There has obviously been a loss of attraction somewhere along the way. Maybe he wasn’t giving her enough attention; maybe he was giving her too much attention; maybe he had given the impression the relationship wasn’t serious; maybe he had hinted at wanting something on the side himself; maybe he had made her feel he didn’t care.
I said it’s not easy, but you can always find how you may have contributed to perceived crimes against you. Take control; don’t be a victim.
Huh?
If your reaction to seeing a friend of yours shagging your girlfriend is to think “What was it that I did wrong?” and not “How the hell could he do that to me?” or “How the hell could she sleep with my friend?”, well, your reaction would be different than mine.
I disagree. If there are indeed problems in your relationship which is causing the girl to stray, then it’s her responsibility to bring up these issues in a discussion. If these issues are irresolvable, then the relationship should end.
There has obviously been a loss of attraction somewhere along the way. Maybe he wasn’t giving her enough attention; maybe he was giving her too much attention; maybe he had given the impression the relationship wasn’t serious; maybe he had hinted at wanting something on the side himself; maybe he had made her feel he didn’t care.
I said it’s not easy, but you can always find how you may have contributed to perceived crimes against you. Take control; don’t be a victim.[/quote]
Wise words.
I think Stray Dog is right the guy could certainly in some way be responsible for her wanting to look around, but in a serious relationship I think you’re right, the girl has the responsibility to discuss the issues. I don’t think cheating is ever acceptable.
Of course this applies if the gender roles are reversed too.
If your reaction to seeing a friend of yours shagging your girlfriend is to think “What was it that I did wrong?” and not “How the hell could he do that to me?” or “How the hell could she sleep with my friend?”, well, your reaction would be different than mine.[/quote]
Another example of a forumosan that can’t read or process English.
Who mentioned a friend being the other guy?
Nevertheless, asking how he/she could do that is the same as asking why. Why does your relationship matter so little to the other person/people that they will do this? Surely that’s a reflection of your own qualities? Like SD said, you’ve probably done something to make others think it’s OK to treat you like this.
Alternatively, you can blame everyone else and remain a victim. Me, I would prefer to figure out what the problem is and fix it. Take control. At the very least I would choose my friends and SOs more carefully in future so that I wasn’t leaving myself open to the same shit. After all, some people manage to go through their whole lives without having to deal with this sort of problem. What are they doing that you’re not? I don’t believe in luck, and even if I did it would hardly be fair to blame others because I happened to get unlucky.
Blame’s all about being a victim and trying to reclaim your status. Beat your chest and blame the other monkey. Or act like a human and use your brain. It’s up to you. The nice thing about using your brain is that it allows you to recognise that shagging or killing someone else is not good for you. The value of our relationships outweighs the biological urge if we use our brains. After all, humans are genetically pre-disposed to promiscuity but choose monogamous relationships if it’s advantageous. Either your cheating partner saw no value in the relationship (your fault) or wasn’t rational (you chose badly) about the situation.
If you give in to the testosterone then you’re just as bad as the ones who cheat on you. Where’s the high ground if you’re behaving like an animal too?
I think that it is the kind of person someone is. Every relationship is somewhere along the way going to hit tough times. Every relationship is somewhere along the way going to have times of low attraction. Not everyone will cheat in these times. Most will not.
Saying that it is the fault of the one who gets cheated on is like blaming a murder victim because he was annoying. Just because you did things to annoy someone doesn’t mean you should get shot. Just because your relationship was having a low point (even if that low point was 100% your fault) does not mean you should be cheated on. It is no less a choice to fuck someone else than it would be to pull the trigger on that stupid wench who cuts in line at 7-11.
Its easy to say that we can try to be responsible or try to have patience when we are faced with that kind of a scenario.But in the real world, when that happens, I doubt that youll even have time to think on what to do about it in that instance, rather than act on your own instinct.
Im saying that because Im Emotional and for sure, I would have done something also to the guy, regardless if I get beaten up or not.
“Hey Joe, where you goin’ with that gun in your hand?
I’m goin’ down to shoot my old lady,
you know I caught her messin’ around with another man.” - Jimi Hendrix
Seems Joe’s more angry at the girl than at the other man!
The fact that your beloved is actually a worthless piece of shit is difficult for your ego to bear, because that means you were in a relationship with a worthless piece of shit, which means you are stupid. Most people are not instantly able to deal with this amount of cognitive dissonance and so blame the third person.
gao bo han, I meant ‘why do you have to choose which one to rail at?’ it was a half joke.
