Validity of US-issued ID cards for native Formosans

Recently, there has been continuing discussion among various social groups in the Kaohsiung and Taichung areas about possibility of the US government authorizing the issuance of ID cards for native Formosans. Apparently some overseas Taiwanese persons in the USA have been actively making liaison with various US government agencies, and obtaining the necessary “go-ahead” permissions.

According to what these people in Kaohsiung and Taichung have heard from these overseas Taiwanese in the USA, a US government approved “manufacturer” of such ID cards has already been found, and the necessary software coordination has been obtained. In other words, the ID cards will be high-tech, and will include a memory chip of some sort which is fully compatible with the “readers” at all US Customs locations. The cards with the indication of “TW” will indicate that the holder is a native Taiwanese. The wording of “Republic of China” will of course not appear on either the front or the back.

The ID cards will be differentiated according to the ancestry of the applicant. Two primary differentiations will exist: (1) those whose ancestors were already holding Household Registration in Taiwan as of Sept. 2, 1945 (the date of the signing of the Japanese surrender documents on the USS Missouri in Tokyo Bay), indicated by the abbreviation “TW,” and (2) all other persons who currently hold Household Registration in Taiwan, indicated by some other two-letter abbreviation.

Apparently the legal basis for the issuance of these ID cards is the undisputable fact that Taiwan is territory “acquired” by the United States under the principle of conquest, and which has never been transferred to any other nation/country by any international treaty.

More specifically, as of April 28, 1952, the legal basis for the jurisdiction of the “United States Military Government” (USMG) over the Ryukyu Island group was Article 4(b) of the San Francisco Peace Treaty (SFPT). Interestingly, the same Article gives USMG jurisdiction over Taiwan.

As everyone knows, the ROC is not a signatory to the treaty, and cannot gain any rights or benefits under the treaty. Hence, under international law, the ROC cannot claim ownership of Taiwan.

Taiwan (aka “Formosa and the Pescadores”) was sovereign Japanese territory until Japan renounced all right, claim, and title in the SFPT. Accordingly, when the Republic of China moved its central government to occupied (Japanese) Taiwan in December 1949, it became a government in exile.

The following explanatory excerpt was taken from civil-taiwan.org/six-mistakes.htm
[color=#0040FF]Governmental authority over occupied territory is called military government. THEREFORE An area under military government is occupied territory.

Article 4(b) of the SFPT gives a U.S. federal agency, the United States Military Government, disposition rights over the Japanese territory of Taiwan. [/color]

US Supreme Court cases dealing with the territorial cessions of Louisiana, the Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, California, New Mexico, etc. have confirmed that “disposition rights over territory” include disposition rights over the people thereon.

Initially, the advantage for a native Formosan in holding such a US-approved “Taiwan ID card” will be relaxed requirements for obtaining a US visa. However, the details of this are still being negotiated.

At any rate, I am starting this new thread in the Taiwan Politics Forum with the hope of eliciting some intelligent discussion on the pros and cons of the issuance of such ID cards in Taiwan. Or perhaps other members of the forumosa.com community have heard of related developments, and would like to add their comments to this discussion.

I have also found a number of related threads in the Taiwan Politics Forum. The following are representative –

Legally speaking, Is Formosa US territory by conquest?

ROC is a government-in-exile

Obama camp downgrades the Republic of China
viewtopic.php?f=89&t=73565&start=30

Which groups? Why hasn’t this made the news? Give me a name and a CNA reporter will be down there tomorrow.

Oh for the lord’s sake! Are they SERIOUS? Visa waiver is right around the corner, whether ROC citizens hold some kind of daft wee Mickey Mouse card or not. And even if they’re NOT, the daft wee Mickey Mouse card will make not ONE WHIT of difference – do those bobble-headed idiots down there REALLY have such LITTLE idea about how the US issues visas? How can anyone spout such rubbish and expect to be taken seriously?
“Intelligent discussion?” Then you could perhaps start by getting those clowns to show just a smattering of intelligence themselves. :unamused:

I’m wondering what the full name of this card is and what it’s actually used for. If those native formosans feel that strongly about the US, then I think they should petition that they be classified as US nationals (which is a little different than US citizens, and is given to people in outlying US possessions). By Hartzell’s logic, they’ll have a case.

