It's just too dangerous on a two wheeler in Taiwan

It just isnt worth it to be having your family on a scooter in Taiwan. Inconvenient as it may, I would ban all pillion riders on scooters or motorcycles.

Being on a scooter exposes you and your passengers to incredible danger and at times you may not expect.

Here is a father carrying his two young children, a boy and a girl on a scooter in Kaohsiung. He wasnt speeding and was apparently properly carrying his children.

A van comes and hits them dead on at speeds reportedly over 100 kilometer per hour. ON a city street!

The father and the son were hit and thrown to one side. The father is seriously hurt while his son died. And the driver apparently stopped only because the young girl was being dragged under his van for over 100 meters. The driver pulled her from under his van and then took off at high speed.

I can’t imagine a person more callous. There is a need for the death penalty. And I would sentence this driver to death or at least spending the rest of his life behind bars so he can properly contemplate the monster that he is. Words fail me really to describe this creature.

Unfortunately being on a scoot, and especially exposing your whole family to this is something everyone should avoid at all costs.

youtube.com/watch?v=C49PV-tS46g

1 Like

I agree with you and I wish they were banned. I know that if everyone had a car instead of a scooter the streets would be extremely congested, but I wish they were banned nonetheless. Taiwanese drivers are simply too reckless.

1 Like

Yes it is not worth it. The young girl was only 11 and her brother 13. They were on their way to a bushiban. Their father is 44 and hanging on to life.

The van has been found and the driver is being hunted. He is a known thug, reportedly already on the run from the law.

First lets ban passengers on scoots and motocycles if we cant ban scoots and motorcycles outright.

I would classify this accident as murder second degree. There is no reason to drive at speeds in excess of 100 kilometers per hour on a city street.

Running from the scene will make it First Degree Murder punishable by death if I had my way.

It would be no less logical to ban cars. Intermodal road use increases the risk of accidents, partly because of a phenomenon whereby people identify with other users of their own transport modality, i.e., all scooter drivers think car drivers are assholes, and vice versa. Saying we should ban scooters because there are too many rogue blue truck drivers is a bit like imposing a curfew because there are too many criminals roaming the streets.

Taiwan loves big infrastructure projects (witness the huge, pointless boondoggle heading towards the airport) and it would make sense for some of that cash to be funnelled into state-of-the-art transport systems like PRT, which is a fairly mature if little-used technology. Unfortunately, Taiwan is one of the world’s followers. When the USA - or China - does it first, Taiwan might gently dip its toe in the waters.

1 Like

This is so very sad.

Driving sense where I live in Taoyuan is horrible. I’ve been doing an informal study for the past two and a half months. Whenever I’m on my scooter (which is 6 days per week minimum) I observe how many vehicles–cars, scooters, whatever–run red lights. I don’t count running a red when the light is changing from yellow. I’m talking about a light that has been red for awhile, the rest of us are waiting, and some vehicle just blows right though it.

Since I started keeping track, there have been only six days where I haven’t witnessed at least one idiot running a red light. In my 28 years of driving in the US I never saw as much disregard for traffic signals as I have in the past 2.5 months!

Amazingly, and thankfully, I have yet to see an accident because of this.

All I can do is shake my head in utter disbelief, and try to be the most aware and defensive driver I can be.

Tommy would choose to do one kneejerk thing when the more logical thing to do would be to actually enforce the rules.

I cringe every night when I see my students getting picked up by scooter. They’re lucky if they even get helmets and usually there are 3 of them on a scooter.

No need to go off the deep end suggest banning scooters, and even riders on scooters. Accidents happen. And there’s crappy drivers everywhere in the world. This is a horrible news story, no question about it. But it’s just a knee-jerk reaction (as someone else already mentioned) to think about bans.

[quote=“finley”] Saying we should ban scooters because there are too many rogue blue truck drivers is a bit like imposing a curfew because there are too many criminals roaming the streets.
[/quote]

The general population in Taiwan is full of reckless, idiotic drivers who ignore traffic laws…it’s not just the blue truck drivers!

Well, sure - but the sensible thing to do (as Abacus just said) would be to enforce the traffic laws. Or actually have some traffic laws. And police who know what the laws are. And a driving test.

Not going to happen though, at least not anytime this century. Which is why people start talking about banning things. The logical option just isn’t available.

I still say, though, that the solution would be to use 21st century technology instead of subsidising and supporting some relic from the 19th.

Well, sure - but the sensible thing to do (as Abacus just said) would be to enforce the traffic laws. Or actually have some traffic laws. And police who know what the laws are. And a driving test.

Not going to happen though, at least not anytime this century. Which is why people start talking about banning things. The logical option just isn’t available.

I still say, though, that the solution would be to use 21st century technology instead of subsidising and supporting some relic from the 19th.[/quote]

True…but I think you need more than laws, you need an entire culture change as well. Maybe in the next century, who knows!

This can happen anywhere were a criminal drives a van. Nothing to do with scooters.

I saw a clip were a couple on a scooter, mother holding a baby, was cut of by a car. Mother fell off the bike and couldn’t hold on to the baby. Baby drops on the street. I don’t think anyone was seriously injured, but I think this should be shown to parents all over the country to make them realize that you cannot protect your baby if you fall from a bike, even during a slow-speed accident were you did nothing wrong.

Too many accidents , too many deaths from scooters/motos. Enforcement is not going to happen.

