Rights of the Aussies? I’m an Aussie but I don’t feel my rights have been in the least impinged…mind you I am white. Perhapa that has something to do with it?
HG
I think its fair to say that the rights of nearly 200 people (mostly Australians) were impinged upon. And that Australians are now being directly targeted in order to further the ambitions of this violent terrorist group to build an intolerant Islamic state in Asia, incorporating parts of Northern Australia. I guess, HG, you ain’t a Queenslander?
I am your biggest fan, though.
Flipper you call me anti-semitic. How naive of you to throw this card. I was expecting this from you, Do you support the Anti-deformation league (which calls for banning things-how democratic), do you support murder of kids, do you support the dropping of depleted uranium, do you support torture, do you support war criminals, etc etc? As always supporters of Zionism use the anti-semitic card when anyone says they don’t support zionism. I have no problem with any jew, never have, if that was the case you could look at my record collection, my film collection, my books, etc and call me a hypocrite. So on your assumption these JEWS ARE ANTI-SEMITIC: jewsnotzionists.org
I think there should be two states, Israel and Palestine, the above website calls for the abolishment of Israel so what would you say to a jew being more extreme than I? When I said status quo I should have said in Israel rather than the middle east. Interesting piece as always by Noam Chomsky(hang on, he is jewish I am supposed to hate jews, oh well) zmag.org/content/Mideast/cho … april2.cfm
Depleted Uranium does this: answering-christianity.com/iraqi_torture.htm
Lump read a little about the origins of terrorism and why people react like they do to the USA, Osama Bin oswald was made by the USA, the KLA were supported by the CIA, Pinochet was supported by the USA, etc etc. The largest terrorist organization in history is the US who have killed 2.5 million due to state sponsored terrorism. And I don’t hate the USA!
imyourbiggestfan,
no, not a banana bender, anyway they always reckon those socialists in the south are stealing their rights… and they can’t play rugby league either!
As for Australians being targeted, if yanks are targeted then so are we, all of us. I defy any Islamo-fascist to spot the difference between me a yank a German a pom, Italian or whoever. By way of example I know quite a few Aussies that seem to have duped many a Taiwanese host with their smooth “north american” speak.
More seriously, rights are taken by governments not threats. I feel neither threatened nor impinged upon. As for those who died in Bali, from the lists I’ve seen the Balinese look to have borne the brunt of it - and will continue to economically - despite the media hype. Hair splitting? Maybe.
Flipper. Taking anti-Zionist to mean anti the current Israeli government then most definitely! Cake has a good point in trotting out the names of Jewish opponents of the present terrorist Israeli regime. Codswallop to that hoary old ant-Jew chestnut! It serves nothing other than to stifle valid criticism, check the New York Times and that git Friedman as a classic example.
Cheers.
You do Friedman an injustice. I am halfway through his “Beirut to Jerusalem” and he doles out criticism to Israelis and Palestinians in equal measure. He even suggests that Palestinian terrorism at the beginning of the conflict, while abhorrent as all such acts are, was tactically astute. I thoroughly recommend (the first half at least of) this book.
Cake. You are prejudiced. Even by your own admission, you condemn one terrorist, not another. You can never see westerners as victims, only as aggressors. You are unbalanced and as loopy as a piece of string.
I stand corrected. Haven’t read it and don’t think I would’ve based on the crap spewing out of the sucker in the NY Times of late.
Cheers.
HG
you never did define what you thought zionism to mean, cake. you throw around the words zionists and anti-zionists without ever offering what you mean those terms to mean. the term zionist was coined in the late 1800’s to mean establishing a state for jews. how exactly am i a supporter of zionism? israel has been a state since before i was born. so unless i call for the destruction of israel, i am a zionist?
obviously we are working with different definitions here. you stated that you had “no time for zionism”. by all means please explain what exactly you mean by that. are you just bastardizing the word by using it to refer to israeli foreign policy? you support the existence of israel alongside palestine, so what exactly is it about zionism you disapprove of?
and don’t pull out the “i have no problems with jews individually” defense. that just makes you seem more sketchy. “a lot of my friends are black…i have lots of cds by black entertainers and i like watching black people in sports.” how creepy does that sound?
