She says she's conservative - is this for real?

Life Dating & Relationships
1

I’ve dated one Taiwanese girl about eight times in the last couple months. On about date four, when I leaned in to kiss her goodnight for the first time, she said just kiss her on the cheek because it’s embarassing (out on the street). The next date, I dropped her off at her place when no one was on the street and leaned in again. That time, she says just kiss her on the cheek because she’s conservative. The next time, in the same situation, she said, “why do you want to kiss me on the lips?” I said, “because I like you.” She said, “so you think just because you like someone, you can just kiss them on the lips?” Last night, coming home at 6AM, it was the same situation.

Background – she’s 25, pretty, studied in LA for five years, comes from south of Taichung. I speak Mandarin just fine and she speaks English nearly perfectly. I said to her last night, “I assumed because you are very pretty and sweet that you’ve had boyfriends” and she said not many.

I’m sure she’s into me because she holds my hand whenever we go out, tells me I’m really handsome, smart, etc., stayed out with me late on Chinese New Year’s eve before heading home the next morning because “it’s romantic,” told me on New Year’s that she wishes I was with her and that she wants to bring me home, gives me little presents, leans up on me when we walk in the park, etc.

I’m willing to take it slow, especially sex, but for me, at the end of a really fun night to not even be able to touch lips or cuddle is really frustrating. It also leads to an awkward moment at the end where I could either be so patient as to show less interest than before, or keep trying and seem pushy.

To be sure, there are a few things about me that could lead her to take it slow – I am leaving here in less than a year (but not going too far away), she could think I am a foreign playboy-type (which I’m not much, especially if there’s one person I like). But rather than guess about it, I think on our next date, I need to have a “where are we going” conversation.

She did say when we started going out that she wanted to take it slowly, and I said I did too. But I’ve never dated anyone who was this “conservative.” I’m writing here to see if any other foreign guys have had similar experiences, or if any women here have any perspective.

Thanks!

2

Is she worth being patient for?
My boyfriend and I dated almost 2 months before he kissed me. Some people move very slowly.
In my opinion, good things come to those who wait.
I trust my man more than other men (girls from the girl’s forum can quit laughing now) because it took me forever to get him in bed. So I know he isn’t giving it out.
Some people (and I am one of them) will make a man wait a LONG time simply because it weeds out the ones who don’t think we are worth waiting for.
Making a woman feel rushed and pressured will make her more worried and make her move more slowly. On the other hand, you need to establish what YOU want. You moving away in one year might be a MAJOR aspect in all this. I would not get involved with a man who was moving in a year.

3

SAF has probably hit the nail on the head. Nothing to add, but since I know someone on Forumosa just has to say this, I will get it over with:

She’s a psycho. Get rid of her like old garbage. She’ll only bring you trouble and insist you pay for her grannie’s funeral after the first date, her mother’s orthotics after the second, and her father’s viagra prescription after the third. Stay far, far away.

“Ahhhhhhhhh!!!”

(Sound you should be making right now as you run.)

4

[quote=“SuchAFob”]
Making a woman feel rushed and pressured will make her more worried and make her move more slowly. On the other hand, you need to establish what YOU want. You moving away in one year might be a MAJOR aspect in all this. I would not get involved with a man who was moving in a year.[/quote]

I think she’s worth being patient for, and I am in general a very patient guy anyway. But we don’t really know each other that well, so we’ll see… I’m mostly curious how to deal with any awkwardness at the end of the date. From what you said about making what I want clear, I guess it wouldn’t hurt to “have the talk” just to let her know how I see things going (I like you, I think we could be serious, I would come back and see you, etc.) and also get her view.

About not rushing or pressure, do you think by me keeping on trying at the end of the date and gracefully taking any rejection, would that create “pressure”? I don’t think so, right… I wouldn’t ever say anything like, “I need xxx, or else…” Oh well, last night she gave me a kiss on the cheek too.

Thanks for the input!

5

If you think this is it and you’d prefer to be in for the long haul then all the best to you, try not to break her heart. I think it would be better to approach the “what happens when you leave” subject sooner rather than later, as girls are usually practical and no doubt it is an influence on where this is all going.

You may want to stock up on filth in the meantime, as you probably have a long wait :smiley:

6

Oooooh this sounds so familiar…

I’ve been seeing this girl for about three months now and she’s also cute and educated and all that. Although her English is pretty good, she didn’t study or live overseas. It took me about a month before she would let me kiss her on the lips. Before that it was just a good bye hug. After about two months some heavy petting was allowed and when I thought more would ensue she said, “No. I want to wait until I’m married…”

I know her cousin and several foreigners and Taiwanese that know her well and she has never done more than kiss anyone (I know this for another reason too, but I’m not willing to divulge that on a public forum. Use your imagination) even though she’s already 26.

In a way this is great and I really respect her for that. But on the other hand it can get a little frustrating. Although, it does raise the question, am I serious enough about her to wait until I marry her (if it ever leads to that) before getting more than kissing and fooling around a bit? I know I really like her and I’m even falling in love with her slowly, but it can get frustrating, and I’m NOT willing to pressure her to do more.

So in the end (as with you, I guess) it really comes down to how serious I am about this girl and what I want to get out of the relationship.

At the moment I don’t really have an answer to that question…

7

At first I was gonna say to the OP that this girl is playing the coy goodie girl game. But as I kept reading, I’m thinking that it’s just in Taiwan culture to take it slow. Kinda of like in Japanese culture, you could know a person for years before they call you a friend. It’s just a matter of time with the belief that the longer you know the person, the better you can get to know them.

