My dog and I got attacked

Life Pets & Domestic Animals
1

I went to the park near my house two days ago with my dog. There are a bunch of dog owners who go there after 10PM to let their dogs play together. My dog always has a great time and gets a lot of exercise.

Last month a guy showed up with two beautiful Pit-Bulls. One huge male and one female. The female was off the leash along with most of the other dogs playing. The guy said that he didn’t want to let the male off the leash incase he got into a fight with the other dogs. I had two thoughts about that.

  1. That was a pretty responsible decision

  2. More importantly, why is his dog so agressive and poorly trained?

Around 11 o’clock when most of the dogs had gone home the guy let the male off the leash to play with my dog and two others that were stlill there. My dog and his got along great and were chasing each other and having a good time.

Two days ago when I was there all the dogs had gone home. My gf and I stayed to play badminton. My dog was running around the badminton court area while we were playing. Out of the corner of my eye I saw a dog running and I called my dog over and leashed him. I walked over and it was the same male pit that I saw last month.

My gf and I said hi to the owners and asked them why they were there so late walking their dogs and the guy said “We come here so late cause our dogs are so dangerous”.

He leashed his dogs and went on his way. When my gf an I had finished playing badminton I leashed mine and we went to leave the park.

On the way we ran into that guy and his dogs who were running around playing. The big male approached my dog and they did the Mexican stand off thing. They smelled each others buts and then froze for a moment. A second later his dog pounced on mine and was in attack mode.

My dog freaked out and started yelping cause he got bit. I grabbed my dog and lifted him up over my head (he’s pretty big. Almost 30kgs) and the other dog started jumping on me and bit my hand. I was pretty lucky to get away from it with only a minor cut on my left hand and a bit of a painful right with no punctures.

The guy grabbed his dog and leashed it and I left fast.

There is a guy who goes to the park often that always has his dog tied up. It a big male Bull-Dog. Ugly-cute as hell. We were talking to him a couple of weeks ago and he was saying that there are dog fighting matches on a regular basis and told us the general area where they are held.

I tried to get more info out of him but he wouldn’t divulge.

He then went on to tell me that the guy with the two pit’s got them from a litter of the Chiayi champion dog fighter.

I am going to try and find out where and when these fights happen and bust their asses. I know it’s probably dangerous as hell doing so but i’ll be discreet as to not get my legs broken or worse by some thugs.

Riding a bit of a bleedin’ hangover so pardon the choopy/poor writing.

2

Good for you! :bravo:

Sorry you and your dog got bitten, though.

Contact the people at EAST; they’re the closest thing to an RSPCA currently and like to do investigations into deliberate acts of cruelty, particularly where a number of animals are involved: http://www.east.org.tw/ The website’s all in Chinese, but they do have English speakers there if you need them.

Let us know how it goes - it’s amazing that you want to do something; just be very careful, please.

3

I came across a ‘rule of thumb’ once: if your pet falls under attack by another animal, under no circumstances pick your pet up. Doing so will certainly redirect the attack onto yourself even as your defense is handicapped by the holding of your pet.

I’m not gong to preach - gotta be the toughest advice for a pet owner to follow.

Also highlights the downside of living in a country without a real system of law and order. This guy will continue to act irresponsibly until someone’s child is dead. Even then he will probably get off. Taiwanese just don’t give a shit.

Simple solution: Stay away from that park in the evenings … you certainly had warnings.

4

[quote=“Opihiman”]I came across a ‘rule of thumb’ once: if your pet falls under attack by another animal, under no circumstances pick your pet up. Doing so will certainly redirect the attack onto yourself even as your defense is handicapped by the holding of your pet.

I’m not gong to preach - gotta be the toughest advice for a pet owner to follow.

Also highlights the downside of living in a country without a real system of law and order. This guy will continue to act irresponsibly until someone’s child is dead. Even then he will probably get off. Taiwanese just don’t give a shit.

Simple solution: Stay away from that park in the evenings … you certainly had warnings.[/quote]

My Taiwanese gf certainly “gives a shit” about this situation so your sweeping racist generalization about Taiwanese people is incorrect.

As for your first statement, I agree. I think picking my dog up was putting me in harms way. But I think of my dog as one of my children (of which I have none) and will do anything to protect him.

In the future I’ll just make sure to go to the park a bit earlier to avoid running into that dog.

5

Carry a can of mace with you in future, and Mace the damn thing, it’s better than fighting it.

6

That’s a good idea. Thanks for the advice.

Is it legal here?

7

[quote=“Lo Bo To”]
My Taiwanese gf certainly “gives a shit” about this situation so your sweeping racist generalization about Taiwanese people is incorrect …[/quote]

Pardon, what ‘race’ is Taiwanese? Lots of Chinese in other parts of the world elect leaders who institute and enforce rule of law.

