Ukraine Invasion: Specific Developments, November-December 2022

Negotiation is much easier when one is clearly winning, for sure.

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did you watch the full thing? because I did. he said it’ll be a tough fight and russia can negotiate to leave at anytime.

latest presser, where does he say Ukraine should negotiate to end the war? plz do find it.

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I’m not sure Cake said he did. But there’s this:

“You want to negotiate from a position of strength. Russia right now is on its back. The Russian military is suffering tremendously.”

And this:

“When there’s an opportunity to negotiate, when peace can be achieved, seize it. Seize the moment,” Milley said.

And meanwhile from the administration:

Citing a position that is “shared across the US government” Sullivan said that the US will continue to do everything possible to put Ukraine in the “best possible position on the battlefield so that when they make their determination to proceed, they’re in the best possible position at the negotiating table.”

No-one is telling Ukraine they have to negotiate. But all of the above is distinctly different to US rhetoric earlier in the war, like “Putin cannot remain in power”. Talk of total victory is waning, talk of choosing the right time to negotiate is waxing. That is a good thing.


But, within weeks, tankers from countries like the US, Norway or the Emirates could deliver their cargoes here to the port of Wilhelmshaven. The terminal’s operator, Uniper, which is now almost entirely controlled by the German government, is coy about its suppliers but insists that contracts are in place.

And five other LNG terminals are planned. Most should be completed next year.

The first built in record German time!

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Winter has arrived, and the muddy fields are now frozen in Luhansk, making maneuver warfare possible again. So there will be more developments compared to a few weeks before.

Ukrainians now have control over Chervonopopivka, cutting off Kreminna from P66 to the North. As Russians push closer to Bakhmut, Ukrainians have broken through the defense line to Kreminna and Svatove.

:point_down: click to read

Ukraine Pulled Ex-Soviet Recon Drones Out Of Storage, Added Bombs And Sent Them Hurtling Toward Russia

An ex-Soviet Tu-141 variant in storage in Moscow in 2012.

The drones that Ukrainian forces used to strike two Russian bomber bases 300 miles inside Russia on Monday weren’t the satellite-controlled, missile-armed Bayraktar TB-2s that Ukraine acquired from Turkey.

No, they reportedly were Tupolev Tu-141s, ex-Soviet antiques that last saw front-line use in the 1980s, flying photo-reconnaissance missions for the Soviet air force.

As developments of the first-generation recon drones that the U.S. Air Force deployed in the Vietnam War, the jet-propelled Tu-141 wasn’t very sophisticated by 1980s standards. It’s even less sophisticated today.

But it’s simple, speedy and big enough to haul a warhead weighing hundreds of pounds, making it much more powerful than a TB-2 with its 49-pound missiles. The Tu-141 works. So it should come as no surprise that the Ukrainians are sending their Tu-141s on one-way missions to blow up Russian bombers.

Drones have been around since World War I. The first models were radio-controlled targets for gunnery practice. In the 1950s, the U.S. Air Force and California target-maker Ryan Aeronautical developed the Model 147, a 30-foot-long, jet-propelled drone with what was, for the time, a highly-sophisticated inertial navigation system and a nose full of expensive cameras.

Model 147s flew thousands of missions over Vietnam, shooting photos of targets for manned bombers. Armed versions were in development when the war ended and the Model 147 came to an abrupt end.

The Soviet air force soon developed similar drones. The Tu-141 first flew in 1974. Tupolev built 142 copies of the 47-foot-long, ramp-launched drone at its factory in Kharkiv, in eastern Ukraine. The type served until 1989.

Some Tu-141s and similar Tu-143s were in storage in Ukraine when Russian troops invaded the country in 2014. Ukrainian technicians began pulling the 30-year-old drones from warehouses and reconditioning them. Russian-backed separatists shot down at least two Tu-143s over eastern Ukraine in 2014.

The Ukrainian air force operates a handful of manned Sukhoi Su-24 bombers but can’t afford to lose them on a dangerous deep strike hundreds of miles inside Russian territory.

The Tu-141 is an obvious substitute. It’s fast—600 miles per hour—and, if it’s anything like the Model 147, can fly as high as 20,000 feet or as low as treetop height. Its inertial navigation system can keep it within a few miles of its planned course over a distance of more than a thousand miles. It recovers by cutting its engine and popping a parachute.

Remove the cameras and add explosives, and the Tu-141 becomes a cruise missile rather than a recon drone. It was apparent as early as March that the Ukrainian air force had modified some of its Tu-141s for one-way suicide missions. A Tu-141 that went off course and crashed in Croatia on March 10 reportedly had a bomb aboard.

The Ukrainians this summer sent at least two Tu-143s on raids in or near Kursk, in western Russia, 50 miles from Ukraine. Russian air-defenses shot down both drones. This morning, the drones finally got through.

It’s hard to say how many Tu-141s and Tu-143s Ukraine has left. If any remain, expect more deep strikes targeting Russian bomber bases or other strategic targets.


7 posts were merged into an existing topic: Ukraine Invasion: General Discussion, November-December 2022

Russian strike helicopter hit by a rocket.

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That missile looked enormous, and it was heading toward the earth.

Wow! I sure miss doing shit like that!

I always love a happy ending.

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What do you reckon that missile was?

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Ukrainian T-64 destroying Russian T-72


I saw the discussion about this, seams to have been a lucky shot or was already damaged, as the single shot from the T64 shouldn’t have breached the active armour.

A bit of a hole in one, a pretty big hole.

IF the reactive armour was present and in working state, that is :stuck_out_tongue:


Have the Russians upgraded their tanks with reactive armour? I thought the T72 used composite?

Many of the tanks given to Ukraine via NATO countries have been retrofitted.

Seems like pretty close range.