I am in back in Toronto with my Taiwanese fiancee who is Christian (I’m Agnostic)
A couple of weeks ago we were in a food court about to eat dinner and she started to pray. It made me feel a bit uncomfortable but I don’t like the fact that it did. I am not religious but I think of myself as an open minded person.
I talked to her about it and said that I don’t think it is really something that people do here but if she still wants to that it wouldn’t be a problem either way.
But then the other day we were in the waiting room at the hospital. It was a cancer ward and my mother and I were going in for an appointment. When I came out she was sitting there praying in the middle of the waiting room full of people. This also made me feel quite uncomfortable. I talked to her about it and she agreed that maybe that wasn’t an approprate place as well. (We did get some good news about my Mom so maybe it worked )
I’m a little confused about my feelings about this. I don’t know why it makes me feel this way.
We got into a bit of a tiff about it and she thinks that I am trying to come between her and God. I just said that I was trying to point out a possible (I might be mistaken. Haven’t lived here in 10 years) cultural sensitivity/difference.
[quote=“Lo Bo To”]I am in back in Toronto with my Taiwanese fiancee who is Christian.
A couple of weeks ago we were in a food court about to eat dinner and she started to pray. It made me feel a bit uncomfortable but I don’t like the fact that it did. I am not religious but I think of myself as an open minded person.
I talked to her about it and said that I don’t think it is really something that people do here but if she still wants to that it wouldn’t be a problem either way.
But then the other day we were in the waiting room at the hospital. It was a cancer ward and my mother and I were going in for an appointment. When I came out she was sitting there praying in the middle of the waiting room full of people. This also made me feel quite uncomfortable. I talked to her about it and she agreed that maybe that wasn’t an approprate place as well. (We did get some good news about my Mom so maybe it worked )
I’m a little confused about my feelings about this. I don’t know why it makes me feel this way. Does anyone else feel the same way?[/quote]
I’m ok with public prayer, as long as hands aren’t being held outstretched to the heavens whilst the person is swaying to unheard music. That’s just distracting.
Prayer is a very personal thing. I’ve prayed in public before, but I do it in a pretty unnoticeable way. The way I see it, it’s between me and God, and it’s not something that I need to advertise. I’m not ashamed, though.
Talking to imaginary friends is something you should have grown out of. If you want to do it, fine but do it in private or with like minded people or others may think you’re a bit mad.
I like the idea of questioning why you are disturbed about it. I get bugged about something or other that somebody is doing and I sometimes wonder why, if it doesn’t affect me, should I care. I’ve started talking to myself more and more and yesterday there was this guy behind me who was talking to himself, and I’m thinking, “Damn, is that me?”
You might point your fiancee this way: [quote=“Matthew 6:6]”]But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.[/quote]
But do so carefully. Most Christians in Taiwan are converts, or the sons and daughters of converts, and generally tend to be far more demonstrative (rather than staid). Lacking mature, established church institutions, they also tend to hold a number of beliefs not well founded in scripture or practice. Also for most, conversion means turning their backs on deeply entrenched cultural practices and more than a few painful confrontations with friends and family, which tends to make one defensive.
[quote=“Maoman”]I’m ok with public prayer, as long as hands aren’t being held outstretched to the heavens whilst the person is swaying to unheard music. That’s just distracting.
Prayer is a very personal thing. I’ve prayed in public before, but I do it in a pretty unnoticeable way. The way I see it, it’s between me and God, and it’s not something that I need to advertise. I’m not ashamed, though.
[/quote]
I’m with Maoman on this one. I also pray in public on occasion, but silently. It is an important part of my life but I don’t impose it on others, therefore the silence. It is no different than having a quiet conversation with another person… just… quieter.
I have seen many people in many parts of the world pray in public - it really isn’t all that unusual and you have most likely witnessed it yourself but paid no notice because it didn’t affect you personally. Your girlfriend’s prayer did affect you as in a sense you see your relationship with her as (for lack of a better term)an extension of you and as a result, you were embarrassed. Perfectly understandable.
As for praying in a hospital… as a nurse in North America I saw it done countless times. Hospitals are where most people feel fear and look for solace of one kind or another. This is why most hospitals have multi-faith chapels. When a person is in distress however, taking the time to look for a place in which to pray is not usually a priority, thus one prays where one presently is.
Celebrate the fact that she prays! It certainly can’t do any harm to anyone and who knows… could do some good! Sure beats listening to the loud ranting and raving we are so accustomed to hearing day in and day out in the everyday world!
You say, “It certainly can’t do any harm to anyone, and who knows… could do some good!”
That’s what I used to think, and maybe you’re right.
