No question is off limits. Are you married? Do you have kids? How much is your salary? How much is your rent? Why do you come all the way to Taiwan to work? Can’t you get work back home? What do you do here for a living? I normally get that from total strangers (taxi drivers, random shop assistants, etc) My colleagues, mercifully are open-minded, well-traveled, respect each other’s privacy and hardly ever asks such inane questions. Come to think of it, all of my Taiwanese colleagues have either studied or worked abroad before. Maybe that’s the difference!
[quote=“twonavels”]Nihonjin, I don’t think that Indiana really thinks that Taiwanese girls are too thin and weak. She’s saying that she reverses every question, e.g. if someone asks her why do Western women like exercise and having muscles, she would ask why do Taiwanese women like to be thin and weak.
The point is to answer their stupid question with another stupid question.[/quote]
That’s exactly what I meant…throwing it back at them.
Stupid questions deserve stupid responses, or another stupid question. That’s the only way to make them realize exactly how stupid they are being!
No question is off limits. Are you married? Do you have kids? How much is your salary? How much is your rent? Why do you come all the way to Taiwan to work? Can’t you get work back home? What do you do here for a living? I normally get that from total strangers (taxi drivers, random shop assistants, etc) My colleagues, mercifully are open-minded, well-traveled, respect each other’s privacy and hardly ever asks such inane questions. Come to think of it, all of my Taiwanese colleagues have either studied or worked abroad before. Maybe that’s the difference![/quote]
Living/studying abroad makes a HUGE difference…
I met a really great Taiwanese woman once who I sat and conversed with all night at a party. She did her Bachelor’s in the US, Masters in the UK and is preparing to go abroad again for her PhD.
Do you know why I liked her so much? She had something to SAY. She was interesting and she was interested in my point of view without giggling at me or being obnoxious or critical. And, I really enjoyed listening to her point of view on many things. It was the first time I had a real conversation with a Taiwanese person. You know what I mean.
If we lived closer, I know we would hang out together now and then. I was so excited to meet a Taiwanese woman who had interests other than shopping/gossiping/cosmetics/handbags etc. that I went on about her to my husband the whole next day!
Taiwanese people can be very nice…yes, that’s true. But I have to ask myself, why don’t I have any true local friends here after 5 years? I mean, I see some of the same people (spouses of friends, coworkers, etc.) on a weekly, sometimes even a daily basis, but I don’t care for them or trust them enough to ever call them friends.
And I’m the gal who was voted “Most Friendly” in my senior year of high school. I have travelled around a bit and lived/worked in Europe, Africa, and the Middle East before coming here. In all places, I made lifelong local friends (women and men) who I am still in contact with to this day.
I’m not the only one…this is a popular topic amongst many of the foreign women I know, from western countries as well as from the Philippines and Japan.
I’d love to hear from more foreign women out there…how many of you really have good local female friends here? I don’t mean acquaintances/coworkers, I mean real friends??? 
well, i have been for so long in taiwan
but i never had taiwanese education except Univ.
since i was a little…
me and my korean friends are only able to hang with…
never could get well with taiwanese students…
well… what can I say ?
i love taiwan, and i love chinese culture…
but not for the friends who can talk heart by heart…
thinking so different way…
if u go to other country… if u live there for long…
u will find out someday…u are still hanging with taiwanese who if from Taiwan …
maybe then u can understand what i am having trouble with…
maybe we dont know what you really feel.
But I still hope you could find a good friend.
Good luck.
[quote=“Indiana”][quote=“twonavels”]Nihonjin, I don’t think that Indiana really thinks that Taiwanese girls are too thin and weak. She’s saying that she reverses every question, e.g. if someone asks her why do Western women like exercise and having muscles, she would ask why do Taiwanese women like to be thin and weak.
The point is to answer their stupid question with another stupid question.[/quote]
That’s exactly what I meant…throwing it back at them.
Stupid questions deserve stupid responses, or another stupid question. That’s the only way to make them realize exactly how stupid they are being![/quote]
I get the point. Sorry for making stupid remark. 
However, I doubt if they understand what you really mean by throwing the stupid question back to them. As their “stupid” questions are not “stupid” to them, they may take your “stupid” questions seriously.
Doesn’t it make you even more frustrated?