I think this is a problem of perception of what a “normal” relationship should be. Scientific evidences have shown that vertebrates, including humans, have about a 15-20% rate of siring bastard offspring.
Viewed from perspective it becomes obvious that the majority of people don’t cheat, but enough people do stray that it should not come as any surprise. There is nothing any wrong with anyone in the situation; it is the nature of the individuals. In other word it was quite natural.
The worst-case situation is if one believes that one was infallible in selecting against cheaters, only to discover that they got in bed with a cheater and was cheated on. Creating an endless cycle of doubt, worry, and a waterfall of negative emotions.
I always just take comfort in that cheaters eventually come back, because that is their nature to cheat on whomever they are with. As long as they trust you, and you keep yourself available, they always come back. Even when you don’t want them to.
Blame Mother Nature for making cheaters.
Crank it up.
[quote]I got back in town a day before I’d planned to
I smiled and said I’ll sure surprise my wife
I don’t think I’ll phone I’ll just head on home
For I didn’t know the cold hard facts of life
I passed a little winestore on the corner I pictured big champagne by candle light
I stopped the car right then got out and hurried in
My mind not on the cold hard facts of life
A stranger stood there laughing by the counter
He said I’ll take two bottles of your best
Her husband’s out of town and there’s a party
He winkled as if to say you know the rest
I left the store two steps behind the stranger
From there to my house his car stayed in sight
But it wasn’t till he turned into my drive that I learned
I was witnessing the cold hard facts of life
I drove around the block till I was dizzy each time the noise came louder from within
And then I saw our bottle there beside me
And I drank a fifth of courage and walked in
Lord you should’ve seen their frantic faces
They screamed and cried please put away that knife
I guess I’ll go to hell or I’ll rot here in the cell
But who taught who the cold hard facts of life
Who taught who the cold hard facts of life [/quote]
[quote=“ac_dropout”]I think this is a problem of perception of what a “normal” relationship should be. Scientific evidences have shown that vertebrates, including humans, have about a 15-20% rate of siring bastard offspring.
Viewed from perspective it becomes obvious that the majority of people don’t cheat, but enough people do stray that it should not come as any surprise. There is nothing any wrong with anyone in the situation; it is the nature of the individuals. In other word it was quite natural.
The worst-case situation is if one believes that one was infallible in selecting against cheaters, only to discover that they got in bed with a cheater and was cheated on. Creating an endless cycle of doubt, worry, and a waterfall of negative emotions.
I always just take comfort in that cheaters eventually come back, because that is their nature to cheat on whomever they are with. As long as they trust you, and you keep yourself available, they always come back. Even when you don’t want them to.
Blame Mother Nature for making cheaters.[/quote]
Maybe it’s natural but that doesn’t mean we should embrace it. Heck you could say the definition of civlization is a group of people who have chosen to suppress some of their natural impulses to create an ordered society. I think alidarbac hit the nail on the head. In a mature relationship, if the potential cheater is not satisfied with whatever in the relationship, that doesn’t justify cheating, even in situations where there is blame to go around. If no resolution is in sight the relationship should end. It’s that simple.
If anyone is in a situation where they are constantly worrying about his/her SO cheating, then again, some discussion is necessary. If trust can’t be established, the relationship should end.
I second this statement. Though I’ve never committed anything so faux pas as to cheat on someone nor been cheated on, I would think this is how a person who’s been cheating on first reacts? At least according to my 3rd person knowledge from TV shows and magazines…Who is first to admit they’re a dumbass worthless piece of shit that another dumbass worthless piece of shit can readily cheat on?
(Just generalizing here, of course, there are two sides to every cheating story and not ALL involved are worthless dumbass pieces of shit.)
Or one could have an open relationship. Thus, ending the angst of worrying about cheating.
Because making a value judgement on people who have a natural tendency to cheat is unnatural in a sense.
There are people who are attractive and attracted to many different people.
There are people who are terrible at being alone…
point being the list is ending why good people cheat or find themselves in a cheating situation.
I don’t see how cheating, a practice that has gone on since the dawn of sexual reproduction, has a positive or negative impact on society. The only negative impact emotionally, is if one’s perception of a relationship is immutable. Having unwaivering belief that sexual attraction and impulse can be monopolized by another individual is unhealthy if taken to extremes.
[quote=“ac_dropout”]Or one could have an open relationship. Thus, ending the angst of worrying about cheating.