I honestly don’t care if people pray in public, but I don’t believe it works. You should be careful not to let any sick person know that you are praying for them; it seems to give them “performance anxiety” and results in a worse outcome.
The Templeton Foundation (Christian people that would want to show that prayer works on a personal level) funded what seems to be the best study to date (led by Dr. Benson, who believes in the power of personal prayer) on the efficacy of prayer. With three groups of similar heart patients (1800 patients over a decade?). . .
Some patients were prayed for (didn’t know if they were).
Some patients were not prayed for (didn’t know if they were)
Some patients were prayed for and knew they were being prayed for.
The results of the first two groups were the same. Prayer didn’t help.
The third group performed significantly worse (More post-op complications) than the others.
Alternatively, if they aren’t self-important pigfuckers, they might respect your right to freedom of belief, just as you respect theirs.[/quote]
LBT, I went to a university where people prayed over their meals in the dorm cafeteria. I was religious myself at the time (I’m not religious these days), but I always felt that prayer was such a private thing that it shouldn’t be so obviously on display. I usually blessed my food/gave thanks before leaving my dorm room, or if I did pray publicly, I just bowed my head and closed my eyes for a moment, praying silently.
It might bother you because it’s such a private thing, and you don’t think it should be on display for others to see, sort of like you’d give your fiancee a head’s up if she experienced a clothing malfunction in public. Maybe you just feel that if prayer really is a sacred communication, it should be private, or it should be offered up only in front of an appropriate audience of like-minded people, e.g. in church.
Leave her alone. If that’s what gives her comfort, who are you to question? OK, if she’s holy rolling or speaking in tongues or handling rattlers in the waiting room then you maybe have cause for concern – but purely from the point of view of her “making a scene?” simply in the act of folding her hands or kneeling down to pray? Come on! Even I’VE prayed in a cancer ward. AND an AIDS ward – OK, so it was to the god of salmon fishing, which is the only deity I’m on personal terms with, but still, he’s a fucking GOD, for heaven’s sake. Any port in a storm is how I look at it.
On the other hand, if its making you uncomfortable… then maybe you should look to yourself? I dunno.
For myself, I can even tolerate Rangers supporters – Christ! I can even be in the same room as Maoman!! AND the chief!! at the same time!!! – so I’m maybe not the best judge.
LBT -
The problem is yours.
You’re the one who needs to learn how to deal with something that is beyond your understanding and acceptance.
Yeah, I’m a Christian…a bad one at best. I pray before some meals…I pray before sleeping…and G-d knows I pray when I have to deal with these damn rice worms in traffic.
So, while you’re going to get some slimey ‘edumacated’ butt pats on your position of non-acceptance and “Oh how stupid these people who pray must be…”…its your problem…not hers.
She, or anyone else doing the praying is doing it to honor her beliefs…not yours. She may actually be including you in her prayers…we tend to do things like that…ain’t that a hoot!
Like I said, I’m a poor Christian…I drink…I cuss…Iand I have the semi-regular impure thought (Being married its mostly not in the erotico arena)…but one thing I don’t do is judge people by whether they ‘pray in public’ or not.
Hell…today is bai-bai day in Tainan…You gonna go bitch at those doing the bai-bai burning when they do the bows with the incense?
Shit…this ain’t nothin’ but another Christian bashing thread…GTFU.
And another thing…its been scientifically shown that prayer can work…miracles…
I pray in public (typically before food), though silently. However, I’ve seen and heard more than one Taiwanese person pray in public, typically before food. Sometimes one person praying for their meal, at other times a mother praying for the meal of herself and the children, once or twice a father praying for the meal of himself and his family.
It’s not really about whether a bunch of guys on the internet pray, it’s about how he feels when his girlfriend does it in public, back on his home turf. Also, there’s pretty much no way to not get stared at for weirdo-niss in Taiwan. I guess you’re just feeling a bit of what she feels all the time in the 'wan.
It can be odd if your boyfriend/girlfriend does culturally incongruent things in public. I know it makes my boy squirm when I act all anglo-saxon in his tiny village; he has to live there and have things get back to his mother, whereas I, who am used to being the foreign freak, couldn’t care less. I get pissed off when he starts swearing in tongues about minor annoyances.
The praying; it would annoy me, in a partner but then I’m not a practicing Christian and am not really attracted to 'em. What others choose to do doesn’t really bother me. I am pretty much unembarrassable, though.
Why specifically does it annoy you? Do you worry that others will judge her, or that she’s a target for crime if she’s got her eyes shut in a foodcourt? Do public displays in general give you the creeps? Dig into your motivations a bit and figure out what it is, a little more.
) 
That’s just distracting.
