not sure it means less grown up, more than someone not learning an important function in modern life.
For the couple , it maybe applies to both people in this case from what I read that both need do/learn some chores (daily modern life functions) that make married and life in Taiwan better. Sometimes pride gets in the way of learning/teaching or doing what is needed (all people) and people can come their senses can make life better. Something like bringing something from each others life/culture into the relationship to make it better instead letting get into a fight but yes it’s hard for many.
This is what I feared the most with a Taiwanese female counselor. Wrong start right there. Tell her to change it. Every thing has to be translated, otherwise you will be really lost in there. Tell your counselor to guide the counseling in English and translate everything (if any) Chinese to English. Let your wife talk in Chinese (without full translation) in her individual session. I feel it is pointless to have it half translated if it is a joint session. Wrong start, waste of money. I’ve been there, and I tell you because of personal experience.
Even more of a reason to have it all in English or at least all translated in the joint session, so you can understand how to help in the situation and what is really going on.
The Chinese only should be left for the individual session, I repeat.
I don’t know the OP’s wife. But by this and everything he said earlier, she expects him to divorce peacefully and pay not only for the kids but comfortable enough that she can continue her studies and so with his money, being divorced and separated.
This couple is probably past the point of learning They are too different from each other. They have different personalities, different love languages, different goals, different interests, different languages, different cultures, different beliefs and values, etc. This is a really good lesson on why not to marry someone too different from you. Those differences that were once cute and created chemistry early on end up being massive obstacles in the long-term. The only way for two different people in a marriage to succeed is have exceptional communication skills, and they are sorely lacking in this situation. They can’t even communicate in the same language in a counseling session…
If I were the OP, I’d give myself a “mental” break (not being too hard on himself, or hard on his wife or having any expectations) and use whatever free time and space he has to think moreso about his legacy and his future, but within the context of this horrible situation. Find a vision or some goals you can say you were proud of accomplishing before you die, and start moving towards them…whether that means divorce or even staying in this marriage. Accept that you screwed up and find a way to still attain some fulfillment before you meet your end.
OP, you should demand this. You’re the one paying for the sessions for gods sake. You should know what’s being said at all times. Otherwise it’s just another thankless thing you’re doing for your wife.
Actually there’s a few solid things that he could he do to improve his situation a lot, the Chinese for one, the problem is the wife seems to have checked out of the marriage already . It’s not cultural differences she’s just , how do I phrase this, acting like a very selfish and self indulgent person right now. Or she may be in love with somebody else and just not honest.
Then I agree with you.
But he needs to figure out the kids and the financial thing before he goes on a quest ‘to find himself’. He’s not anywhere near his end yet. .In fact if he gets divorced I think he can meet a nice lady who will appreciate him more without too much bother. That will be significant upside.
If the counselor doesn’t change this dynamics from the next session on I’d be changing counselors.
OP, I understand you want your wife to feel comfortable to explain her feelings in Chinese. That’s a good point. However she can do so in her individual session with the therapist. This is a couples session, in it you both have to understand everything. If she doesn’t understand English well or you don’t understand English well, then find a middle ground and have everything Chinese translated into English and everything English translated into Chinese. Otherwise I feel you should not be joining this ensino anymore and just pay for your wife personal therapy only. The basic standard worldwide is to let the couples communicate and have a mediator present to guide them in their self discoveries about the relationship. This counselor might not be good at her job and you will be wasting time and money. I’d call her and discuss this before next session. If she cannot translate everything then pay for your wife only and you find your own personal therapist and work on yourself as this couples therapy will go nowhere.
It is very common to not find the right therapist in the first try, it takes actually many tries. But an unfit therapist should be cut from the beginning, as a manipulated or even half competent one will do more damage than good in your relationship.
On another note, how do you guys marry someone with whom you can’t communicate fully and throughly?
If one is not fluent in Chinese the other should be fluent in English, or the other way around, as long as there is a common ground language.
