise anyone who gets involved with them to be aware…to keep this in mind, and to make sure they have verified from an outside source and are fully confident that this Master Wang is who he says he is before they get involved.

I know a few people who have been involved and are doing OK, or seem that way to me. I know one who felt they were a bit strange and wouldn’t join any of their smaller groups, but by the time she stopped going to their classes she didn’t think they were anything more than eccentric hippies.

And I know two personally who have had their marriages fall apart (I was there to see the before-and-after of one of these implosions), one of whom has left Taipei for reasons directly related to EWCP, one who was threatened when they tried to leave the group. For one of these stories, at the time they looked tired and withdrawn but I had no idea my friend in a - to quote - “cult”. I honestly would not have guessed. Of course who would join a group which is based on recruiting new people if everyone in the group looked unhappy or sick or acted weird?

I have heard other third-hand stories. I wont detail those. By that degree of separation it’s hard to know what’s exaggerated but I believe the personal stories of people I know directly.

8

I’ve known a couple people involved in the EWCP and been to one or two of their events. They definitely come off as a bit hippie, but harmless imho. Perhaps your friends’ personal/emotional problems were there already. These guru-type religions are obviously attractive to emotionally unstable people seeking the ‘answer’. The “dark side”(if any) is that the wise old guru is more often than not mainly interested in increasing his prestige and following rather than practicing any of the compassion that he so piously preaches. Maybe a reason why they go after foreigners to spread the word abroad.

9

I have been to a couple of ewcp evenings. I was invited by a friend. The people are very friendly, they seem genuine. I didn’t go for a while but contacted me to invite me to their Thanksgiving dinner and then their Christmas meal. The guru character as someone already said does on occasion seem genuinely amused by the whole thing. It does seem a big part of some of the members lives, similarly some of my friends spend a lot of time in the gym, others in the pub. I wouldn’t call it a cult from my limited experience and didn’t find it sinister in anyway.

10

So, what religion are they–Tibetan Buddhist, Chinese syncretist, or New Age? What are their main beliefs and goals? How many of them are there?

11

I present to you, The Church of Maradona or Iglesia Maradoniana.

12

It appears I’m not the only one who doesn’t like EWCP.

To wit

leavingtaipeicult.blogspot.com

Knowing my opinion of them, a friend forwarded this to me recently. I don’t know what to make of it because I have never been a part of EWCP. But, it sounds similar to what I have heard. Maybe some people have a good experience but after reading this, now I am happy I stayed away.

[ld][/ld]

13

Good work by whoever put up this blog. I was approached by someone from EWCP once but brushed them off. I didn’t know anything about EWCP at the time, but later recognized the guy who approached me from his picture in an article on their teahouse classes in a publication. I’ve run into so many of these types from various cultish organizations (as well as “freelance” gurus) over the years in Taiwan and find it really frustrating to see how many people fall for their BS.

14

You should probably disclose that’s your own post on that blog, on April 11. A bit disingenuous of you otherwise. You seem heavily invested in exposing this cult. Not that I’m trying in the least to defend them, they seem well creepy.

15

Michael Turton sort of promotes the EWCP:

michaelturton.blogspot.com/2011/ … treat.html

Considering he promotes the DPP I am not surprised :smiley:

16

Thank you Limoncello! I study this stuff, and I still can’t believe what nonsense people will put up with. Now maybe someone will come forward with information on who Khenchen Rinpoche / Mr. Chang really is…

17

:smiley:

Now it comes to my mind that he was mocking at Ma Yi Jou, saying that he belives to be an emperor or a god or something.

18

I’m not actually clear on whether this is just one person with an axe to grind… or symptoms of deeper problems behind the scenes. I’m more wary of EWCP than I was when I posted here several months ago… but even so, it is rather difficult to make falsifiable claims about this sort of thing, isn’t it?

19

Curious, Bear what makes you say Limoncello is the author of that blog? Well, other than he has only 9 posts to his name with more than half critical of EWCP.

Anyways, whoever wrote the blog obviously does have a massive axe to grind and maybe for good reason–reading through some of the posts, it does seem a bit too wacky and detailed to be a total fabrication. Scary stuff.

20

The Bear didn’t say I was the author of the blog and in fact I am not. I can’t be. Ive never been in the group. He said that I am the author of one testimonial. Yes. The link to the blog was forwarded to me by someone who knows that I don’t like EWCP. Because I saw two friends have their lives destroyed and watched them rebuild after that, I was interested in contributing a testimonial so I e-mailed it in then I linked here. I encouraged my friends to contribute too but that will be up to them. I have been the target of street recruitment from EWCP as well which was creepy and at times rude. Wouldn’t you have an interest in exposing them if you had more than one friend who experienced terrible things at their hands?