Your gf?? Whatever …

8

I was going to say the same thing.

9

[quote=“Lo Bo To”]I went to the park near my house two days ago with my dog. There are a bunch of dog owners who go there after 10PM to let their dogs play together. My dog always has a great time and gets a lot of exercise.

Last month a guy showed up with two beautiful Pit-Bulls. One huge male and one female. The female was off the leash along with most of the other dogs playing. The guy said that he didn’t want to let the male off the leash incase he got into a fight with the other dogs. I had two thoughts about that.

  1. That was a pretty responsible decision

  2. More importantly, why is his dog so agressive and poorly trained?

Around 11 o’clock when most of the dogs had gone home the guy let the male off the leash to play with my dog and two others that were stlill there. My dog and his got along great and were chasing each other and having a good time.

Two days ago when I was there all the dogs had gone home. My gf and I stayed to play badminton. My dog was running around the badminton court area while we were playing. Out of the corner of my eye I saw a dog running and I called my dog over and leashed him. I walked over and it was the same male pit that I saw last month.

My gf and I said hi to the owners and asked them why they were there so late walking their dogs and the guy said “We come here so late cause our dogs are so dangerous”.

He leashed his dogs and went on his way. When my gf an I had finished playing badminton I leashed mine and we went to leave the park.

On the way we ran into that guy and his dogs who were running around playing. The big male approached my dog and they did the Mexican stand off thing. They smelled each others buts and then froze for a moment. A second later his dog pounced on mine and was in attack mode.

My dog freaked out and started yelping cause he got bit. I grabbed my dog and lifted him up over my head (he’s pretty big. Almost 30kgs) and the other dog started jumping on me and bit my hand. I was pretty lucky to get away from it with only a minor cut on my left hand and a bit of a painful right with no punctures.

The guy grabbed his dog and leashed it and I left fast.

There is a guy who goes to the park often that always has his dog tied up. It a big male Bull-Dog. Ugly-cute as hell. We were talking to him a couple of weeks ago and he was saying that there are dog fighting matches on a regular basis and told us the general area where they are held.

I tried to get more info out of him but he wouldn’t divulge.

He then went on to tell me that the guy with the two pit’s got them from a litter of the Jiayi champion dog fighter.

I am going to try and find out where and when these fights happen and bust their asses. I know it’s probably dangerous as hell doing so but I’ll be discreet as to not get my legs broken or worse by some thugs.

Riding a bit of a bleedin’ hangover so pardon the choopy/poor writing.[/quote]

Why is the arsehole selling those dogs as pets ? Probably because he is a greedy feuk that wants to make more money than he does already. What jerk sells champion fighting dogs to pet owners?

Yeah bust this guy. Kick up a stink. Get him busted.

10

That’s a good idea. Thanks for the advice.

Is it legal here?[/quote]

Forget mace, just pick up a few big rocks. That’s what I do when it’s obvious I’m about to be threatened by a threatening dog.

And to those who say that’s cruel, it’s not the dog’s fault it’s the owner’s I say :raspberry:

Self defense. Do whatever it takes.

11

Not cruel - just not a good idea. If you raise the level of aggression against a truly aggressive dog you’re going to get somebody bitten. The problem I witness is that people completely misunderstand what constitutes a threatening dog. I’ve been here nine years and probably encountered 200 times as many stray animals as any of you, yet I’ve only ever been threatened once (a nip) and that was because I had just caught her pup; it was a complete surprise, because she didn’t bark to warn me. I’ve never seen a dog attack somebody and bite them, but I have seen people turn barking dogs into aggressive dogs by making a mistake in judging the dogs intention.

Throw rocks at dogs, and you’ll create a dog who sees people as a threat. You will be making the problem worse.

Do the right thing and simply stand your ground and mentally claim your personal space without eyeballing the dog. Use a stick or similar only to increase the size of your claimed space, not as a threat. Works like magic. Read dog whisperer Cesar Millan’s “Be the Pack Leader” and go to the appendix to read the same advice.

Just don’t want to see other people (the ones walking along after you) get hurt. :wink:

That’s a good idea. Thanks for the advice.

Is it legal here?[/quote]

Forget mace, just pick up a few big rocks. That’s what I do when it’s obvious I’m about to be threatened by a threatening dog.

And to those who say that’s cruel, it’s not the dog’s fault it’s the owner’s I say :raspberry:

Self defense. Do whatever it takes.[/quote]

12

Mace is legal in Taiwan although it usually comes as ‘self defense’ spray or ‘pepper spray’ or something similar, I have so far seen it for sale in Home Box, B&Q, some RT Marts and I always keep a can in my car just in case.
It’s better to use pepper spray in some situations I feel as there is perhaps less chance of accidental death when used in self defense. Further more I agree that a dog may not necessarily see all people as a threat just because one decides to defend themselves when warranted, and yes, I do see frightened dogs that may be inclined to bite simply because people hit them all the time for simply hanging around. I have even seen a police officer take a swing at a dog crossing the road before when simply minding its own business.

