Tariffs, trade war

The trade war between the US and China seems to be on now, with Trump shooting first and China retaliating in kind.

There is an interesting documentary on youtube made by Germany’s Deutsche Welle (English, 42 mins). It basically argues Trump’s point and also mentions Taiwan a couple of times, especially the fact how screwed Taiwanese manufacturing would be if their products were subject to the same tariffs as their Chinese counterparts.

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Tariffs were the taxes that made America great. They were the taxes relied upon by the first and greatest of our early statesmen, before the coming of the globalists Woodrow Wilson and FDR.

The principle involved in a tariff is the same as that used by U.S. colleges and universities that charge foreign students higher tuition than their American counterparts.

Once a nation is hooked on the cheap goods that are the narcotic free trade provides, it is rarely able to break free. The loss of its economic independence is followed by the loss of its political independence, the loss of its greatness and, ultimately, the loss of its national identity.

Brexit was the strangled cry of a British people that had lost its independence and desperately wanted it back.

This thread should be longer than the initial OP. I’m guessing most of the related stuff went under Trump-headline threads.
Buchanan’s analysis (whether you like him or not) is kind of spot on.

With all the fuq-u-China people on this forum, the support for Trump’s trade actions could be louder.
I won’t even copy/paste all the local news articles of Taiwanese mfgers coming back to Taiwan.

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The only issues are that , Yes the US will pay more for Chinese goods but given a few months or so , new suppliers can be arranged at similar prices/quality .Lots of countries would love to fill the gap.
I quite agree that America should be investing in tech and manufacturing, especially in electronics anyway.
Funny that the same people complaining about slightly more expensive prices in the shops …pay hundreds a month more for Healthcare…partly because of the regulations and price fixing ,Insurance costs against Lawsuits, happy to pay benefits to unemployed factory workers …but 40 cents more for a lightbulb, …NO NO.
Complex issues that go beyond some pain for consumers, I know , but china will continue to abuse fair trade and human rights . I love that someone has the balls to say I don’t believe you will change …prove it first .

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I don’t understand why people are so short sighted, do they not understand trade wars hurt in the short run even for the country holding the better cards? Of course China will go tick for tack. It gets tiring hearing people who have zero economic understanding and have no idea about global trade, specially with china, act like it’s the end of the world and trump didn’t think that China would also impose tariffs. You get a million comments like “You see, china imposed tariffs on this! What an idiot” Like no shit…it’s a trade war. They have zero comprehension on trading with china, zero!

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I see some awesome opportunities .Got me thinking now :thinking:

I . See US Government to get a list of "approved " Taiwanese manufacturers that could be Tariff free. US will be worried that Companies in Taiwan could be part Chinese owned or controlled , so they need to be checked for zero Mainland involvement.

2 Can see Taiwan/ Phillippine, Vietnam etc, companies to help them qualify .

3 Offer all the goods that China sell to USA at a very similar price to the non-tariff price , from companies that have zero China influence.

4 Set up website for US purchasers of all the products /prices /conformity

5 Immediately move to the billionare thread wish list :joy:

If efficient , would take most of the pain out of the tariff effects for USA , whilst really hitting China …win win.
Who is with me ?

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image

The unknown, rarely-talked about part of the equation here are the average Americans who don’t care if iPhones will cost 14% more due to tariffs. It doesn’t impact them. They buy their cheap clothes and shoes at WalMart, which is a behemoth with huge pricing power on suppliers (in China) and which can easily source textile products ex-China as well as from shoe makers that are already fleeing China.
Here’s the key list of products to be impacted at the bottom of the article.
American businesses will quickly shift their suppliers based on market demand, etc. It’ll happen quicker than one thinks, kind of like globalization.

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President Donald Trump is expected to sign an executive order that would make possible a ban on American companies from using telecommunications equipment from Huawei and other companies that the government believes pose a national security risk, Reuters reports

First, :tangerine:-man will do this, then somewhere down the line he’ll throw in some other tech equipment ban on imports or exports.

Why does he keep targeting industry from third world countries?

lolol…
3rd world?
that’s what China WANTS you to think :thinking:

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Tariffs are fair trade in reverse.

An ideologue sees this as free trade vs protectionism. A realist sees this as bargaining. A realist sees all politics as bargaining.

And if you think that’s too reductionist then you don’t understand bargaining.

Undoubtedly the tariffs will hurt both parties. I do think that the US will do better in the long term …mainly because , as with Iran , some Nations will have to choose a side to trade with . Some are just waking up to how the Chinese way of business is more complex than just selling a product, Some will go for the cheap loans and product and ignore the rest …some will look at the longer term benefits in nottrading with China.

   Just to give an actual example of one effect this week . My colleague is working with a huge US Corporation, that have been manufacturing in China for some time.  They asked him to go to India next week , and try  set up sourcing and manufacturing there ...so this policy may well help genuine 3rd world countries.

Supplying a Dictatorship state or a very volatile country is a risk , US companies wanted the dollars/market share in China , above the loss of IP or copy but cheaper risks etc.
China have ignored most of the commitments they made to the WTO etc, for a long time …They are now playing anti-US films on TV stations and going down that road.
Time for trading nations to decide …let’s see.

China’s new trade war song.

Trade war, hey!
Trade war, hey!

Jeesh…it’s like they’re music rhythm is stuck in the 60s Mao Zedong era or something. Whacked out.
If that’s all they can produce to get their sheep to follow, they’ve still got a bland culture

“Tit for tat.”

fyi

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“We are here at the starting point of the Long March to remember the time when the Red Army began its journey,” Xi told cheering crowds on Monday, in footage posted on state broadcaster CCTV’s website on Tuesday. “We are now embarking on a new Long March, and we must start all over again.”

I’m thinking the ChiComms should really push this angle.
Make it like walking the Appalachian Trail or the Pacific Crest Trail.
Set up summer camps for little Commies to attend and walk parts of it.
Hand out Mao’s Little Red Book for every 194.9km walked.
Collect stickers at various places.
The possibilities are endless.

How much do you think 1st tier city dwellers will pay someone to do the walk for them? A whole new cottage industry would be created.

I had a talk with my Ex today . They supply and export Business Furniture , based in Taiwan. They have been asked by many US companies ( currently buying from China ) to possibly supply them in the long term .
What appears to be going on for now…is that Chinese Govt. have promised manufacturers “help” financially… through the back door.
That may work short-term , but confidence in the stability of supply will have a large effect in the long-term .

From the BBC:
On Tuesday, a top business lobby in China released a survey of its members that found just over 40% had relocated, or were considering moving production facilities, outside of China because of tariffs.

The survey by the American Chambers of Commerce in China and Shanghai found one-third of respondents had delayed or cancelled investment decisions to cope with tariffs.

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Glorious. China is getting a taste of their own medicine after bullying everyone for decades. The last thing they suspected was getting man handled by Donald Trump. Years of watching presidential candidates saying they’re going to be tough on China and saying they’re currency manipulators and how they’ll balance trade we’re all lies. Trump is the only one to ever do anything besides bend over backwards for China once in office.

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