Someone asked me how old I was without hesitation, and I answered, “Don’t I look young for 45?” (I was 30 at that time)
She said, “Really?? You look very young at your age!” 
Grrrrr…I regret being sarcastic. I should have told her “that’s a top secret!”, instead.
[quote=“nihonjin”][quote=“Indiana”][quote=“twonavels”]Nihonjin, I don’t think that Indiana really thinks that Taiwanese girls are too thin and weak. She’s saying that she reverses every question, e.g. if someone asks her why do Western women like exercise and having muscles, she would ask why do Taiwanese women like to be thin and weak.
The point is to answer their stupid question with another stupid question.[/quote]
That’s exactly what I meant…throwing it back at them.
Stupid questions deserve stupid responses, or another stupid question. That’s the only way to make them realize exactly how stupid they are being![/quote]
I get the point. Sorry for making stupid remark.
However, I doubt if they understand what you really mean by throwing the stupid question back to them. As their “stupid” questions are not “stupid” to them, they may take your “stupid” questions seriously.
Doesn’t it make you even more frustrated?
Someone asked me how old I was without hesitation, and I answered, “Don’t I look young for 45?” (I was 30 at that time)
She said, “Really?? You look very young at your age!”
Grrrrr…I regret being sarcastic. I should have told her “that’s a top secret!”, instead.[/quote]
That’s a funny story. Yes, I know what you mean…sarcasm isn’t really part of Taiwanese humor…it just confuses people!!! 
[quote=“Indiana”][quote=“nihonjin”][quote=“Indiana”][quote=“twonavels”]Nihonjin, I don’t think that Indiana really thinks that Taiwanese girls are too thin and weak. She’s saying that she reverses every question, e.g. if someone asks her why do Western women like exercise and having muscles, she would ask why do Taiwanese women like to be thin and weak.
The point is to answer their stupid question with another stupid question.[/quote]
That’s exactly what I meant…throwing it back at them.
Stupid questions deserve stupid responses, or another stupid question. That’s the only way to make them realize exactly how stupid they are being![/quote]
I get the point. Sorry for making stupid remark.
However, I doubt if they understand what you really mean by throwing the stupid question back to them. As their “stupid” questions are not “stupid” to them, they may take your “stupid” questions seriously.
Doesn’t it make you even more frustrated?
Someone asked me how old I was without hesitation, and I answered, “Don’t I look young for 45?” (I was 30 at that time)
She said, “Really?? You look very young at your age!”
Grrrrr…I regret being sarcastic. I should have told her “that’s a top secret!”, instead.[/quote]
That’s a funny story. Yes, I know what you mean…sarcasm isn’t really part of Taiwanese humor…it just confuses people!!! [/quote]
Thats true.We are always serious what you said.
so dont tease us thats better. 
I have some real good Taiwanese girl friends. It’s not all about shopping and make up etc, but I admit it’s hard to find.
now i tell them all " that’s top secrats ! " 
and i think my another korean co-worker… she doing much better fit in taiwanese culture…
maybe coz her husband is taiwanese…
when she and me alone… she act like korean… and she also enjoy drinks…
and talk about sexual joke and what did she done with her husband before marry etc… very Hot topic 
but one day i was very shock… coz when other taiwanese co-worker there with us having lunch 2gether…
she was telling them " i was totally vergine before marry with my husband "
and i accidently reply… i thought she was joke … so
" u were living with her husband for 3 yrs before marry ! "
and her face turned like " :fume: " and
she said " no i didn’t ! we only kiss "
i was totally 
then i think i start to learn from her !! 
[quote=“sara8888”] now i tell them all " that’s top secrats ! "
and I think my another Korean co-worker… she doing much better fit in Taiwanese culture…
maybe coz her husband is Taiwanese…
when she and me alone… she act like Korean… and she also enjoy drinks…
and talk about sexual joke and what did she done with her husband before marry etc… very Hot topic
but one day I was very shock… coz when other Taiwanese co-worker there with us having lunch 2gether…
she was telling them " I was totally vergine before marry with my husband "
and i accidently reply… I thought she was joke … so
" u were living with her husband for 3 yrs before marry ! "
and her face turned like " :fume: " and
she said " no I didn’t ! we only kiss "
I was totally
then I think i start to learn from her !! [/quote]
Possibly they harbour feelings that the benefit to be gained from living their own rather cramped lifestyles are not worth the sacrifices they are making. And when they see you doing what they themselves would like to do, but can’t, it makes them feel rather insecure. Perhaps they remove this feeling of insecurity by forming a little clique and excluding you, criticising your lifestyle, and this gives them the degree of self-affirmation they need to carry on.
