We need a Spanish-language forum!

[Susana]

We need a Spanish language forum! Is it possible?

Besos
Susana

[Hartzell]

At the present time, I believe the ORIENTED website has over 3000 people who at one time or another have “registered”. We might extend this a bit further and say that another 1500 people have logged on as unregistered.

While we recognize that the internet itself is “without international boundaries”, and hence the ORIENTED forums are available to persons throughout the world, could anyone provide estimates of the following:

Of this estimated 4500 user group –

1. What number of these people are in Taiwan and active learners of ENGLISH? (i.e. those not yet fully fluent in the English language)

2. What number of these people are in Taiwan and active learners of SPANISH who have very poor ENGLISH language skills, and hence would benefit from a SPANISH Language Forum?

[GooseEgg]

@Susana

Greetings to all the Spanish speakers in Taiwan! The other day I was talking to Mingson, one of the “reporters” of ORIENTED. We discussed the possibility of introducing a forum in Spanish for Spanish-speakers and other friends who would love to communicate in Spanish, to interchange information and to make friends! How does such an idea for this forum sound? Perhaps it can be called the LIFE IN TAIWAN or something like that… We needed a forum in Spanish!

Hola Susana,

Thank you for posting on ORIENTED. Richard Hartzell explained our collective view about starting new forums on this thread:

http://oriented.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=30&t=000074

Now, you are welcome to post in Spanish, or any other language that your browser supports. Obviously, in doing so, you are reaching out directly only to those language speakers who will understand you.

In this light, I find it interesting that you chose to cite the name of an existing forum in your example.

Now, how would our moderators react to such a development? I’ve never asked. Personally, I would welcome such postings. But you’ll note that I am not actively moderating any forums

To the smart aleck who asks how we would “moderate” such posts, I would say, “the same way we moderate postings we can read – by relying on the rest of the ORIENTED community to guide us.”

I hope this sufficiently addresses your proposal. Normally, we’d like to appeal to the vast range of interests of ORIENTED visitors. However, we’ve learned this isn’t always practical, or even necessary, since we have already some general forums that can suffice.

[ironlady]

We already have moderator(s) fluent in Spanish. I don’t think the policing function would be a problem, if that’s a concern. I would be willing to take it on until somebody else appeared who wanted it alone or who wanted to share it.

There actually are learners of Spanish here in Taiwan, but we would like for there to be more. Spanish is the language of choice in the majority of the ROC’s trade partners (Latin and South America) and most of her major diplomatic allies, yet it seems to get passed over for French for reasons that totally escape me.

Maybe having a separate forum for Spanish speakers would avoid other users from feeling annoyed at having to see posts they cannot read. I know my dad still gets really steamed over the Spanish and French labeling in the US now (with NAFTA and all), although he’s probably an extreme example of an older grouch in these matters.

Even though I’m into languages, though, I would probably be annoyed to have to wade through a bunch of, say, Greek posts, which I couldn’t understand. If there were enough Greek posters, I would probably say, “Give them their own forum to keep from cluttering up the other, established fora.”

[Susana]

The point is not whether there are or not enough spanish-speakers/learners of Spanish using Oriented, the point is that THERE IS a considerably big spanish-speaker community in Taiwan and learners of this language, and by having a discussion forum in Spanish, we could be attracting more users to Oriented.

Anyway… I would be happy to take on the role of moderator if someone tells me how and what to do! Let’s do it! What is the next step?

[ironlady]

I believe that providing a Spanish language forum would be beneficial to Oriented for several reasons:

1. We do not necessarily want to limit Oriented to English-only. This limits the audience. If there have been “money beg notices” in Spanish before, then obviously this language is “good enough” for Oriented!

2. As Susana has pointed out, there is already a sizable Hispanic community in Taiwan. I’ve been to many events with these people over the years, but it would be great to have a forum which anyone could access anywhere. I know a Dominican woman who lives in central Taiwan, for instance…she would find it difficult to get to Taipei, where most of the Spanish-speakers are, but could participate in this kind of forum.