13

I’ve read a bit about the use of pepper spray on dogs and am not sure what to think.

Most sources seem to agree that it is the best deterrent against agressive dogs but I read about one cop who said that he tried it on more than one pit bull and it didn’t work. That it just made the dog more angry.

I kind of find this hard to believe cause that is what bear repellant is made of and bears are certainly a lot tougher and bigger than any dog.

My questions are these:

  1. If an agressive dog is heading my way, what would be the best way to protect myself?

  2. If an agressive dog attacks my dog and looks like it’s going to harm or kill it, what would be the best course of action?

In the case of another dog attacking mine, if I were to light up a rolled up newspaper for example. Would that frighten the dog away?

This is the first confrontation of it’s kind I have ever had in my life and I’ve grown up with dogs so the chances of it happening again any time soon are not that great but what if it does?

Any ideas or advice?

14

If you’re thinking it’s aggressive, that’s a big part of the problem. Just stay calm, keep walking, ignore the dog, and you should be fine. Dogs feed on fear and have great respect for calm assertiveness.

I was discussing this with Belgian Pie today (someone who behaves exactly the right way around barking dogs, and is respected throughout his community because of it … amongst the canine members anyway :wink:). If a dog is already attacking your dog and your dog is about to get seriously hurt, or maybe already is, then you need to get physical.

Do not shout or scream, as this just excites the dog more, although making a loud noise with something like a wooden spoon on a saucepan can work a charm, but most dog-walkers tend not to have these to hand.

Stay away from the biting end, and do not grab either dog (he will think the other dog is biting him and will become even more aggressive; also, you could inadvertently turn a puncture wound into a nasty tear if you try to pull the aggressor off).

The thing to do is to firmly push the flank of the aggressive dog. That is, a sideways shove, or push with the foot, accompanied with a short, sharp noise (a ‘tsst!’ or ‘hey!’). This distracts the dog while also pushing him into a more submissive frame of mind, and is usually enough to make him loosen his grip on the other dog. You have now demonstrated in the dog’s own language that you are superior and he will be more submissive because of it (an alpha will ‘throw his weight around’ and will shove his flank into the flank of other dogs to demonstrate his confidence in his status as top dog).

The dog will be leaning sideways and probably looking up at you, and this is the time to step forward assertively and look threateningly at the shoved dog. Make sure he backs well away before you pick up your own dog, if you need to. The non aggressor will not usually try to re-instigate, but do be prepared to do the same to him should he show an interest in still fighting. Having something to hand to act as a personal-space-increasing barrier is a good idea - a walking stick or umbrella is ideal; use it as a way to increase your claimed space, not as a weapon.

This is what we do at the holding centre, and it works. Pushing the flank enables you to break up a potentially dangerous conflict with the minimum of risk to yourself and the dogs. Be sure to show your confidence. Hurting the aggressor in mid-fight is more likely to make matters worse - ask anyone who’s tried hitting an aggressive dog to get him to release his hold on another.

Maybe. Never tried it. But they do respect calm assertiveness for certain, and it’s easire to ignite. :wink:

15

[quote=“Lo Bo To”]I’ve read a bit about the use of pepper spray on dogs and am not sure what to think.

Most sources seem to agree that it is the best deterrent against agressive dogs but I read about one cop who said that he tried it on more than one pit bull and it didn’t work. That it just made the dog more angry.

I kind of find this hard to believe cause that is what bear repellant is made of and bears are certainly a lot tougher and bigger than any dog.

My questions are these:

  1. If an agressive dog is heading my way, what would be the best way to protect myself?

  2. If an agressive dog attacks my dog and looks like it’s going to harm or kill it, what would be the best course of action?

In the case of another dog attacking mine, if I were to light up a rolled up newspaper for example. Would that frighten the dog away?

This is the first confrontation of it’s kind I have ever had in my life and I’ve grown up with dogs so the chances of it happening again any time soon are not that great but what if it does?

Any ideas or advice?[/quote]

Can i just clarify something about pitbulls ,as I do have a fair amount of experience with them. A so called “game dog” is a dog that doesn’t behave like a normal dog. They have been bred by breeders over many years, not to follow the normal behavior of dominance and submission. Normally if two dogs fight then one dog eventually roles onto its back and submits. The aggressor normally will then not continue fighting. However with a “game” pitbull not only will it carry on and kill the submitting dog, but it will also fight to the death even if badly wounded. So for these kind of dogs, normal dog psychology usually does not work. Fortunately these kind of dogs are fairly rare walking around in parks. So yes a bear may run as it is programmed for self preservation, “game” pitbulls have been bred to go against “nature” and continue to attack even sometimes if it means death.
They are not concerned with self preservation. If you are going to take on a game pitbull then there is no room for messing about, i suggest you avoid these dogs as best as possible, or if you really need to physically intervene then you’d better have a very good weapon and not just mace.

