Padauk is from Africa.
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What Forumosa needs is a heated tonewood discussion xD
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But can you put that on a guitar?
Yes, even without a luthier. [Edit: removable decals of all kinds including just fret marker dots for the fret centers (e.g. frets 3, 5, 7), side markers (same but as tiny dots on the top edge of the fretboard facing the guitarist when playing with the top pointed straight at the music score or audience), headstock and even body. So you can have a luthier do permanent inlay, which I recommend but which costs $, or get decals later, and change them when bored, LOL]
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(Iām having trouble figuring out the new quote function, so bear with me; Iāll edit this for proper formatting when I figure it out or someone explains it to me, LOL)
TL wrote āSure, I can paint the guitar any color you want. Though to be honest with you not sure why you would want to cover such beautiful wood with paintā¦ most painted guitars are plywood junk that doesnāt look good to begin with.ā
Yes, if itās really paint, on an acoustic or classical, I agree. Edit: Paint is for toy guitars only IMO (hereās one I painted for my elder sonās birthday, years ago).
It deadens the sound, too. Stain OTOH is a different matter; there are nice stained ones. And some woods sound great as tops, or backs and sides, but donāt have a particular beauty, right? Iād never have a painted classical, as it would hurt the sound on an acoustic or classical, but stained, sure. My son would kill for a 21.25" 3/4-scale classical (requinto) with a plain-looking but acoustically stunning tone wood and plain sides & back, but stained a nice medium blue.
(crusher wrote) > āTo give some perspective on prices. A very good Blue Grass guitar is called a Martin. The D28 is particularly good. I lost a bidding war 6 months ago on a second hand one going for 40, 000. New ones go for around 100 to 120, 000 NTD. On the other hand you can get much cheaper factory guitars for a few thousand.ā
Iāll second that (except that the nice sounding factory guitars Iāve played donāt even start until $15,000 NT, and those arenāt classicals. A Baby Taylor BT2 mahogany is and example of what I mean by āniceā. What I tried in four or so stores here, years ago, in classicals played like crap, and I tried ones all the way up into the high 20ās.). His prices are placed pretty much spot for a hand made one. Well in fact cheap because he is not famous.
Iāll second that. The prices are appropriate. Handmade guitars sound better than most things way below that price, and a luthier classical made in Taiwan was priced at $110,000-$120,000 12+ years ago; a really SWEET one in Mexico cost me half that simply because it was an extra on hand the luthier hadnāt been able to sell or had for customers to try before commissioning, it had a minor flaw, and he was probably short on cash that month. And it was Mexico, and he was in an out of the way place. If I hadnāt bought that one Iād jump at the chance of Taiwan Luthierās at this price. Heās done setup work for me before, by the way.
Another poster wrote something about only pros wanting luthier guitars.
I really have to differ. Not only advanced or professional players will want a luthier-made guitar. Even when I was just (re)beginning classical guitar (Iād played a bit at age 11), I hated the poor sustain, mediocre sound, and poor playability on the many guitars I tried in the $10-$25,000 price range at about four shops here in Taiwan. I wasnāt very skilled technically, but that didnāt matter. I have ears and the sound matters a lot to me. Having one that really sings, with warmth or bell-tone trebles, one that has excellent sustain, and is just downright gorgeous, motivated me to play more. It is a joy each time you pull it out of the case and get ready to play.
And part of the goal in learning technique and in learning music is seeing how beautiful a sound you can make, from the very start. Only a solid top, carefully individually selected and properly braced, with the right finish, can get you there. So no, I disagree with an earlier poster that only advanced or professional guitarists will want one; anyone who plans to continue seriously, even if theyāre just a low intermediate player, should consider investing in a decent instrument. I played a LOT of classical guitars in stores 10-12 years ago, and none ever came close to the artisan work that a luthier does, crafting the instruments one by one. Not just in sound, but in aesthetics and playability.
I think one thing that will help, TL, is if you can finish a couple, or a few (I know itās tough, given the up-front material cost in your present situation) to keep on hand so that serious potential buyers can stop by and try them. Could be an acoustic with stunning wood, a pair of classicals like cedar and German spruce tops with just the very best tops, nitro finish, clean and simple, with awesome sound, whatever. Some people may then buy the already made ones rather than commissioning. Or they may trust your quality after seeing and playing what you make, and then commission a guitar. You need to somehow work up a portfolio of work to show, with some available to try. I realize it may be tough to do this given your finances and the cost of materials. I donāt think most people have any idea what just a premium quality Englemann spruce top costs the luthier (edit: I mean, itās not huge, but itās more than a really cheap guitar, and thatās just one piece of the guitar (ok, well, maybe two, being split) or how incredibly much time and labor is involved not just in making one but in learning the craft.