In a way it’s good that in some parts of the world, people are waiting before having sex. It’s quaint, concervative, boring, frustrating, etc. But you can never say that if you break up it’s because it moved to fast. :laughing:

If you wanna wait then wait. If you don’t then don’t. Cool to respect her needs/desires/wants, but you gotta remember your needs are important too.

Best of luck :rainbow:

8

If you’re certainly leaving in a year, you may want to consider the effect that would have on the girl. Women here are very, very conservative compared to Western women, and to kiss is a big, big deal. Any thoughts of intimate relations with this women should be banished right now, as it would be devestating for her and her family if you don’t marry her after ‘getting to know her better’.

It’s very different here; women are very different here - and I don’t think that’s a bad thing. It’s been a year now and 914, for instance, still hasn’t held my hand, let alone kiss me. :wink: Rather than expecting your lady friend to forget her culture, perhaps you could forget yours?

I’m in a similar relationship to yours right now, and I’m happy to do the local thing. Accept it for what it is and have no expectations and you’ll find it’s actually quite refreshing.

Good luck!

9

I appreciate the advice and perspective offered. I’m confident I can respect her wishes and look out for my needs. That leaves me one very tactical, small question. I’m embarassed to ask - seems high school-ish, but … in my situation – wanting to continue to date, see how things go, get to know her, not make pressure but express my feelings truly – what do you do at the end of the date?

It seems to me that if I keep asking to kiss her and she keeps turning me down, that regardless of the fact that I can handle it gracefully, she might feel awkward. So, maybe for now – cheek kiss and hug, and ask for a kiss when I really feel like it recognizing it’ll probably be a no for now.

You can also let me know if I’m just overanalyzing it, and I should just roll with it…

10

One other small point - I disagree with some of the generalizations posted – that Taiwan girls are this or that, more conservative, “it’s different here,” etc. I don’t think it’s possible to generalize that way. I’ve been propositioned (for sex) up to three times in one night at certain of the more notorious hook up establishments. I’m not saying it’s bad to generalize, just that I disagree.

That said, it seems this particular girl is pretty conservative, but it sure is not the whole island. I don’t know all of what affects whether a girl is on one side or the other, but I was surprised how far on the conservative side she apparently is since she had lived apart from mom and dad in LA for years, since she likes to go to clubs and stay out late, etc.

Also, based on the input so far, I’m happy to hear no one’s suggested this means she thinks I’m just a friend or something…

Thanks…

11

[quote=“Stray Dog”] Rather than expecting your lady friend to forget her culture, perhaps you could forget yours?
[/quote] :bravo: :bravo: :bravo:

That is the best advice I’ve read on the boards about cultural relations. BRAVO man. That was a gem!

12

You talk about generalizations and then you make one to make your point. Just because someone likes to go to clubs and stay out late it doesn’t mean they can’t posses ‘conservative’ qualities. This girl just likes to have fun (everyone sing along :wink:).

[quote]
Also, based on the input so far, I’m happy to hear no one’s suggested this means she thinks I’m just a friend or something…

Thanks…[/quote]
Well if you were in America we would just say “She just not that into you” :wink:

13

She is either teasing you or cold as a codfish, which is OK of course, if you are into that kind of thing.

14

A lot of people have talked about part of your “problem”. If you like her/ think she’s worth it…wait. As for the “what on earth do I do at the end of the date???” Why not just give her hand a gentle squeeze, look her in the eye, and (honestly) tell her what a great time you had (and “Good night”)?

15

[quote=“ginkgo”]That said, it seems this particular girl is pretty conservative, but it sure is not the whole island.
[/quote]

Unless I’ve missed something I think you’d be surprised how conservative most of this island still is. We don’t see it that much, as most conservative girls wouldn’t get involved with a foreigner in the first place.

I don’t think the sexoholics in Carnegies et al are quite representative of the Taiwanese female population. If only…

16

I dated a girl like this. She was very conservative, until she wasn’t. Then she surprized the hell out of me. :smiley:

17

I’ve been here for seven years, and I know that women here are far more conservative (at first, as Jaboney pointed out) than Western women. You don’t seem to accept that, which explains why you think there’s something ‘wrong’ with your girlfriend for not letting you kiss her.

That you insulted this poor girl by telling her you thought she would have had lots of boyfriends tells me that you need to take it slow for your own good. Taiwanese girls, even the three who threw themselves at you in a single night, do not want anyone to think they have had lots of boyfriends. You need to learn a little more about her point of view, as you should any woman.

Put yourself in her shoes - completely - and try to understand. Don’t change her; she has to carry on living in this culture after you leave. If she is not comfortable kissing you, you must respect that, no matter where she’s from. It’s noble that you have no other designs on her, but, to her, kissing is as serious as engagement is to a Western girl. You are asking her to make a huge jump after only knowing you for a few months.

The lady holds your hand in public - if you knew a little more about Taiwanese women, you’d know that that is a huge thing for her and a great honour she is bestowing upon you. You need to readjust your yardstick, my friend, because currently it isn’t calibrated for Taiwan. :wink:

18

[quote=“Stray Dog”]
The lady holds your hand in public - if you knew a little more about Taiwanese women, you’d know that that is a huge thing for her and a great honour she is bestowing upon you. [/quote]

He is right. It took me almost 9 months to get my baby to kiss me when he dropped me off. And he still doesn’t kiss me in public. He does hold my hand in publlic, but not when there are many people around.
Some people are just shy. Esp here.

19

Don’t ask if you can kiss. That is fatal. Just do it.

20

I read the first couple of lines of your post. For crying out loud (not to use bad words), what are you thinking? You should never try to kiss a girl on the eighth date! Especially if it’s the eighth date in only two months. It’s a good year before you should even kiss her on the cheek! C’mon what are you thinking?