chomsky? lol. how many times has he been ripped apart by other liberals for the crap he’s been throwing out since 911? again, i’m not sure what him being jewish has to do with anything. you seem to feel that someone who agrees with you carries more weight if he’s jewish.
largest terrorist organization in history? if you want to use the broad sense of the word terrorism, why would you place the us above germany or russia? hell, china killed TENS OF MILLIONS of people(granted, they were chinese citizens). khmer rouge, anyone? why don’t you learn a little bit about world history outside of the anti-us drivel you read on your alternative websites. the fact that you would talk about states acting as terrorist organizations and use pinochet as an example while ignoring cambodia or the armenian massacre just goes to show how myoptic your anti-us lenses are.
i don’t even bother to defend the us here because you have so many gaping holes in your logic that it’s just easier to play with those instead.
I think this should suffice as a definition of Zionist.
From the Merriam Webster online (don’t have the Oxford at hand but I would like to see what it says).
Main Entry: Zi
Lump do I have to fill the page up to list every terrorist organization? A terrorist whether it is a state or a lone gun nut, is a terrorist. I have no time for them. Yes westerners are victims. I am from a country where everyday for most of my life so far there was a chance of a bomb attack by terrorists… Instead of spouting abuse at me, use some rationale… Enough of that.
I sound sketchy? Organizations such as ADL(Pro Israel fascist group that calls for the destruction of free speech) have taken the ‘anti-semitic’ thing so far that people are waking up and reading between the lines. They accuse anyone who critisizes Israel as anti-semitic. That is like saying someone who critisizes the black hitler Robert Mugabe is anti-black. In the last post I had to state that I posses books, films, music by Jews, to state that, if I was anti semitic that would make me a hypocrite. So if I say I posses books, films, music by Americans or by christians (which I do) why doesn’t that sound sketchy? I proved in the last post that you have no ground to call me anti-semitic (and remember seminites are also palestinians). I have no problem with any race, religion, person unless they advocate murder, oppression, racism, etc and that is what Israel (the leadership) advocates (and that is not being anti semitic). Whether you can see that is unknown. I know there are people in Israel who are pro-human and pro peace. There is a definite oppression in Israel and the occupied territories toward non jews (christians and muslims) and anyone who can’t see that is either brainwashed or they accept that it is the right thing to do. When I say no time for Zionism I am talking about the murder, oppression, racism, torture, etc that is happening now in Israel. rense.com/general32/wrost.htm
I support both a Palestine and an Israel, that is the only way forward. Anyone who calls for the destruction and end of Israel is dreaming. It is there and there to stay.
I don’t need to define what Zionism means to me, it is obvious what Zionism is seen as today - that is the promotion of a ‘modern Israel’ as HG kindly states. I know all about the origins of Zionism and the Balfour Declaration, etc, so I don’t need a lecture.
Like I said at the top I could list a lot of terror groups and would need the whole page so I apologize if I didn’t include others. Maybe by looking here you will get the bigger picture regarding US state sponsered terrosism:
members.aol.com/bblum6/American_holocaust.htm
The khmer rouge were funded and supported by the UK and the US as an adversary to the Vietnamese, during the Vietnam war, so that makes them part of the state sponsored terrorism I was talking about. Sorry you can’t use Cambodia as an example.
I know a fair bit about world history, thank you, I know about the armenian massacre by the Turks and the Kurd genocide by the turks in the mid 1990s sponsored by NATO ally the US. (Yeah it wasn’t just Saddam who killed Kurds). I wonder why didn’t we hear about that on CNN?
Chomsky is a liberal - first I have heard, he is a self-confessed anarchist. I never stated anything about Chomsky being Jewish?
I agree with HG on the chomsky thing.
If you think I am myopic, I take that as a complement, If there are any gaping holes they are from your side. And you are making them bigger.
I am posting this, by posting it, it doesn’t mean I agree with everything he writes, but it is certainly interesting:
rense.com/general32/next.htm
Did you know about the unlawful attack by Israel on the US in 1967:
home.cfl.rr.com/gidusko/liberty/
Amnesty International on global human rights abuses:
‘Throughout the world, on any given day, a man, woman, or child is likely to be displaced, tortured, killed or “disappeared,” at the hands of governments or armed political groups.’
‘More often than not, the United States shares the blame.’
As usual I expect abuse.