I suggest you report this incident to the cops, the dog bit you! These dogs may kill a child or at the very least someone’s pet dog.

16

An interesting point.

Cesar Millan (National Geographic’s ‘Dog Whisperer’) has a rescue centre full of fighting dogs who now live happily amongst all manner of other breeds. I’d be interested to know if he changed his methods for them. I remember seeing his program where a fight kicked off amongst among a couple of them once, and he used the flank shove and alpha roll, but it may be because he had already worked on the animal beforehand.

Still, as you said, even a game pit-bull can be submitting to a superior. Just make sure you’re the superior and the dog knows it.

17

An interesting point.

Cesar Millan (National Geographic’s ‘Dog Whisperer’) has a rescue centre full of fighting dogs who now live happily amongst all manner of other breeds. I’d be interested to know if he changed his methods for them. I remember seeing his program where a fight kicked off amongst among a couple of them once, and he used the flank shove and alpha roll, but it may be because he had already worked on the animal beforehand.

Still, as you said, even a game pit-bull can be submitting to a superior. Just make sure you’re the superior and the dog knows it.[/quote]

I am interested to try the method now lol! Just adding caution to the wind so to speak, when it comes to dealing with some pits as they are not exactly the most “natural” of dogs.

Interesting stats on dog bites here.
lawcore.com/animal-and-dog-b … stics.html

Most interesting was that males get bitten more than females. I was expecting the opposite.

18

I was once told that to train a dog to stop jumping up on people, the master should lightly bend its forepaws downward. Just enough to cause a little distress. I’ve always thought that if I was attacked by a dog, I would try to use this approach in a slightly more aggressive fashion, ie: break it’s paws. I, of course, hope I am never put in this situation and I love SD’s advice of the Alpha Roll (role?), but I would like some feedback on this paw bend if the roll didn’t work?

Also, just how does one increase one’s territory/personal space with an umbrella or walking stick. Do I point it at the dog?

LBT, sorry to hear about your attack. Be careful. Gangsters are much more vicious than dogs.

19

Quick response because in a hurry:

To stop a dog jumping up, simply turn and ignore - behaving aloof will send a clearer message than pain, believe it or not. Not sure how it would work with a dog attacking you. I would imagine that an attacking dog would be at your ankle (most that I know of) or your face (dog attacks on children, anyway - thanks for the stats fenlander!).

The alpha roll itself is a dangerous move - stick with the flank shove, which is far, far safer and more productive (the alpha roll will immediately take the fight out of a dog if done correctly; if done wrong, he will think he is about to die and will fight even harder). Stick with the flank shove.

And you use an umbrella or stick vertically, like a third leg, as it were. Use it as a barrier, but to a dog it will seem like an extension of your body, and you and your space will be perceived to be larger, and the stick won’t be hurt by a nip. Just keep it between you and the dog at all times. Millan used a tennis racket in one episode to keep something between himself and an aggressive dog. He calmly backed the dog into a corner with it, and within minutes was sitting calmly next to the dog, who had learned to succumb to his calm dominance.

Whatever you do, don’t wave the stick around - this makes dogs very excited. Use it as a solid extension of your body, a vertical barrier between you and the dog.

20

In 2000 a group of scientists published a special report in the peer reviewed Journal of American Veterinary Medicine, entitled “Breeds of dogs involved in fatal human attacks in the United States between 1979 and 1998.” The report states:

Under “Results,” the report continues:

I recommend clicking on the link and viewing tables 1 and 2. Pit bull types and Rottweilers, whether purebred or mixed, account for a disproportionate number of human DBRF. The report does discuss limitations on the data, but states:

A lot of people on this forum have expressed dismay (even anger) at the suggestion that certain breeds of dogs are more inherently dangerous than others. I really don’t understand that reaction. Dogs were bred with specific purposes in mind. Dogs that displayed the desired characteristics were bred, same was done for their pups, etc. Thus we have retrievers, herders, gazehounds, scent hounds, bulldogs, pit bulls, etc. I don’t think it should come as any particular surprise that certain breeds would be more prone to violence. This isn’t a blanket condemnation of all Rottweilers or pit bull types. This isn’t a proposition to cull their breeds off the face of the planet. But they are more likely to harm and kill humans. That’s what the stats say. If anyone can produce a scientific rebuttal to the above report, I’d love to see it.