Funny, I was just reading an article over lunch titled. 回歸的結局; 你當家, 我做諸 Guess who was the pig? Seems not all are so happy in with the current state of affairs.
[quote]How so? People on this board can’t even agree if I’m Chinese or an American yet.[/quote] Irrelevant
[quote]frequent flyer miles I’ve racked up over the years[/quote] Your own ego talking
[quote]Chinese is ac_dropout? [/quote] Irrelevant
[quote]A CCP lap dog[/quote] Quite possibly, certainly you are an apologist.
[quote]To what extent is the western media at the time responsible for the scare?[/quote] Not much. That’s blaming the messenger.
[quote]Did western perspection of the PRC cause Hongers to misjudge what HK has become under SAR? [/quote] So Honkies have no opinions of their own? Most people had enough contact with the other side to know what was going on. Of course, if you knew anything about HKG you might know this.
[quote]Did PRC learn from western coverage of 6/4 on how to manage HK properly under SAR?[/quote] You call SARS in HKG or China proper managment?
It does not matter one whit what your nationality is, what is of concern is your propagandist attitude and your petty blatantly racist diatribes.
And HK is full of people who know how to apply foundation correctly? FFS, what is the relevance of a bunch of metrosexual’s facial treatments to the important things of life, things like liberty, freedom of information and faith, freedom of organization, and so on, all of whoch have nose-dived in HK under Chinese rule. I am so glad that the HK fashionista have discovered the virtues of make-up, this is the most stunning advance in human morality and civilisation since the invention of the sword. And of course we have the CCP to thank for it. I doff my hat to you, Oh Grand Pooh Bah Troll.
metrosexuals? effete poseurs might be more realistic a term for you. one glaringly obvious fact that you neglect to factor in to your idle idolatry is that people who are more concerned with the way they look and the minutiae of fashion and face and appearance over substance tend to be the very same people who are more comfortable with cover-ups, deception, fraud, and general denial of the truth in all walks of their life. perhaps this defines you more than you realise?
[quote=“urodacus”]It does not matter one whit what your nationality is, what is of concern is your propagandist attitude and your petty blatantly racist diatribes.
And HK is full of people who know how to apply foundation correctly? FFS, what is the relevance of a bunch of metrosexual’s facial treatments to the important things of life, things like liberty, freedom of information and faith, freedom of organization, and so on, all of whoch have nose-dived in HK under Chinese rule. I am so glad that the HK fashionista have discovered the virtues of make-up, this is the most stunning advance in human morality and civilisation since the invention of the sword. And of course we have the CCP to thank for it. I doff my hat to you, Oh Grand Pooh Bah Troll.
metrosexuals? effete poseurs might be more realistic a term for you. one glaringly obvious fact that you neglect to factor in to your idle idolatry is that people who are more concerned with the way they look and the minutiae of fashion and face and appearance over substance tend to be the very same people who are more comfortable with cover-ups, deception, fraud, and general denial of the truth in all walks of their life. perhaps this defines you more than you realise?[/quote]
Ever hear of misdirection. What was the point of all that? Still way off topic. But thanks for the insights to your insecurities.
Let’s just say I’m a white guy, pretending to be Chinese, from New York City.
After reading reports of USA economy going into a recession and political instability because of the war in the news, especially the Chinese newspapers, I decided to move my family to Asia. Effective immigrating to HK. The company I work for sends me out to Guangdong to manage a factory there. So for the next 10 years I spend my time between the mainland and HK.
The political gloom over the USA has passed, and another economic boom in the service sector comes again. All my peers that stayed in the USA are doing as well, or even better than me. At least many of them don’t need to stay 4 days out of the week away from their families. My kids’ Chinese are not great, since neither my wife nor I know Chinese that well. Their English skills are marginal since they were schooled in Asia. But they get entry level white collar jobs to ease our worries about their future.
My wife never really assimilates into Chinese mainstream life. But she has been very supportive of our decision to live in Asia. Even though I still fantasize about her sister in New Jersey, which has become our running joke among those that know us.
So a NY Times reporter does a story on us one day. I give an upbeat tale of our situation. But my wife and my adult children tell a tale of “regret.” Of having missed out on the economic boom in the USA and living a possible “normal” as some of our peers are living now.
Now the question being can my wife and children have a legitimate regret based on the information we had at the time provided by various news sources?
And to pre-emptively respond to your response, I know it was pretty racist of me to pretend to be a Chinese guy when I’m really white.
Ever hear of misdirection. What was the point of all that? Still way off topic. But thanks for the insights to your insecurities.
Let’s just say I’m a white guy, pretending to be Chinese, from New York City.
After reading reports of USA economy going into a recession and political instability because of the war in the news, especially the Chinese newspapers, I decided to move my family to Asia. Effective immigrating to HK. The company I work for sends me out to Guangdong to manage a factory there. So for the next 10 years I spend my time between the mainland and HK.