3. I think that Oriented stands for internationalism, and providing our Taiwanese users with a concrete example that there is more than English to the outside world would be beneficial. Many of Taiwan’s allies and trade partners are Spanish-speaking countries, and very few Latin American traders speak much English (I am speaking from the experiences of my husband when he was traveling with a Chinese boss throughout Latin and South America). There is a NEED for more Spanish here.

4. English-speakers will not want to have threads “cluttered” with responses or topic starts that they cannot participate in. This kind of thing would probably gender ill-will, and lead to “splittism.” If that isn’t good for cross-Strait relations, it certainly wouldn’t be good for Oriented.

I think that Oriented also has a function as a “home away from home” in Taiwan for foreigners, and allowing posters to post in Spanish would very much enhance their experience, as well as bring in the Spanish speakers to the Oriented experience. It is not necessarily the case that every Spanish speaker speaks English, although a lot of people seem to have that impression.

So, why not put up a separate forum, call it “La Vida Loca en Taiwan” or something, and just see how it flies? I’ll moderate with Susana to start out, if you want. Is the cost so high that an experiment couldn’t be done?

[color=red]Note from Admin: We had a Spanish Forum for a year and a half. It was eventually discontinued in 2004 due to lack of use. Que sera, sera… [/color]

[system]

Why don’t we have another two forums here.

1. Translation Forum

2. Word and Etymology Forum

just my two maos,

ax

[Juba]

No need. There’s a very lively translation forum on Taiwan Yahoo-Kimo: [url=http://tw.bbs.yahoo.com/cgi-bin/ListFrame.cgi?board=english]

[maoman]

[quote=“stragbasher, in another thread,”]I don’t think it’s only the girls that get put off by the dominant group here. I would think that there are plenty of guys who also decide that this place is not for them, but they don’t hold their hands up and admit to not being manly enough. The girls complain about all the testosterone because they feel entitled to, so we get a reputation for being male dominated. In fact, it would be fairer to say that forumosa is dominated by a certain kind of personality. It’s probably inevitable.

Dunno what the solution is. A newbies forum to get your feet wet in if you so wish, before jumping into the fray? Alternatively, a site I used to frequent appointed established posters to go out of their way to welcome new members, and help them get over traumatic first experiences. I know that some of us try to do that occasionally anyway, but specifically asking people to do it might make a difference. You could give them an ‘ambassador’ badge or something.[/quote]

A newbie’s forum? :newbie: What would you call it? Forumosa Junior? The Playpen? We could automatically cull any posters with more than 100 posts to their name…

[Xpet]

A newbies forum to get your feet wet in if you so wish, before jumping into the fray?

No. To me the whole thing is about integration, learning, being accepted by interaction. Separation does not help the issue.

Alternatively, a site I used to frequent appointed established posters to go out of their way to welcome new members, and help them get over traumatic first experiences.

Maybe, but I always thought that’s the admin’s job, at least I think it should be; stepping in when old timers (referred to as “compulsive posters” elsewhere recently ) go over the top, sometimes whipping each-other into a right frenzy of newbie-bashing.

There’s a new thread in the legal forum [url]It's all messed up, any lawyers in the house that has a few replies only, all of which are very harsh and little or not to the point at all. Not necessary in my eyes. Xpet.

[Durins_Bane]

Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.Keep this forum simple…keep it sweet.

[almas_john]

[quote]A newbie’s forum?[/quote]

Yeah, it’s called Tealit!!

Newbies don’t want newbie misinformation. They want pearls of wisdom from the old Sage Kings of Forumosa.

If you think a newbie is getting a shafting from an old member, you can jump in and say something like “Don’t mind Wolf! He’s a prick*. Link to poll”

*Sorry Wolf, did you end up be branded a total prick or a partial one?

[Traveller]

I disagree with a newbie forum, but i do think that the people here could be a little more aware from there joining date and number of posts whether someone is likely to be a newbie or not, and thereby adjust their response.