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You donāt want to use ivory anyway, to protect endangered species, and because in theory Customs can confiscate your guitar if it has banned endangered woods or ivory parts, so bye-bye $120,000 NT.
There is fossil ivory. CITES do not extend to extinct animals.
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Youād probably need to carry paperwork at customs for fossil Ivory. Does the Ivory ban include items made with ivory over 50 years ago or antiques ?
Iām not saying that it doesnāt happen, but Iād like to see hard evidence of paint killing the timber or the sustain in an acoustic guitar. Again, that might be the case, but Iāve seen, read, and heard so much bullshit about guitar materials and construction that Iām becoming much more skeptical about all these claims.
I guess it all depends on the hardness and other mechanical properties of the CURED paint applied. You can see, for example, that there are new models out there made out of carbon fiber, which cannot be used without using, yes, a resin, to put all the layers together. However because it looks cool, and he material isnāt cheap, probably that makes people more accepting and say it sounds great.
Acoustic guitars are not electric guitars, I know this very well, but you can find lots of BS claims in that domain and even reputable builders swear by this or that other material. Then someone puts together a crappy build that doesnāt even look as a guitar, and it sounds well. But some people will still say they hear the differenceā¦ until thereās a blind test.
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I think looks do matter in some way too, and thatās what paint does, make an otherwise ugly piece of wood look good. But plywood will sound bad because of how strong it is.
However at least for me I try to engineer the guitar to be easy to repair, that means avoiding expensive repair bill 10 years down the road.
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Yes.
Hmmm I donāt see why. Why? Plywood would normally sound bad because of the poor consistency and strength of the material; itās not a tight material so it normally muffle the sound. But if itās āstrongā, or hard enough, or has the right physical properties? why not?
Thatās something good.
It would depend on the material the plywood is made of. For example double top (two tops with a nomex honeycomb in between) is technically plywood but they sound great.
Really a guitar top needs to be lightweight but strong. Plywood is strong, but it is also heavy as hell. Also a guitar top needs certain amount of strength. Strong enough to resist the string tension but not so strong that it canāt vibrate.
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That makes sense.
I would avoid plywood however because I donāt think itās a durable material. Also, for mere snobism. I do want my guitars to be made of nice and nice looking materials, even if I totally suck at guitar haha.
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Just know plywood is used because theyāre cheapā¦
Of course. Same as the fenders were made out of the cheapest woods available too, yet you have lots of wankers saying that those woods are the right ones for the sound etcā¦ I donāt think Leo was thinking of ātonewoodsā but of costs and availability.
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Leo Fender doesnāt even play guitars. His expertise is more in fixing amps and radios. He was definitely thinking about cost when he chose to use ash and maple for the material. In fact the CBS Fenders had a veneer of rosewood over the fingerboard, instead of a slab of wood.
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I know he didnāt play guitar, yet he engineered good instruments. Lots of great guitarists play Fender and MusicMan.
The wood is important for which kind of sound you wish to hear. In the video above I blind tested and tried to guess the wood and got it wrong lol.
Anyway I like very dark woody sounds for blues.
I want the guitar to sound like a pine forest (yes that metaphor makes no sense to others but it does to me). Just like @mad_masala said itās very subjective. I even believe an accoustic guitar plays better the more played , and older it gets.
Taiwan Luthiers and me were talking about putting a goat skin head on my banjo.He suggested due to the high humidity here itās not a good idea. And heās right , but I was more worried about the spirit of the dead goat haunting my instrument.
Anyway for guitars I like that deep woody sounds. I think Mahogony back and sides with Spruce top is probably a good one for a jack of all trades guitar.
In Japan they put cat skins on banjosā¦ maybe the spirit of the cat would haunt you.
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Have you played or heard cedar tops? I got to play a conservatory-class cedar top from a skilled maker, and that was quite special. I particularly like the sound of the mahogany of the Baby Taylor 2, too. But my Englemann spruce top is the sweetest.
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