USA has 5% of the worlds population and 25% of its prisoners

Politics International Politics
1

Another shameful fact about the USA.

Reporter: Mr. Gandhi, after seeing the USA, what do you think of Western Civilization?
Gandhi: I think it would be a good idea!

[quote]

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Tough sentencing laws, record numbers of drug offenders and high crime rates have contributed to the United States having the largest prison population and the highest rate of incarceration in the world, according to criminal justice experts.

A U.S. Justice Department report released on November 30 showed that a record 7 million people – or one in every 32 American adults – were behind bars, on probation or on parole at the end of last year. Of the total, 2.2 million were in prison or jail.

According to the International Center for Prison Studies at King’s College in London, more people are behind bars in the United States than in any other country. China ranks second with 1.5 million prisoners, followed by Russia with 870,000.

The U.S. incarceration rate of 737 per 100,000 people in the highest, followed by 611 in Russia and 547 for St. Kitts and Nevis. In contrast, the incarceration rates in many Western industrial nations range around 100 per 100,000 people.

Groups advocating reform of U.S. sentencing laws seized on the latest U.S. prison population figures showing admissions of inmates have been rising even faster than the numbers of prisoners who have been released.

“The United States has 5 percent of the world’s population and 25 percent of the world’s incarcerated population. We rank first in the world in locking up our fellow citizens,” said Ethan Nadelmann of the Drug Policy Alliance, which supports alternatives in the war on drugs.

“We now imprison more people for drug law violations than all of western Europe, with a much larger population, incarcerates for all offenses.”

Ryan King, a policy analyst at The Sentencing Project, a group advocating sentencing reform, said the United States has a more punitive criminal justice system than other countries.

MORE PEOPLE TO PRISON

“We send more people to prison, for more different offenses, for longer periods of time than anybody else,” he said.

Drug offenders account for about 2 million of the 7 million in prison, on probation or parole, King said, adding that other countries often stress treatment instead of incarceration.

Commenting on what the prison figures show about U.S. society, King said various social programs, including those dealing with education, poverty, urban development, health care and child care, have failed.

“There are a number of social programs we have failed to deliver. There are systemic failures going on,” he said. “A lot of these people then end up in the criminal justice system.”
[/quote][/quote]

2

so? lock em up. hell…kill drug sellers. the law abiding folks in society shouldn’t have to cower in fear of the bad guys. lock em up until they are past 35 (when many guys seem to mellow) and then some when necessary.

the prisons in the US are too easy anyway. they have cable tv and three meals a day. then they come out of the pen and can’t hack it in society. i have known many guys to get out on probation, find it too hard being free and then intentionally get high, fail the drug test and happily go back to jail.

3

What is the actual breakdown of those numbers? HOw many of that 7 million are ACTUALLY behind bars? I would HOPE that more people were on parole and probation than incarcerated.

[quote]
We now imprison more people for drug law violations than all of western Europe, with a much larger population, incarcerates for all offenses[/quote]
The drug laws in the US for “minor” drug use and possession are stupid, destructive and should be shitcanned.

Ridiculous. :raspberry:

[quote]
the prisons in the US are too easy anyway. they have cable tv and three meals a day. then they come out of the pen and can’t hack it in society. i have known many guys to get out on probation, find it too hard being free and then intentionally get high, fail the drug test and happily go back to jail.[/quote]

No offense, but I think it asinine to suggest prison life anywhere is easy, for anyone. Being subjected to cable TV is a crime in itself. And one reason why convicts say they prefer the system is because time has meaning. There is structure and a regimen, something most convicts lack in the real world. No one taught them to use the tools in society, so they are being punished for inflicting their own personal chaos on the world. It’s not because the food is good, the clothes are snappy and man on man gang rape is delightful.

4

Ridiculous. :raspberry:

I bet he means drug related, which means it’s probably too low.

HG

5

hoo hum… :wanker:

6

Yes it is terrible when the system works and actually puts criminals behind bars :unamused: , but that doesn’t justify throwing nickle baggers in the clink for years on end and basically creating new criminals.

7

My favourite stat is that Vietnam is the largest population of Australian citizens incarcerated outside of Australia. The best part is that they all have names like Nguyen and Trang and mostly it is drug related.

8

Predictable kneejerk defend the US no matter how shameful the facts stance. :America:

But, TS, assuming it’s true that the US has 5% of the world’s population and 25% of its prisoners, that does seem to suggest a problem doestn’t it? Apparently our criminal justice system needs reform. Apparently our criminal justice system is not doing very well at reforming or rehabilitating people, and people are being incarcerated (at huge taxpayer expense, not to mention all the other objections) who should not be jailed, who should be dealt with in some other way. Wouldn’t you agree? Certainly the incarceration of so many millions for petty-drug offenses may be part of the problem, no? And perhaps the way the system treats some offenders actually makes them more likely, rather than less, to be repeat offenders. Isn’t that possible?

I love America too. I believe it’s a great country, including our legal system and system of government, and I’ll be happy to return some day. But I’m not so foolish as to believe it’s perfect and has no room for improvement. You don’t believe that either, do you?

I realize you may take a hard stance on criminal justice – do the crime, serve the time. But, given the statistics, are you willing to consider the possibility that maybe our criminal justice system is flawed, is not reducing crime or criminals, and too many people are being incarcerated rather than being dealt with in more appropriate ways? If not, care to explain why you disagree?

9

Prison in the US is college for criminals. They learn where to buy drugs, exchanging cell phone numbers for drug dealers where they can score when they make it outside. It’s social networking in a place where there’s nothing else to do.