As for cutting teeth on tealit or any other forum, that is assuming that they have even found them.

[Loretta]

I dunno that a newbies forum is necessarily a good idea, but it’s an idea. A lot of newbies do get squashed unfairly, and telling them to go practise at another site first doesn’t really help. If a few hundred people go and start building up the boards at tealit they might just stay there, and attract all the future newbies. We’ll be left here congratulating each other on being the minority.

Trying to repair the damage when newbie-bashing starts is all very well, but prevention is better than cure in my book. Forumosa is very much dominated by a small group of people, and it would be nice if newbies had the opportunity to ‘grow into’ the site without having to compete for space. People are more likely to stand up for themselves if they’ve been around a while and feel like they belong here.

And many forumosa newbies are not Taiwan newbies. There are plenty of new names appearing with valid advice or information for the FOBs.

Asking established posters to go easy on newbies is a non-starter. I don’t take any notice of stuff like ‘number of posts’, and I don’t think many others do either. The forums are what they are, and I don’t think they can be consciously made into nicer places. But the nicer people can be cultivated.

[almas_john]

Actually, the newbie forum is not necessarily a bad idea. We don’t really understand the process of how viewers become regular posters. Personally, I don’t think a newbie forum would work, but there’s no harm in trying. Give it a few months, and if it sucks then scrap it.

[OldToeSave]

At first I thought it would be a good idea, but upon further reflection, I vote no. Travelling and expatriating is tough business. If you are too thin skinned to be called on in these here parts, maybe you should stay home with mommy.

Of course, Fluffy could be your mommy here.

[iris]

Sorry if my questions are a bit dumb. But I don’t really grasp how a newbie forum is supposed to work.

What kind of posts should go in there, anyway? “What should I bring”? “How does the visa work”? “Where can I find a job”? As much as I’m tired to dig up the old visa thread when a newbie asks the same question hundreds have asked before, those are valid questions (and the search function can be a pain). But who would have access to the newbie forum? Only them? If yes, who can answer if not the ones of us who post all the time, have the information and actually know where to dig up the old threads?

Or did I get it all wrong and the newbie forum is actually just a playpen where we teach newbies the posting rules and how to be nice to each other? But then, how is that supposed to work??? Posts without substance? Or the mods making up “useful” topics that the newbies can answer to?

I also think that we should try not to let Forumosa get too complicated (but don’t you guys dare touch the Women’s Forum!!! :fume: ). But feel free to try and convince me…

:s :s :s

Iris

[Tetsuo]

@stragbasher

According to this post, newbies lurk for a while before they pluck up the courage to leap in: I have been reading posts on this site for a couple months and finally decided to join. Why is this? I didn’t, so maybe I’m not normal, but I do remember very nearly giving up after being slapped down in the early days.

That’s just standard netiquette. In most forums, newcomers are expected to lurk for anything up to a few months to get a feel for the place, learn what sort of posting rules and styles are expected, learn what’s taboo, and make sure they don’t just jump in starting topics on things that’ve already been covered ad nauseum.

[aprimo]

A newbies forum? That’s the most stupid idea ever.

Let the newbies come into the Forumosa community whenever they please, with whatever questions they have. I don’t think it’s wrong to put a bully “oldie” in check though.

One thing that would help IMMENSELY is altering the Search function so that you could narrow a search for your keyword(s) to topic titles only. Damn, that has been bugging me for a long time. I do quite a few searches myself, and they almost always turn up far too many unrelated results. And, no, limiting the search to one specific forum usually doesn’t help.

[smerf]

[quote=“aprimo”]A newbies forum? That’s the most stupid idea ever.

[/quote]

Agreed. No need. Anyone with common sense can figure this place out in a few days. For example, it took me less than a week to know that I should slam fred smith whenever I get a chance.

Seriously, though, newbies may raise old questions, but sometimes it’s fun to look at an old topic through new eyes. Are the old-timers so crusty that they can’t remember the days when they first landed here?

Newbies bring new energy. Go newbies!