On the other hand, maybe they just don’t like you. I have to say that when there were lots of Korean students here, and I was a student too, I found the Koreans the most stand-offish and insular people I had ever met. They would only talk to other Koreans, never mind actually going to eat together or anything like that, and therefore I am astonished to find a Korean girl with a European boyfriend posting in English on a Taiwan expat website. Perhaps you are just noticing what it is like to be a foreigner here, but you feel you shouldn’t be treated this way because you’ve been here so long and speak the language. What I mean is that it is just a matter of perception. Like my previous perception that Koreans are very unfriendly to the point almost of xenophobia. I was obviously hanging out with the wrong people… [Actually I’m just bitter and jealous because all the Korean girls at university were beautiful and none of them would even speak to me. HAHAHA. Oops. ]
Perhaps you are hanging out with some very immature people who have led very sheltered lives. Oh anyway you’re off to Greece. Where were you 12 years ago gaddammit!!!
Good luck. 
Taiwanese are some of the most hypocritical people when it comes to sex. This is an island with brothels and ‘sexy’ KTVs on almost every corner, with a high abortion rate, where most of the male Taiwanese brag and wink about cheating on their wives, but women are supposed to pretend to be virgins until they’re married. It’s beyond obvious that the Taiwanese girls you hang out with are jealous of your freedom to do as you please without having to worry about busybodies gossipping about how “bad” you are for drinking and having sex like a normal human being. Taiwanese women are in general, repressed, and they wish and dream that they could be as free as Western women. No wonder “Sex and the City” is so wildly popular here - it’s every Taiwanese girl’s fantasy to be like that. The main problem is that many Taiwanese love to gossip way too much, and as a foreigner you are a major source of juicy innuendo, because all foreigners are weird and dirty. If you drink, you’re an alcoholic; if you admit that you’re not a virgin, you’re a total slut, in their eyes.
I agree on answering their questions back. When someone asked me how old I am I tell them my age, and then i ask the same back. Some of the ladies were quite flabbergasted! Same thing when it comes to pay, etc… Also, I have become much more careful about co-workers. I thought the girl I worked with could be considered a friend. One day she was complaining about this and that, mostly her job. I also did a little bit of complaining. big mistake. she told my boss everything, but actually when she translated our conversation from english to chinese she completely mixed everything up. then my boss confronted me and asked me what was going on. man.
sara8888, if you have to lie in order to fit in with your “friends”, then they aren’t your friends. And it’s rather tiring and bothersome to have “friends” like that.
It’s more like having a bunch of spiteful enemies. :loco:
In other words, just stay away from them. (BITCH! :raspberry: )
I have found Taiwanese girl friends, but they are rare. I find them usually playing a sport I enjoy. At least you know it’s not one of those girls who are scared of sweating because it’ll ruin their make up or become tanned from the sun.
So go out and have fun, take up activities you enjoy, you’ll find people who are more like you in those types of settings.
Workplaces are the hardest place to look for friends. Too much going on.
Everyone has their own agendas.
I disagree with this. I know some seriously awful people here that have been educated overseas. Indeed, many of them are faculty at some of this island’s best schools, and they are about as narrow-minded and ethnocentric as you can get. I worked in academe here as a research fellow through 2002-2003, and by the end of my stretch came-out feeling totally used and abused. For a fair chunk of the educated elite in Taiwan, a foreign face with a degree is an ‘opportunity’ - to practice their spoken English, to make contacts in foreign lands, to edit their badly constructed and researched articles for publication in offshore journals… These are not nice people.
On the other hand, my closest friend here is a bus driver who calls me and my SO ‘Taiwanese’ without a hint of sarcasm in his voice (we’re both Ozzies). Mr Pan and his wife are worth a hundred of the foreign educated punks I’ve been forced to deal with over the years.