10

Hang on though, is it no so that anyone can be locked up now without trial and without charges ever being brought against them in the U.S.? The country died a while ago if you ask me, but nobody has realised the stench just yet…

11

Sure you’re talking about American citizens there??

12

Yes it is terrible when the system works and actually puts criminals behind bars :unamused: , but that doesn’t justify throwing nickle baggers in the clink for years on end and basically creating new criminals.[/quote]JDS -
I’m on record as being in favor of legalizing drugs.
IMO, the WOD is a complete and utter failure and waste of resources.
In my way of approaching the problem this legalization and gov’t control of growing, producing and marketing dope will rapidly thin out the gene pool and generate a very nice source of revenue.

Its a mistake to use stupid stories such as this to make a meaningful comparison of prison statistics between the various countries.
Crime and criminal demographics render a direct comparison inaccurate and misleading.
Note, the USA stat includes in jail, on parole and on probation.
How many other countries, the PRC for example, include those 3 groupings in their statistic?
Does the PRC even have parole and probation classifications? Do other countries?

Very misleading story on many levels.

13

[quote]How many other countries, the PRC for example, include those 3 groupings in their statistic?
Does the PRC even have parole and probation classifications? Do other countries?
[/quote]

Most western countries, I believe, plus a generous handful of non-western countries.

14

Double guard post.

15

I think that comment would be better suited for Old Europe and the U.K. There populations are declining and getting grayer by the day while their work force is soft and weak. Even with the daily reports on this board from our penis envy friends on how horrible conditions have deteriorated the U.S. it’s still the only industrialized country with a population that is growing with most of it coming from immigration. Pretty impressive for a country going to hell in a hand basket huh?

16

Yes it is terrible when the system works and actually puts criminals behind bars :unamused: , but that doesn’t justify throwing nickle baggers in the clink for years on end and basically creating new criminals.[/quote]

http://www.whitehousedrugpolicy.gov/publications/whos_in_prison_for_marij/whos_in_prison_for_marij.pdf

[quote]In 1997, the year for which the most recent data are available, just 1.6 percent of the state inmate population were held for offenses involving only marijuana, and less than one percent of all state prisoners (0.7 percent) were incarcerated with marijuana possession as the only charge, according to the U.S. Department of Justice’s Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS). An even smaller fraction of state prisoners in 1997 who were convicted just for marijuana possession were firsttime offenders
(0.3 percent).
The numbers on the federal level tell a similar story. Out of all drug defendants sentenced in federal court for marijuana crimes in 2001, the overwhelming majority were convicted for trafficking, according to the U.S. Sentencing Commission. Only
2.3 percent—186 people—received sentences for simple possession, and of the 174 for whom sentencing information is known, just 63 actually served time behind bars.[/quote]

Doesn’t look like it is the “nickel baggers” that are filling up the jails and prisons.

17

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha … Ralphy is back to old form…find criticism about the US and then turn it around and insult everybody from Europe and the UK because of said criticism.

Are you going to actually contribute to the topic or are you just going to go on a tangent and rag on about Europe because you don’t agree with the topic at hand or find it hard to swallow a comment form another poster about the perceived state of affairs in your country?

Grow up, Ralphy.

Anyway, about the other part of your statement:

Has it not occured to you that many European countries and most certainly the UK are increasing in population size due to immigration - the UK is certainly overcrowded. Even though the populatio is aging, our workforce, especially at blue collar level, has a high amount of immigrant labour, especially from places like Poland and Eastern Europe.

Getting your facts straight and engaging in a little research before you post often prevents one from looking like a twerp.

18

[quote=“Dangermouse”][quote]How many other countries, the PRC for example, include those 3 groupings in their statistic?
Does the PRC even have parole and probation classifications? Do other countries?
[/quote]Most western countries, I believe, plus a generous handful of non-western countries.[/quote]
Need some confirmation on this or else I will post strange attempts at gentle humor(humour).

19

Yes it is terrible when the system works and actually puts criminals behind bars :unamused: , but that doesn’t justify throwing nickle baggers in the clink for years on end and basically creating new criminals.[/quote]

http://www.whitehousedrugpolicy.gov/publications/whos_in_prison_for_marij/whos_in_prison_for_marij.pdf

[quote]In 1997, the year for which the most recent data are available, just 1.6 percent of the state inmate population were held for offenses involving only marijuana, and less than one percent of all state prisoners (0.7 percent) were incarcerated with marijuana possession as the only charge, according to the U.S. Department of Justice’s Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS). An even smaller fraction of state prisoners in 1997 who were convicted just for marijuana possession were firsttime offenders
(0.3 percent).
The numbers on the federal level tell a similar story. Out of all drug defendants sentenced in federal court for marijuana crimes in 2001, the overwhelming majority were convicted for trafficking, according to the U.S. Sentencing Commission. Only
2.3 percent—186 people—received sentences for simple possession, and of the 174 for whom sentencing information is known, just 63 actually served time behind bars.[/quote]

Doesn’t look like it is the “nickel baggers” that are filling up the jails and prisons.[/quote]

Thanks for that. It is good to know. However, is this the same for State and local Courts? I can’t imagine a guy sitting on his porch smoking a bowl going to federal court.

20

Well, I know France, Germany, Spain, Australia and New Zealand as well as the UK and the US have both parole and probation as integral parts of their penile sysems, as does China. I found out about China’s today because I wasn’t sure myself after reading your earlier comment.

As for whether they include the figures for parole or probation in their overall statistics - I know the UK does, but I can’t really speak for the other cuntries. In any case, it wouldn’t be difficult to find out the percentage of people on parole or probabtion compared to total amount of detainies in prisons by doing a quick search.