Marriages are already hard, intercultural marriages even harder, without a language where you can express everything (or at least deep enough stuff) I don’t see as a marriage.
To me it something is going on above the marriage thing in these relationships. Either they are in love with appearance, sex, or just infatuated with someone, to which all will vanish in time.
To marry you need to have communication. The friends I have that we’re married in this situation (foreigner barely know Chinese Taiwanese spouse also can’t communicate well in English) divorced, are in terrible marriages, or are heading for divorce.
I have a few friends infatuated with their Taiwanese love bird and they are very intelligent communicate people. We can talk deeply about so many things, it is already in their personality to be very well articulated communicators and not shallow people. So, I started asking a few of them (very close friends) ‘can you discuss this that we just discussed with Mr/Mrs girl/boyfriend?’ And their answer is ‘I don’t need to, you just know when someone has a good heart’.
@Andrew0409 that’s great, kids become bilingual very early on if exposed to both sides of the equation. So in just a few years they can mediate. But that’s also heavy on them. I am glad your parents were mature enough to be able to communicate in whatever way they found suitable until you grew up.
The OP is being showered with a lot of information and stress, one thing he can’t do in go back in time to reverse the marriage, so I regret posting the language problem thing here and don’t want to deviate the thread to another side instead of helping the OP.
My mom actually become fluent in Chinese. She went to classes when she moved to Taiwan to marry my dad. Pretty incredible. She is fluent in 3 languages.
Sorry to point out the obvious but they still got divorced right. All marriages can be tough international marriages even more challenges.
But kudos to her for doing that it’s impressive .
In general our common language is English and my wife’s speaking and listening are pretty good. It is not normally an issue for everyday life.
To be honest, I was naive when we met, there were warning signs which at the time I missed but after reading about are so obvious (I still don’t see language ability as one of them). I can’t change the past, which is why I am always trying to move the focus onto what we can do going forward.
Currently I don’t believe language is the main difficulty in us resolving our issues by ourselves, the main issues I feel are that we have totally different opinions and expectations on what is reasonable / unreasonable and we are not able to come to any sort of comprise that we can both be happy with.
Who is being unreasonable or what is reasonable expectations on both sides are what we are looking to identify in the counseling sessions.
Yes at the next counseling session, I will tell the counselor that I did not get as much understanding of what my wife was saying as I had hoped. I will request that she give more translation in joint sessions so I can understand my wifes thoughts more.
As can be seen from the length of this thread, there is a lot to unpack, so I am not expecting to understand everything after the first session.
More than enough reason to speak in English in the joint session. If she really has some term she can’t explain than use Chines but with translation. She can speak all the Chinese she wants to vent to the counselor in her individual session. If this continues in the joint session you will just be wasting by your time. If you expect the counselor to tell you both what to do that’s not how it works. Counselors mostly talk only when there is miscommunication between the parts and when they do is to just open the eyes to something obvious. The conversation has to be between you both and the therapist mediate it. You are right to ask for the translation and since your wife’s English is very good she should try ,at least in this joint session, to use the more English speaking the can. If eventually this situation doesn’t change you will have wasted about 10 joint sessions, a couple of months and probably your wife will even grow a thicker skin and get more powerful in the situation, meaning she won’t try to save the marriage because it is not easy to do so and she will be enabled but the failed therapy sessions.
So I highly recommend you get this sorted early on or change the therapist.
They are too different from each other. They have different personalities, different love languages, different goals, different interests, different languages, different cultures, different beliefs and values, etc. This is a really good lesson on why not to marry someone too different from you. Those differences that were once cute and created chemistry early on end up being massive obstacles in the long-term. The only way for two different people in a marriage to succeed is have exceptional communication skills, and they are sorely lacking in this situation. They can’t even communicate in the same language in a counseling session…
.In fact if he gets divorced I think he can meet a nice lady who will appreciate him more without too much bother. That will be significant upside.
All marriages can be tough international marriages even more challenges.