I disagree with this. I know some seriously awful people here that have been educated overseas. Indeed, many of them are faculty at some of this island’s best schools, and they are about as narrow-minded and ethnocentric as you can get. I worked in academe here as a research fellow through 2002-2003, and by the end of my stretch came-out feeling totally used and abused. For a fair chunk of the educated elite in Taiwan, a foreign face with a degree is an ‘opportunity’ - to practice their spoken English, to make contacts in foreign lands, to edit their badly constructed and researched articles for publication in offshore journals… These are not nice people.
On the other hand, my closest friend here is a bus driver who calls me and my SO ‘Taiwanese’ without a hint of sarcasm in his voice (we’re both Ozzies). Mr Pan and his wife are worth a hundred of the foreign educated punks I’ve been forced to deal with over the years.[/quote]
Yeah, I can’t disagree with you as I haven’t met a whole lot of overseas educated Taiwanese where I live in Taiwan, but the few I have met have been a lot more pleasant to converse with. But, I can imagine that the academic circles you have encountered have been rather unpleasant.
My husband works at a university here and has been asked to help edit some of their papers that are being sent overseas for publication…whoa, lots of plagarized garbage…but he is always being asked to do it for free, and at the last minute. So yes, I have seen that tendency to try and “use” foreigners when possible.
I guess the overseas educated people I have met in a social setting have been easier to talk with, though. They seem to have broader interests and a greater understanding of the works of other cultures.
recently i met one taiwanese wife who married korean husband !
she ask about many about korean culture…
she told me her husband dosen’t have any tw friend here…
none friend…
so i told her… i am the same and i understand him…
then men hang out for drinking even… they usually speak taiwanese… and they go to KTV quite often…he can’t sing taiwanese song…
how could her husband will be able to hang well with them someone who can’t speak any taiwanese… ?
i also dun like to go to KTV…
go to ktv is big torture to me
Indiana, I’m just drawing from your post here, you mentioned several times something like, easier to talk to, or some such. Is that because you don’t speak Chinese?
I only have one stream of advice for your husband, dont touch those half-minded Taiwanese plagiarised brain farts for less than a damned reasonable income. Urrrghh!
Umm, Hexuan, you’re not errh, playing Korean are you?
HG
Weird… two of my best friends work at a dumpling stall and have never had the opportunity of overseas education or expensive schooling. They’re two of the most honest, straightforward and kind people you could meet.
I also have some very, very well educated Taiwanese friends who are just as straightforward, honest and kind - but they are all hard workers and generally went through a hard life to get where they are.
Then I have some not-so-good acquaintances who went to the UK/America on mom & dad’s credit card. They studied exclusively on business, design or research courses and spent 99% of their time with fellow Taiwanese - most of which involved complaining about their surrounding environment.
The moral of the story: kids who get spoiled turn out assholes. Taiwanese kids who can afford to study abroad are often spoiled. Hence Taiwanese kids who study abroad are often assholes by nature. Tune in next week for another one of Llary’s Famous Sweeping Generalisations ™.
[quote=“Huang Guang Chen”]Indiana, I’m just drawing from your post here, you mentioned several times something like, easier to talk to, or some such. Is that because you don’t speak Chinese?
I only have one stream of advice for your husband, dont touch those half-minded Taiwanese plagiarised brain farts for less than a damned reasonable income. Urrrghh!
Umm, Hexuan, you’re not errh, playing Korean are you?
HG[/quote]
No, I don’t speak Chinese, and yes, my husband learned his lesson very quickly…now, it’s always. “I’m too busy to help you.”
I should clarify what I said in my previous post about it being easier to talk to folks who have been educated overseas. I guess that I shouldn’t have made such a statement with my limited exposure to those who have actually been educated overseas…after all, I live in a rural area in the south, where I don’t meet too many people like this.
The few that I have met I have had more interesting conversations with than, say, coworkers at my school or other people I have met socially. However, all of those I am thinking of are also a bit older/more mature than say, your 21 year old who was sent abroad on Dad’s credit card. But, I am not saying that it’s solely education that matters; what I was getting more at was the experience of living overseas. Taiwanese people I have met here who have lived overseas, whether it be for schooling or work, have been generally more pleasant to talk to. They seem to be more open and aware of cultural differences. Again, I don’t live in Taipei, so my world is a tad different from what you big city folks experience! I don’t meet people like this all of the time. So, maybe when I do meet people in this area of Taiwan who have lived/studied abroad, they are particularly friendly with me and other foreigners they come across because they have a “connection,” so to speak. That has just been my experience.