Ketogenic "Keto" diet in Taiwan


But this is the only fast I would do:




You know, that’s what really annoys me about the official advice, which basically tells people to eat less. It’s stupid. Nobody can “eat less” for any significant period of time, never mind for their entire lives. And what happens is that people inevitably fall off the wagon, and then berate themselves.


I received a health report from a recent health check which stated I had high LDL and should increase physical exercise and start a low cholesterol diet.

I haven’t been exercising as much these past 3 months due to general tiredness but still manage to run about 40Km a week and stretch daily. Now that I am starting a new training cycle that will gradually increase to 90km plus weight training etc. I’m as thin as I possibly can be and feel fitter than I ever have.

I don’t follow keto purposely, but I am very strict with what I eat, very little carbs but as a treat, and usually only in the form of veg or fruit. Most of my fats come from almonds, coconut oil, butter (i love butter), and meat. I’ve been known to eat fried chicken and fries.

Any experience with this kind of report result and how might I change my diet and exercise regime to satisfy the DR.?


Seems like you could genetically be predisposed to high cholesterol . Maybe.
Also high cholesterol doesn’t hurt everybody.
But to keep on the safe side…Still might be good to reduce it. Beyond exercise statins are the go to choice.
Sorry no useful advice.


My HDL numbers are quite high as well, which I understand to be a good thing.

I mention this partially because the treatment for high-ldl tends to be counter to what you find in a keto diet. I’m not overly concerned and was waiting for data to show the effects of the dietary and lifestyle choices I have made.


Build muscle. You are doing a lot of aerobic exercise but to produce and keep good cholesterol - which you need for good health,especially heart issues- you need to have muscle.

BTW fries and fruit are a no no in keto. Peanut butter in moderation. No sugar. Also, macros must be balanced. Too much protein ruins it. You need more green veggies to add potassium, which helps with blood pressure and metabolism.

The problem of low fat diets is that they are not satisfying and will tend to deprive of certain nutrients.


There is most likely nothing wrong with your cholesterol. For routine testing, LDL is calculated, not measured, and the calculation depends on a lot of assumptions that are only valid on a standard-issue high-carb diet:

Also, LDL and HDL are two ends of a transport chain. Crudely, LDL is packaged cholesterol going out to your cells, and HDL is scavenged cholesterol coming back. On low-carb, HDL tends to rise (which is what you want), while LDL may fall, rise, or do nothing at all; direct measurement is used in research projects. Some researchers assert that this HDL rebalancing is more important than the absolute value of LDL.

This article states bluntly what no doctor will admit: both LDL and HDL measurements have little predictive value for CVD risk, and LDL is even more useless than HDL:

Even if there were an actual problem, a “low cholesterol diet” will not change it. Your body synthesizes its own cholesterol, mostly, and it does so because it thinks it needs it.

TL;DR: without context, your “high” LDL reading has no physiological meaning, might be a measurement artifact, and doesn’t tell you anything useful about your CVD risk.

Just keep doing what you’re doing with your cardio routine. You don’t need to “satisfy the doctor”. It’s your body, not his. As Icon said, get some weights into your training programme, and ensure that you have enough fat and adequate salt in your diet (do NOT attempt to reduce your salt intake on low-carb - you’ll feel like crap, especially if you’re exercising).

Rather than sitting on the low-carb fence, you might just want to do a fat-adaptation cycle (which basically means two weeks of very low carbs and high-ish fat) and then see how you feel.

Do you have any gut feeling about the cause of “general tiredness”? Any major stresses in your life?


I do need more muscle in my upper body, I have the atypical runners skinny top but strong legs. It’s hard to build mass though when you are exhausted from other workouts.

Fries are a treat. As is ice cream and pizza. Life without ice cream is not worth living, imho. But I have that maybe once a month or less. I never eat peanuts as they are not “nuts”.


I’m certainly not on the low-carb fence. I’ve been living this lifestyle for years, long before keto hit the mainstream.