The political gloom over the USA has passed, and another economic boom is the service sector comes again. All my peers that stayed in the USA are doing as well, or even better than me. At least many of them don’t need to stay 4 days out of the week away from their families. My kids’ Chinese are not great, since neither my wife nor I know Chinese that well. Their English skills are marginal since they were schooled in Asia. But they get entry level white collar jobs to ease our worries about their future.
My wife never really assimilates into Chinese mainstream life. But she has been very supportive of our decision to live in Asia. Even though I still fantasize about her sister in New Jersey, which has become our running joke among those that know us.
So a NY Times reporter does a story on us one day. I give an upbeat tale of our situation. But my wife and my adult children tell a tale of “regret.” Of having missed out on the economic boom in the USA and living a possible “normal” as some of our peers are living now.
Now the question being can my wife and children have a legitimate regret based on the information we had at the time provided by various news sources?
And to pre-emptively respond to your response, I know it was pretty racist of me to pretend to be a Chinese guy when I’m really white.[/quote]
Well…if that be the case then I guess you’re fucked
[quote]But here are some accounts of Chinese that regret buying into white media hype that the PRC would oppress HK.
I wonder how much white media hype influence occurs in Taiwan over the possibility of reunification. How many Taiwanese will live with future regret because the listened to some foreigner lament about having closer political relationships with the PRC?[/quote]
I dunno, do you still think it is legitimate to blame “white media hype”? You’ve been soundly thrashed on this score, so what is your point? Right, you don’t have one.
[quote=“ac_dropout”]
Let’s just say I’m a white guy, pretending to be Chinese, from New York City.
After reading reports of USA economy going into a recession and political instability because of the war in the news, especially the Chinese newspapers, I decided to move my family to Asia. Effective immigrating to HK. The company I work for sends me out to Guangdong to manage a factory there. So for the next 10 years I spend my time between the mainland and HK.
The political gloom over the USA has passed, and another economic boom in the service sector comes again. All my peers that stayed in the USA are doing as well, or even better than me. At least many of them don’t need to stay 4 days out of the week away from their families. My kids’ Chinese are not great, since neither my wife nor I know Chinese that well. Their English skills are marginal since they were schooled in Asia. But they get entry level white collar jobs to ease our worries about their future.
My wife never really assimilates into Chinese mainstream life. But she has been very supportive of our decision to live in Asia. Even though I still fantasize about her sister in New Jersey, which has become our running joke among those that know us.
So a NY Times reporter does a story on us one day. I give an upbeat tale of our situation. But my wife and my adult children tell a tale of “regret.” Of having missed out on the economic boom in the USA and living a possible “normal” as some of our peers are living now.
Now the question being can my wife and children have a legitimate regret based on the information we had at the time provided by various news sources?
And to pre-emptively respond to your response, I know it was pretty racist of me to pretend to be a Chinese guy when I’m really white.[/quote]ac -
Looks like you’re still posting bull droppings. Every thing you’ve posted is “qualified” in one way or another for an easy dismissal by you if called on it.
Waste of bandwidth.
The point still stands. 10 years have passed and HK is still more or less the same. Where is the doom and gloom the western media predicted? Obviously a host of posters here don’t fear the PLA rolling tanks in HK to fulfill their ambition of being the next “tank man.”
Seems like all those visas issued during the 1997 scare was just to make money off the well-to-do people in adminstration fees and future income tax.
I’ll take your logical leap in my stride and presume you are linking the supposed concerns aired by the western media to those seeking visas for elsewhere. No need to thank me, I clean up shitty logic for a job.
Now perhaps you could please prove how it was the western media that sparked these concerns in HK’s Chinese population? You’ve been challenged and knocked down on this race related point repeatedly. This distinction exists solely in your racist head. If not, prove me wrong. I will be waiting.
As for HK being the same, there is considerable evidence that simply isn’t true, right down to the recent hearings regarding political interference in academia, which saw the appropriately named Fanny Law resign, and was swiftly followed up with the politically motivated refusal to re-appoint the HKIED head today. If you’d care to look, press freedom has suffered significantly, and then of course we have Sars.
Another racially driven and pointless crock of shit.
without getting into the above debate, my 2cents are based on personal knowledge of actual HK persons and why THOSE PARTICULAR PERSONS immigrated ante-97 to US, Cda, and Aus.
The parents fled from the Communists themselves, or their grandparents did.
In the 60s, a lot of people in HKG heard rumours coming over the border of persecutions, arrests, beatings, killings, etc. This was later identified as the Cultural Revolution.
Thus, it was real fear stemming from past experiences or rumours about the Communists. Chief in mind for some were their memory of class-based persecutions by the Communists of teachers, intelligentsia, landowners, merchants, etc.
This is exactly the point. In the years leading to '97, there was slow, steady progress on political reform, and it was desperately needed. There has been none since. No steps forward, but instead many steps sideways. No substantive change whatsoever has happened, and economically, there has been increasing collusion between government and business. How in the hell is it a positive thing for a place to be at a dead standstill politically for ten years?
Do/did HKers generally take their news and information from the western media that’s in English, French, German etc?
Or do/did they take news and info from the Chinese language media?
Why would Cantonese speaking HKers be taking info from English language media and believing it, causing them to leave HK if all the Chinese language media said things would be ok. Doesn’t make sense.
There is anecdotal evidence that there are people living in regret having moved abroad from HK. Read the article in my first post. Those are the facts right there.
Are you saying that they aren’t living in regret? That they didn’t waste their money, time, and youth going abroad.
While those that remained in HK, like you, have become more prosperous under PRC administration. Still better than Taiwan, right?
Jack Burton,
But a majority of people in HK rarely traveled to the mainland because they lived behind the “bamboo curtain” erected by those democratic British. Economic reform started in 1978 in the mainland. There was limited travel to the Guangdong with 1-day visa from HK started in the 80’s.
The Cultural Revolution was from 1966 to 1969. You can extend it to 1974. That’s more than 20 years before the handover.
Some people here want to bring up 6/4, but I don’t see the point, since the vast majority of Hongers didn’t participate in 6/4. In 1989 any reasonable Hongers knows that they would need to protest with the UK for democracy, not the PRC. Not as if the British never used any violence or devious institutional rules to keep control over the masses.
Up to 1997 most Hongers saw the British as oppressive as the PRC. Resentment our fellow gwailo posters in HK probably experienced first hand during their extended stay in HK.
So I contend the media played a role in promoting the idea that HK apocalypse was going to happen. Since the mis-information had to come for somewhere?
Funny that you would make this statement, considering you blatantly ignored Lord Lucan’s questions about HK newspapers in 1989. When you couldn’t come up with any, Tempo Gain listed a few. The premise of your argument is that it was the western media who “overplayed” 6/4, thereby causing panic among Hong Kongers. But these two posters have told you there were plenty of HK media sources reporting on the 6/4 events, with publication titles and dates. Unless you can address their points, it is clear your argument rests on a faulty premise. And you lose (even more) credibility.
This is exactly the point. In the years leading to '97, there was slow, steady progress on political reform, and it was desperately needed. There has been none since. No steps forward, but instead many steps sideways. No substantive change whatsoever has happened, and economically, there has been increasing collusion between government and business. How in the hell is it a positive thing for a place to be at a dead standstill politically for ten years?[/quote]
That’s actually a very good point. I think for the most part in this instance it is not about HK per say. It is about the needed political reforms on the mainland to occur before further reforms can occur in HK.
Critics of the SARS would say that is meddling on PRC part and that this interference was not suppose to occur for another 40 years. But one can also see that the reality of the 2 systems, 1 county paradigm has a limit to how much difference it can sustain between the 2 systems. The key difference being universal suffrage that some HK leadership has been promoting. Given that the ROC is the only other Chinese government with universal suffrage, it is no wonder PRC might hesitate at this reform, without ensuring that they have the political infrastructure to manage the process.
However, I personally believe the PRC is trying to win over the loyalties of the Hongers as the primary goal now. The CCP have seen how the UK failed at doing this during their administration of the territories. Seen from that perspective these “sidesteps,” as you call them, seem to make a lot of sense. However, from the perspective of instituting eventual universal suffrage, no solid progress has been made.
Do/did HKers generally take their news and information from the western media that’s in English, French, German etc?
Or do/did they take news and info from the Chinese language media?
Why would Cantonese speaking HKers be taking info from English language media and believing it, causing them to leave HK if all the Chinese language media said things would be ok. Doesn’t make sense.[/quote]
Because they are lazy in HK, so its all mostly translations of the AP, Reuters, etc.; when it comes to international news.
Funny that you would make this statement, considering you blatantly ignored Lord Lucan’s questions about HK newspapers in 1989. When you couldn’t come up with any, Tempo Gain listed a few. The premise of your argument is that it was the western media who “overplayed” 6/4, thereby causing panic among Hong Kongers. But these two posters have told you there were plenty of HK media sources reporting on the 6/4 events, with publication titles and dates. Unless you can address their points, it is clear your argument rests on a faulty premise. And you lose (even more) credibility.[/quote]
Apple Daily, that’s four news sources, I’ve mentioned throughout the thread. However, Apple ciculation wasn’t as large back then. I remember when they started out because of the celebrity news. Not to mention Apple is the king of shock journalism in HK.
The other two papers Jive Turkey mentioned are pro-CCP papers that started before WWI and WWII on the mainland and moved HK. They are not seen as the most balance paper when it comes to reporting on CCP in HK.
So they’re pro-CCP papers…that accurately reported on the brutality of 6/4? Your statement is a complete non sequitor.
I’ll try again. You claim that Hong Kongers were whipped up into a frightened frenzy by the Western, anti-CCP media. Lord Lucan and Tempo Gain quoted you Chinese language newspaper titles and dates that reported truthfully on the 6/4 massacre, thereby disproving your premise. Do you understand?