Because making a value judgement on people who have a natural tendency to cheat is unnatural in a sense.[/quote]
Hey, if it’s an open relationship, then fine. But if it’s not an open relationship, and they are trusting each other not to cheat (which is obviously the norm), then cheating is wrong because it breaks that trust. I guess it’s a matter of not keeping to your promises.
[quote]There are people who are attractive and attracted to many different people.
There are people who are terrible at being alone…
point being the list is ending why good people cheat or find themselves in a cheating situation.[/quote]
It’s perfectly natural to be attracted to others. It’s not as if we lose the ability to be attracted to err, attractive people when we get involved with someone.
But again, the issue is keeping to the tacit or even explicit promise to be faithful.
Not sure about the impact on society, but it’s noteworthy that all societies inevitably evolve written or unwritten rules regarding mating. Jewish culture allowed a man to have as many wives as he wanted until pressure from the Christians forced the rabbis to outlaw polygamy in the early 12th century ad. Shi’a Islam allows for “temporary wives,” complete with marriage contracts that may last no longer than a few days. If a Shi’a Muslim has three permanent wives, he can have as many temporary wives as he wants, as long as they are only one at a time. Tibetans practice polygamy, but in reverse of the usual order: women can have multiple husbands. I studied an indigenous African culture in an anthropology class that actually requires cheating. Men and women can marry and stay paired throughout their lives, but both are required to sleep with the rest of the village. The idea is to conceal the identity of the father, so that the entire village will feel obligated to take care of the children. (I can’t remember the name of the tribe, anyone know which tribe it is?)
But on the personal level, if there is a trust that cheating won’t take place, and that trust is broken, I think that is where the wrong lies.
That certainly isn’t the “only” potential negative impact in a cheating situation.
Agreed. I think a lot of women think men cannot or should not be attracted to other women, which is irrational. But there’s a difference between having an impulse and acting on it.
By the way I recommend a new book called “Lust in Translation”. I read it for a bit at the bookstore. The author travelled to various countries to interview cheaters and those cheated on to get a comparison of how different cultures perceive cheating. Americans apparently take it the most seriously, whereas, according to her research (which she admits is not scientific), other cultures are not so obsessive about it. I remember one example is a Japanese women she interviewed who had an affair on her husband. The author asked her if she felt guilty, and the woman didn’t understand. She repeated it several times, and finally the woman said she was confused. How could you feel guilty when she has not neglected her duties to her family?
I recommend it to you because I suspect you’re the cheating kind (no value judgment made, just my observation from the tone of your posts), and the author certainly takes a dim view of the conservative American perspective.
Cheers,
Gao
I think the norm is not to define whether the relationship is open or not. Thus the individual with the tendency to cheat and the individual with the tendency not to cheat will make false assumption on what is the norm.
Given birth controls and the fact 15-20% of children are illegitimate. I will guessitmate that about 50-60% of all relationship have some cheating going on over the period of the relationship. Well, I will jokingly increase the rate to 80-90% given how some women define “cheating.”
The question is what do you do when you’re caught or when you catch you’re SO.
One can just pre-emptively engage the SO to convince them that cheating isn’t actually cheating. Brainwashing.
Yes, but it’s a tacit assumption there will be no cheating, at least once the relationship matures.
Yeah that was the original question, or more specifically, why do men blame the other guy instead of their SO. But you’ve given me an idea for another thread…
My personal experience with this matter is that I would definitely kick the guys ass up to the point of killing him or kill both of them if I caught them red handed especially if I was married. I however have never been cheated on, at least not to my knowledge.
I have however been the asshole that cheated on a couple of girls and they placed all the blame on the woman. They would just rip these women to shreds. I have also noticed that women will completely degrade another woman in any way possible if they feel that a woman is moving in on their man.
Then again I have had relationships with multiple women at the same time and they all knew about one another. A couple were also friends which was nice because they would go shopping and both would come back with gifts for me.
In the end I would blame my SO and the other person. If I caught them red handed it would be ass whooping time. If I heard about it I would just blame the woman and hold it against her. Well I would actually leave because if anyone ever cheated on me, I have enough self respect for myself to leave that person. The women I cheated on should have left me and they didn’t, they just blamed the other girls, maybe they had low self esteem or something. In the end I place the blame on the woman but I am just one man.
So if you cheat it’s her fault and if she cheats it’s her fault. Hmmm, it’s never your fault, that’s a great attitude pal. I suspect you are from the school of thought that only likes to take responsibility when it’s the good kind. I wonder if the women having low self esteem is the cause or the effect?