I find these kind of doctor’s advice funny. She said to me in the session that I should exercise more. I said to her, how is that possible? If I am injury free I run 3 marathons a year, am preparing for my first ultra, and exercise in the range of 3+ hours a day when training. I’m a late-bloomer but I get plenty of exercise.

I don’t know if sleep has much effect on the tests. I’ve slept like crap these past few months due to the stress of starting a new venture and moving to Canada.


Same here, 10+ years. Back then people were still writing essays about Atkins being an asshole and an idiot.

Yeah, honestly, there’s probably nothing wrong with you. Doctors rarely understand the nuances of their tests (or generally-applicable probability/statistical stuff about false positives, false negatives, correlation, and suchlike) and just look at the pass/fail lines. As you said, what more are you supposed to do? Are you sure you’re not already overtraining? 3+ hours a day seems like a lot for anyone over, say, 20.

I’m not a doctor, but I imagine that would result in “general tiredness” :slight_smile:

Simply doing regular, hard exercise reduces your heart disease risk by something like 90%. In other words, it’s a more important factor than practically anything else, independent of test results for surrogate markers.


Egg and cheese omelette at Diner only 4 net carbs.


For most people, it’s carbohydrates, not fats, that are the true cause of heart disease.


I make far fewer trips to the restroom for a sit-down break. Used to be two or three times a day, now once a day or even once every 2 or 3 days.

More free time, or less sitting and thinking time.


TMI but aside from a regular digestion, you will also enjoy less embarrassing gas escapes under keto.


So what do you guys eat in Taiwan? What’s easily available. I try to do a low carb diet for dinners, and I do realize low carb is not equal to keto. So far, it’s meat (usually beef), vegetables, and a bit of fruit for my dinners. I guess not all fruit is good for the diet but I’m willing to sacrifice a bit of effectiveness.

What else can you do in Taiwan? Avocados are available everywhere. Whipping cream for coffee. Vegetables (but not things like potatoes, I know). And then that’s about as far as my knowledge about what’s good goes. My real question is what good, fatty foods in Taiwan am I overlooking?


You can’t find fatty food in Taiwan? :slight_smile:

There’s a Hakka thingy made with stewed pork and bamboo shoots that’s really good. Unfortunately the only place I know that does it is out near Taoyuan.


I’m fine with the fatty meats! I had a Korean barbecue dinner yesterday- lots of meat (not the marinated bulgogi crap), lots of veggies. And I love that dong po rou you mentioned. If it’s that easy, I’ll just continue with what I’m doing, I guess. But things like avocados is counterintuitive to me because I don’t think of anything in the fruit and vegetable category as being fatty.

And I love milk, the full fat stuff. But I guess maybe that’s not good?


I guess this isn’t dong po rou you were talking of.


Basically no fruit. At all. It upsets my stomach.

Vegetables are an impotant part of teh diet. I prepare a salad to go in the morning. I try to avoid iceberg and romaine, do not like teh taste. Anything else is game as long as it is green: broccoli, asparragus, cucumber, etc. Capsicum is nice too, little tomatoes. Balsamic vinegar and olive oil. I try to eat this during the day or at night, once a day at least.

For breakfast, I add veggies to my omelett: capsicum, onions, mushrooms, etc. Cheese. One or two links of sausage or ham. Not a fan a bacon but it is recommended.

Cruciferous vegetables are good for minerals and other nutrients. Fruits are not as rich. So get cabbage, get cauliflower. Cabbage can be prepared with bacon as a side, or as coleslaw, for example. Mayo is your friend now.

Try pork belly, duck meat, all chicken parts. I also have a lot of fish, mostly fried. Shrimp is easy to prepare.


I do IF with mostly low carb foods. I don’t eat all day (at all) and eat dinner some time after 7:00pm. I like to eat frozen mixed vegetables with a bunch of chicken nuggets. Its easy to prepare and I don’t have to worry what I’ll be eating that day. If I’m still hungry I will eat fruits like watermelon, grapefruit, apples and pears. I also add a lot of pink salt to my veggies and pay attention to drink a lot of water. I also don’t poo very often :blush: