I lost to the Dark Side yesterday

Taiwan Parenting
81

You’re right. Bullying exists everywhere.

I was never bullied as a kid. I was big growing up and I was friends with just about everyone. And I never bullied anyone either. And my son has been fortunate to have gone through 6 and a half years in Taiwanese schools without a single incident that I am aware of.

Yet, as remote as the issue would seem to be for me, I consider bullying to be one of my primary pet peeves. And likewise, I consider teachers who allow bullying to go on and parents of bullies who feel that its just part of childhood (note that I do not think parents of those bullied are at fault unless they do nothing) and thus do nothing to stem the behavior to be very much in the wrong.

Again, I’ve no personal experience to draw on, but, the information re the results of bullying is out there and easily researchable. The problem of bullying is very serious in places such as Japan, where children and teens commit suicide in order to escape it. The idiots who committed the Columbine shootings in the US were apparently bullied. I don’t think it even necessary to look at these incidents to understand that bullying is wrong and that it can lead to serious actions/reactions.

DB is right I think to teach his boys to defend themselves. Unfortunately, that is sometimes the only thing we have… our ability to defend ourselves.

However, I think it very important, vital even, that the school be made to understand that bullying should not be tolerated under any circumstances. While my boy was never bullied at his school, I made it clear to each of his teachers that I would never tolerate any bullying. But, I have seen some woefully unenlightened behavior from some of my boy’s teachers in both grade school and now middle school. I have little confidence that without my constant reminders the teachers would lapse into incompetent neglect… and thus, I would simply advise DB and anyone else concerned with their children being bullied that they frequently remind the teachers and school that you are watching and will not accept bullying.

When my boy started first grade, I told his teacher that if my son was bullied I would be quite unhappy. She remarked that bullying happens all the time and is a “part of childhood”. I responded that if bullying is acceptable, then I will personally seek out the parents of the bully who harrasses my boy and I will bully them. She was shocked at that notion… but, she needed to be shocked.

Why in the world do we accept bullying among children when we do not accept it among adults?

82

[quote=“Tigerman”]When my boy started first grade, I told his teacher that if my son was bullied I would be quite unhappy. She remarked that bullying happens all the time and is a “part of childhood”. I responded that if bullying is acceptable, then I will personally seek out the parents of the bully who harrasses my boy and I will bully them. She was shocked at that notion… but, she needed to be shocked.

Why in the world do we accept bullying among children when we do not accept it among adults?[/quote]

Agree 100%. My words would be identical. I would simply tell the father that every thing his boy did to mine I would do to him.

I saw a kid being battered with a stick by a teacher turn around and beat the crap out of him. Really. A weedy little man and a big 15-year old.

Why was it right for the man to beat the boy but not the boy to beat the man?

Explain that to a nine-year old.

83

[quote=“hexuan”][quote=“Tigerman”]When my boy started first grade, I told his teacher that if my son was bullied I would be quite unhappy. She remarked that bullying happens all the time and is a “part of childhood”. I responded that if bullying is acceptable, then I will personally seek out the parents of the bully who harrasses my boy and I will bully them. She was shocked at that notion… but, she needed to be shocked.

Why in the world do we accept bullying among children when we do not accept it among adults?[/quote]

Agree 100%. My words would be identical. I would simply tell the father that every thing his boy did to mine I would do to him.

I saw a kid being battered with a stick by a teacher turn around and beat the crap out of him. Really. A weedy little man and a big 15-year old.

Why was it right for the man to beat the boy but not the boy to beat the man?

Explain that to a nine-year old.[/quote]

Good question. I feel the same way, or at least, felt the same way when I hit my teachers back when I was in middle school in TW. I was in big trouble, but it was worth it. (I know that violence begets violence…but some of the stuff the teachers did was just way out of line. My parents certainly weren’t going to stick up for me nor were my peers or other teachers. As furious as everyone was at the time, you bet the teachers picked on me less once they knew I didn’t just sit there and let them think up the next little twisted way to torture us in the name of good grades.)

Hmmmm, sorry about the rant and rave. Just want to say that I absolutely agree that teachers need to model for their students the desired values and behaviors. Yes.

84

I can’t say I agree with the outcome. The boy who brought a BB gun to school and capped off a round at a fellow student crossed a zero tolerance line in my mind. At the very least, the gun should be confiscated.

I think any reasonable person, including the boy’s parents, will understand this and it needn’t be done in a punitive way but some actions just shouldn’t be tolerated.

85

As an experiment, bring a BB gun into work and shoot a Taiwanese colleague in the face with it. Then ask him to sit down and discuss it with you, saying “paisay” and “duibuqi” a lot. See what he does.

Alternatively, get your kid to shoot his kid in the face. Then see what he does.

86

Yeah hexuan, those are good ideas. I was also thinking that maybe we could all get together and take turns shooting bob in the head and face with BB guns. Aim for the ears. I’m sure afterwards he’ll be satisfied to sit down and have a nice little chat about feelings. I’ll bring some great competition tea if someone else can manage the crumpets.

87

That sounds lovely.

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I am glad to hear things seem to be turning out without having to take it to the next level yourself, DB.
Just as a warning, though, when it comes down to parents physically intervening in bullying, you are taking a big risk. When I was in 6th grade, my sister and I had to wait across the street from our house at the bus stop to go to school. A girl there who had regularly used little racial slurs told me, “No niggers at my bus stop.” I, of course replied that it wasn’t her bus stop. She pushed me. I pushed her back and the dumb little bitch pushed me again instead of taking the advantage of the first hit. So I did. I had her good until my mother was getting ready to get in her car to go to work and saw the fight. She ran across the street and separated us (grabbing the girl a few seconds before grabbing me so I got in another punch) and held us apart while the other kids just stood in line like nothing was happening. When the driver pulled up, the only people who would vouch for her starting it was my mother and my little sister. The other 8 or so kids standing around said that I provoked her. Gee, I guess by being black. Then the girl started telling the driver that my mother choked her. That all stopped when my mother coolly said, “Child, if I had choked you, you wouldn’t be standing here saying it. Trust me.”
The three of us, the girl, my little sister (who was not involved in any way except being there), and I were all suspended from the bus for a month, but because the girl’s parents didn’t have a car, she was allowed to ride the bus anyway (nevermind that her parents also didn’t have jobs and that my single mother had to go to work before the time as we had to be at school…8:00 vs. 8:20am). The only thing that saved me from being punished even more severely through the rule the district had about people who instigated physical fights (and probably the only thing to ensure that she was punished fairly) was that one of the people who lived in the house where the stop was came out of his house and said that he heard what she said and watched from that point on. He was the only white person who said that she started it. And I was looking at being suspended from school.

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I used to get called “Murraymints” (a popular sweetie during the early Paleolithic). Some of the worse ones would even sing the ad jingle: “Murraymints, Murraymints, too good to hurry mints,” at me. It scarred me.

90

I used to get called sixty-nine or oral for having the most beautiful girlfriend in school, or drugs danny for having those kinds of friends. I don’t remember being bullied much, although I wasn’t a big kid, I was good at sport and in Australia that counts for a lot.

Since we are talking about 9 year olds, I’m amazed by those that cannot distinguish between the behavior of 9 year old kids and adults. I don’t think kids being bullies is necessary the fault of the parents. I have seen many bullies who had wonderful parents. In fact, I have some at my school. They are very concerned about their kids behavior when they bully others. As a teacher, so am I.