You don’t even know what you said. You have the brain of a Zen buddhist. All we can hear is the sound of one cell snapping.
my apologies and thanks for pointing that out to me lump, I take anything you say about me as a complement as your retorts are full of nothing substantial. I will take a leaf out of your book and throw some abuse back at you. We all make mistakes after all, I was so hurried replying, hence the mistake I made, I wrote so much I lost track, but you don’t seem to find anything else wrong in my post do you? Do you actually understand any of it? At least with Flipper he is actually stressing his opinion, with your opinions you sound like you should be boozing in a pub with all the other good sports talking about breasts and boozing. Maybe you should stick to the tabloids with the big photos and showbiz news and perhaps talk about something else that is equal to your level of comprehension like playing with a Yo-Yo. This stuff is way over your head.
But you still don’t seem to have anything interesting to say do you. Stick to CNN and bubble gum, you are narrow minded and really quite boring…
Cake hang in there. No need to resort to sledging, you’re up on points!
HG
this is funny. no country in the world is capable of doing anything on their own without us help. turks killing kurds? oh, they’re a us ally! they get us aid! therefore the us is directly responsible for any deaths they caused! and the khmer rouge were only driven to mass murder because the evil americans made them do it. please, cake, is there anything in the world that is not the fault of america? funny thing is that most of the world was also allied with many of these same countries at one point or another. why you could pin the khmer rogue genocide on the us and not on china is questionable. the khmer rouge genocide occured right after they toppled the us-backed regime of lon nol. most of the people who most directly allied with the us during the war(the hmong) were targeted in the genocide and many moved and settled in minnesota.
the armenian massacre occured in 1915, but i love how you subtly tie it to the us by using the “turkey is now an ally” card. smooth. real smooth. great segue into 1990’s turkey that leaves the casual reader with the impression that the us was somehow involved in 1915, as well. instead of labelling turkey as a genocidal country, the us gets the blame. because we all know the turks can’t do diddly squat by themselves without us help and guidance, right?
i love your logic, cake. keep at it!! so far you’ve made the us responsible for what percentage of government-sponsored murders this century? 20%? 30%? come on, a little more work and you could approach 50% easy. i mean, get the holocaust, stalin, and mao in there and you’re most of the way there. don’t forget somolia, which was the fault of the us due to inaction, no doubt. i’m sure amnesty international has already laid the blame for somolia on the us somewhere or other. they’re very good about that kind of stuff.
oh, i don’t understand this part:
[quote]
Chomsky is a liberal - first I have heard, he is a self-confessed anarchist. [/quote]
if you don’t know that chomsky is considered pretty far out there on the left wing, than you either know very little about chomsky(and how he is received in the rest of the world) or you are very delusional.
you think cake loses points for this link?
some gems from the link for those who didn’t bother to click on it:
"While European Jews were in mortal danger, Zionist leaders in America deliberately provoked and enraged Hitler. They began in 1933 by initiating a worldwide boycott of Nazi goods. Dieter von Wissliczeny, Adolph Eichmann’s lieutenant, told Rabbi Weissmandl that in 1941 Hitler flew into a rage when Rabbi Stephen Wise, in the name of the entire Jewish people, “declared war on Germany”. Hitler fell on the floor, bit the carpet and vowed: “Now I’ll destroy them. Now I’ll destroy them.”
classic! blame american jews for the holocaust!!! i mean, anyone boycotting nazi goods in the us during that time must have been jews with ulterior motives, right? that rabbi guy should have just shut up. hitler wouldn’t have been so mad and stuff and would have been nice to the jews instead of carrying out systematic unimaginable slaughter against them.
[b]"In 1891, Cecil Rhodes started a secret society called the “Round Table” dedicated to world hegemony for the shareholders of Bank of England and their allies. These priggish aristocrats, including the Rothschilds, realized they must control the world to safeguard their monopoly on money creation) as well as global resources. The same folks control the U.S. Federal Reserve and other major central banks.
…
The Round Table group planned three world wars to degrade, demoralize and destroy mankind, rendering it defenceless. The Third World War, now beginning, pits the Zionists against the Muslims. "[/b]
awesome, you get the jews and the americans in the same blow! the jews planned the 2 world wars! well shiver me timbers! evil british bankers…
"What I have been calling “compulsory suicide” is satanic “culling.” The constant reference by Zionist and other leaders to “blood sacrifice” refers to the practice of human sacrifice. Apparently energy is released when people are slaughtered. Recently U.S. Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage said the Hezbollah owes the U.S. a “blood debt.”) "
ooohhh. where’s mulder when you need him? i always knew armitage was in a satanic cult.
