Any virus that has an animal reservoir cannot be eliminated, EVER.
So, the world is better off making this vaccine a “flu vaccine” and let people decide to take it on a yearly basis, and not mandate it.
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Though the chance of getting sick is already greatly reduced and the risk of getting a serious course of sickness even more so.
It’s really unfortunate that this narrative (“Vaccinated people still can get sick”) is being pushed so much even if that’s not the case:
Among this last group, a common refrain I’ve heard to justify their renewed vigilance is that “vaccinated people are just as likely to spread the coronavirus.”
This misunderstanding, born out of confusing statements from public-health authorities and misleading media headlines, is a shame. It is resulting in unnecessary fear among vaccinated people, all the while undermining the public’s understanding of the importance—and effectiveness—of getting vaccinated.
So let me make one thing clear: Vaccinated people are not as likely to spread the coronavirus as the unvaccinated. Even in the United States, where more than half of the population is fully vaccinated, the unvaccinated are responsible for the overwhelming majority of transmission.
Despite concern about waning immunity, vaccines provide the best protection against infection. And if someone isn’t infected, they can’t spread the coronavirus. It’s truly that simple. Additionally, for those instances of a vaccinated person getting a breakthrough case, yes, they can be as infectious as an unvaccinated person. But they are likely contagious for a shorter period of timewhen compared with the unvaccinated, and they may harbor less infectious virusoverall.
If enough people are vaccinated, then countries can reopen and drop all restrictions. Like Denmark did recently. Other countries will follow - and I am sure Taiwan will to. Just need to see when enough people have gotten the vaccine - in Taiwan that might take a couple of more months at least, unfortunately.
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I don’t necessarily disagree with anything you posted. However, reopening and dropping all restrictions is the exception rather than the norm now. I’ll believe it in Taiwan’s case when I see it.
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England, Denmark, Sweden at the end of the month
Some Eastern European countries must be pretty relaxed too. Haven’t looked into it.
That’s still true, unfortunately.
Regarding Taiwan, they’re outlining some sort of plan:
Chen conceded that in the future, Taiwanese will have to find a way to coexist with the virus and rely on vaccinations, masks, frequent hand washing, and social distancing to keep it at bay, while the center works on obtaining new drugs that provide better protection.
That doesn’t sound like the CDC is planning to keep up a zero-COVID strategy for the near future.
Still no mentioning of quarantine relaxations - but I would assume that this will be one of the last steps to take.
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This sounds like restrictions in some form are here to stay for years to come. Also, the mandatory quarantines don’t seem to ever be going away either. Not mentioning that says quite a lot, actually.
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I hope not!
Hopefully, they’re just following a more “careful” style of communication meaning that they don’t want to get expectations up and then later have to backpedal. I mean it’s the same when they announce vaccine shipments only 1-2 days before their arrival.
I am not sure how the population in Taiwan sees the quarantine. Probably a majority of people doesn’t mind too much because they are not traveling internationally too regularly. And probably for some people, COVID is still something coming from “outside” the country, so there are probably some really strong advocates for quarantine in the population.
I guess we will see some sort of “travel bubbles” first (probably including Japan). However, I would assume that these bubbles than rather include destinations popular among Taiwanese rather than following true infection risks (I mean the list of high risk countries which require quarantine in a government facility also is a bit arbitrary so to say…).
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That September piece in the Atlantic—written by an emergency room physician in New York City—is a really good read. Thanks for posting it.
This article contradicts just about every point made by our resident forumosan vaccine cynics who have claimed that vaccination is useless or even some diabolical plot to harm others.
I have no doubt our resident cynics will find other reasons to disregard the conclusions presented in this clearly written piece. Perhaps they’ll haul out the ad hominem attack that being a director of global health and emergency medicine at Columbia University in a city where COVID slammed through makes them unqualified to write about or understand this topic. Or something like that.
Guy
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All those saying Taiwan will open up after 70% are double vaxxed should probably take a look at this:
Frustration with new COVID curbs as Singapore moves to open up | Reuters
Taiwan is most likely to follow the Singapore model on reducing restrictions. But - Singapore has 82% double vaxxed, and has just walked back on their commitment to opening up, due to the high case rates they are seeing.
Bonkers really, as the vast majority of these cases are asymptomatic. They currently only have 34 “serious” cases in the whole of the country. But politically - high cases look bad, so it’s back to masks and social distancing and no eating with your friends again.
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Yep yep, I don’t see TW easing anything in the future. They say they don’t care about zero cases, but we will see soon.
Nobody makes the simplistic statement that “Vaccinated People Are ‘Just as Likely’ to Spread the Coronavirus as Unvaccinated People”, so the entire article is a strawman. Whatever Craig Spencer’s qualifications might be, the argument is flawed in several ways: it asserts that vaccines are far more effective than anybody else is claiming (this seems to something peculiar to the US); it conflates ‘cases’ with ‘harm’; and it overlooks more complex considerations such as the interplay between vaccinated and unvaccinated which exacerbates the damage done by COVID and its long-term impact. He makes a couple of demonstrably false assertions (eg., that an unvaccinated individual exposed to COVID will inevitably fall ill with it, and that vaccines almost perfectly prevent infection and transmission). So if we accept that he is who he says he is, that suggests that he’s deliberately misrepresenting the facts.
He also oversteps his remit by stating that ‘vaccine mandates are [so] important’. Simply being a doctor doesn’t qualify him to make such assertions about jurisprudence or governance.
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Yup. I called it.
Guy
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You just didn’t understand one word of either the article or my response, as usual. But you do you.
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Singapore, last I heard from a pal, was under lockdown…
Seriously, folks, this won’t be over until it’s over. And that will take another year. So make your travel plans for Christmas 2022. That’s when we won’t have to do quarantine here in Taiwan.
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Sounds about right.
10 to 16 month from now.
Virus is pretty widespread now apart from TW, NZ and China. May as well open up once 90% vaccinated. Singapore seems to get most things right.
The simple way to encourage the anti vaxxers to get the shot is to deny hospital entry to unvaccinated people.
If people are not going to believe the doctors recomendations with vaccines then they must know better than doctors - so why should they seek doctor help when they get sick?
In Taiwan? That is not going to happen.
But they can—and do—require a PCR test to enter a hospital for any serious treatment. So the unvaccinated, who all eventually will be infected once things open up, will at that point get the message. 
Guy
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There’s a lot of debate regarding these restrictions there, I doubt they will last long. Taiwan on the other hand is going to struggle with opening for sure.
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I really hope not. I am getting so tired of it. There must be a point where a certain percentage of the population is double vaccinated and they just say “Ok That’s it life goes back to normal .”.
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Yes there will be a point at which that happens.
Alas, that point is not now.
Guy
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