Formosica? District of Taiwan? ROC: Retaining our Country? I’m thinking of which one will sound best when we finally reclaim this bioth! I’m loving this neo-imperialism talk, but I think Hartzel’s got the wrong approach. If we only take the pre-1945 Taiwanese we’re gonna be stuck with the betel nut chewers and blue van mans; not exactly what we need back in the homeland. I know the proposed plan sounds good; essentially denying those bastard KMT waishengren and their kin of the sweet nectar of American freedom, instead leaving them to suckle from the sour tit of Mainland(fill) China, but I would propose that there be more of a selection process designed to isolate the best candidates. How about an ‘American Idol’ format: ‘Taiwan’s Got Talent’ perhaps. This will be a great way to thin out the food cart and cab driving riff raff and instead leave us with a solid new class of American Nationals! Taiwanese American ID Cards could be the best thing to happen to Eugenics since Shirō Ishii…what? too soon?

T

Richard, much as I respect you, I think you should have waited to announce this on April 1.

Boy, that sure is exciting. Today “actively making liaison”, tomorrow… the world!

delete

A Puerto Rico status for Taiwan?

There are many posters here whose native language is not English, and Hartzell’s post is rife with legalistic jargon. So allow me to explain the situation in simpler terms:

Some Taiwanese people with no real authority spoke to some American people with no real authority about something that will never happen.

Spoilsport! :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

“Initially, the advantage for a native Formosan in holding such a US-approved “Taiwan ID card” will be relaxed requirements for obtaining a US visa. However, the details of this are still being negotiated.”

Correct me if I’m in error. From what I’ve read the only problem US ICE has with issuing US visas to Taiwan citizens is that Taiwanese citizens need not present themselves to the Taiwan passport issuing office when requesting a Taiwan ROC passport–not even for the first time 'round. In most countries one must show up in some government office the first time around and sign that you are who you claim to be. They inspect your documents and then process your request.

The last time I got a US passport pictures at the local pharmacy, the employee entered data that went straight to the US ICE. I grew up on a farm and everyone know our family or our father. When I went to get my license I brought along my old passport. The state I grew up in has had a terrible spate of accidents caused by pickled farm workers from south of the border. They were really sauced and it wasn’t with chile. So that state is now requiring legal proof of citizenship before processing a driving license. Yes, I agree. The convoluted logic contained in the prior sentence did not skirt my recognition that it doesn’t make any sense.

So why does the US ICE have problems with Taiwan passports containing US visas? Too many times bearers of these Taiwan ROC passports acquire a US visa and enter the USA. What’s the problem you ask? These passport bearers are not Taiwanese ROC citizens. I suspect most are citizens of the PRC. They know nothing about Taiwan geography and their Mandarin is not spoken with a Taiwanese accent. That is a big problem and I doubt that it will be solved by issuing TW IDs .

For many years now the going rate of transporting a PRC citizen to the USA illegally has hovered around $ 40,000 USD. And the Taiwanese are well known for their manufacture of miraculous funny paper–fake ids, passports etc. Remember the case a few months ago of the Taiwanese arrested in the Philipinnes and sent to the PRC? They were arrested for that exact same reason–ID falsification. So maybe funny paper manufacturers in TW have been trying to suck up some of the lucrative trade in people trafficking by competing with the people transporters?

[quote=“Gao Bohan”]There are many posters here whose native language is not English, and Hartzell’s post is rife with legalistic jargon. So allow me to explain the situation in simpler terms:

Some Taiwanese people with no real authority spoke to some American people with no real authority about something that will never happen.[/quote]

Touché!

Does this mean that when China buys America that Puerto Rico will become part of Taiwan?

Okay! That’s what I’m saying. Your use of the French touche’ would be indicative of the fact that you got me making a faux pas, a mistake. You didn’t. Your touche’ needs to be directed toward the protagonists of this Magical Mystery Tour–the Taiwanese and US citizens promoted this lame brained plan.

Thanks!

Bingo!

Bingo!
focustaiwan.tw/ShowNews/WebNews_ … 1108300048

[quote=“enn”]Okay! That’s what I’m saying. Your use of the French touche’ would be indicative of the fact that you got me making a faux pas, a mistake. You didn’t. Your touche’ needs to be directed toward the protagonists of this Magical Mystery Tour–the Taiwanese and US citizens promoted this lame brained plan.

Thanks![/quote]

Er, no. The term “touché” is from fencing, (in appreciation of a good hit), meant as a verbal round of applause for Gao Bohan’s pithy précis of the OP’s article.