"In conclusion, a satanic cult governs the world. These people hate God and hate mankind. They want to destroy it. They believe the end justifies the means and are ruthless. They use the Jews, and everyone else, as cannon fodder. We are “children of the matrix,” duped, distracted, stunted and sacrificed. Without the vision provided by God, we are lambs being led to slaughter. "
satanists are meanies!
is it ok if i post some links to kkk and neo nazi sites on here with the disclaimer that i find them interesting as well?
Flipper the rense.com/general32/next.htm
was done by Henry Makow who is a Jew and American.
I am an atheist so there is no way I can take the word satan seriously. But there were things that happened during WW2 that the mainstream will never disclose, such as Prescott Bush (Dubya’s grandaddy) selling arms to the Nazi’s. tarpley.net/bushb.htm
I haven’t made the US responsible for any percentage. I have found that with your replies you seem to be trying to put words into my mouth. Did I say the evil americans made the Pol Pot do anything? I said they supported and funded. The US have a history of supporting one regime until it is in their interests not to (classic examples being Saddam and JFK).
The sad thing is you try to paint a pretty picture that the US is a utopia with clean hands. Why can’t you admit that your government has committed murder for their own interests. I am British I can admit our government has dropped depleted uranium on Iraq and has resulted in deformed babies and countless deaths. I can admit that churchill dropped bombs on Dresden in WW2 for one purpose to murder hundreds of thousands of people. I can admit that in Northern Ireland the UK had a shoot to kill policy, I could go on and on.
Why is it so hard for you? Are you living in complete denial. Do you have no regard for any murder committed by your government? Is life so cheap for you? Or are Cambodians, Kurds, Afghans, etc in your eyes, unpeople? Do you actually believe the fantasy that wars are fought for peace?
Chomsky was asked what his political persuasion is and he said Anarchist. I could find the quote but it could take a couple of hours and I am not prepared to waste my time as you won’t believe it anyway. If chomsky said that, it’s good enough for me.
If you want to put up KKK and Neo Nazi stuff up that is your choice.
I can assure I won’t be interested as I find their views quite mundane and antiquated, but I don’t think they should be banned from expressing an opinion even though I don’t agree with their views. If you ban things you are advocating a Fascist or Communist way of thinking or any other extremity for that matter.
But not that Indonesian terrorists murdered 200 Westerners in Bali. You are as balanced as a fat man eating pie on a tightrope.
When there is proof that Indonesian terrorists murdered 200 people in Bali, when there is unquestionable evidence I will admit that they did it, but there is no proof that they did, just like there is no proof Bin Laden was responsible for 9/11.
And don’t go posting CNN, etc misinformation (or should I say bullshit) that just because police or government say it is true that it is. How anyone could believe Mohammed Atta’s passport was found outside the rubble of the WTC is beyond me.
Personally I don’t think we will ever get the full picture as to who caused these atrocities.
I assume Lump you are from Austrailia, you should check out the Australian journalist John Pilger:
johnpilger.com
I just finished a great book of his about Australia called ‘A secret Country’. The CIA supported coup in the 1970s was fascinating reading.
Of course you like Pilger - he’s just Chomsky with bad hair. No evidence of Indonesian terrorists… OK, right. I’ve been brainwashed again.
Beam me up Scooby-doo… how’s life on Alpha Centauri?
Piger actually states facts. That is it facts, he uses facts, that is why I admire such people.
There is no way I can take serious the Indonesian government when it arrests someone and then accuses then of something.
In the west there is a long history of miscarriages of justice. So what would make Indonesia any different?
The US uses torture in Cuba with innocent prisoners so imagine what goes on in Indonesia.
No one has been charged for the bali bomb attack if there was enough evidence, surely there would be someone charged.
Yes there are suspects, but they could round up any Islamic nutter and claim he is guilty and if they have no evidence and with foreign pressure they could resort to doing just that. What is the price to pay for a few Islamic nutters being executed if it means your tourist industy gets back on track.