Lives will continue to be lost. There are reportedly ten people dying every day on the streets of Taiwan from accidents. MOre then 2 thirds of them scooter related.

Taiwan society is not going to enforce laws. Taiwan society is not going to ban scoots.

But a major step in the right direction is to forbid anyone else but the rider/driver to be on one.

Scoots should not be used for carrying families. Should not be used for carrying anyone.

They need to remain highly agile, and carrying passengers make most scoots / motos less agile. Less able to avoid accidents.

Also in many cases the passenger is the one that dies.

Some years ago I was with my mother after her brain surgury. There were 2 other patients in the same room with my mom for the week or so after her surgury.

My moms surgury went very well. The same can not be said for the other two patients there.

I wont forget them.

One of them was a taiwanese lady in her late 20s. She was resigned to die. She was having her third brain surgury in the last few years to remove cancerous tumors that keep growing . There was not going to be along term solution or hope to her. She was destined to die within the next few months or perhaps a few years. Her mom and her both told me this. It was very sad. They had a tape recorder and were playing (softly) some buddhist chants the whole time.

The other patient. This one perhaps even sadder. Because her mom and dad (who came to see her daily) were at the stage where they consider her dead already. She was not expected to come out of her coma. Although there seemed to be hope. I felt there was hope anyway.

I think she was about 19. She didnt seem completely comatose, but instead she seemed to be able to recognize things around her, at least to a small extent. She didnt seem in pain. She could sleep and turn herself over when needed. But she couldnt talk and made no noise.

When she was 16 she was on a scooter with her boyfriend at the shihlin night market.

HEr boyfriend hit a taxi head on. He broke both of his legs, but eventually 100pct recovered. The taxi driver was not hurt. But she was thrown against the windshield (no helmet) and everyone expected her to die on the operating table.

But the doctors were able to “save” her. But her parents wished that they had let her die on the table. Because they have run the gamut of emotion. And have now resigned themselves in the belief that their daughter is already in a better place. What remains is only a shell. ON the surface living, but not sure if the soul is still in the body.

I remain convinced that there is hope because she wasnt completely comatose. I didnt think she was completely gone. But what do i know.

What I do know is that if scoots had no rear seat and no passengers were ever allowed, that she wouldnt be in the state she was in. At least not from that accident.

Its not a knee jerk reaction, my reaction to this accident. Its from knowing what the situation is and knowing that:

  1. laws will not be enforced before our Lord Christ returns to Earth.
  2. Scoots will not be banned and will continue to be on the streets in great numbers.
  3. Such tragedies will continue to be, unless passengers are banned.

Iv seen with my own eyes too many tragedies involving scoots/motos in Taiwan.

Iv seen a man with his head cracked open on the road to wulai when he was bumped off his scoot.

Theres too many iv seen.

The carnage continues. Enforcement of laws is wishful thinking. Everyone winning the lotto all at once is a more real posibility.

This seems a little contradictory, tommy525. On the one hand you are arguing that laws will never be enforced in Taiwan. On the other you support the introduction of a new law to reduce scooter fatalities. If passengers were banned from scooters wouldn’t people just continue to ride with passengers and flout yet another law in Taiwan?

To my mind the posters who support enforcing the existing laws actually hold a stronger position than your suggestion of yet another new law.

Driving tests that are fit for purpose would also go a long way to reducing traffic fatalities. Indicators and mirrors are not just fashion accessories.

So true. I’m borrowing that last part to add to my signature.

We know how many laws are flaunted in Taiwan. They seem to have grasps on some laws. Such as immigration laws, laws about teaching in Taiwan, et al. But traffic laws seem to be flaunted regularly and unenforced. I didnt mean to say all laws are unenforced. I meant traffic laws.

IF scoot manufacturers were forced to produce scoot /moto seats that only seat ONE person. That would make it more difficult for two to sit.

I am against two wheel transport in Taiwan. But i can concede that banning scoots and motos is not a realistic endeavor.

Therefore I move to lessen the carnage by allowing only one per scoot/moto. NO families, no passengers.

What they should do in Taiwan is actually enforce the law and every police officer that neglects doing that should be reprimanded … a police officer is on duty 24/7 and should whenver he sees a traffic violation at least take not of the license plate number or if possible stop the vehicle and fine the driver. Police should enforce the wearing of a helmet with zero tolerance. Wearing of helmet in Sanxia is frowned on by many people (probably the betelnut or tofu brains), and lot’s of kids don’t wear a helmet, 2-3 kids on scooter without a helmet is normal here, police just passes by not even looking … oh no, fining them and having to write reports makes them miss their teatime …

[quote=“hannes”]This can happen anywhere were a criminal drives a van. Nothing to do with scooters.

I saw a clip were a couple on a scooter, mother holding a baby, was cut of by a car. Mother fell off the bike and couldn’t hold on to the baby. Baby drops on the street. I don’t think anyone was seriously injured, but I think this should be shown to parents all over the country to make them realize that you cannot protect your baby if you fall from a bike, even during a slow-speed accident were you did nothing wrong.[/quote]

You are contradicting yourself … it’s indeed about passengers on scooters, babies/kids should not be on scooters even tied up to their mother’s chest.

Anyone got any data on accident rates per 1,000 scooter miles ridden? Just curious, like. It may help put this into perspective.

Not sure what you mean. A criminal driving a van can hit a bicyclist in the same way like the one in the video. So that particular video is not about motor scooters or how many people sit on it.

I think Tommy goes a bit overboard. One person per scooter? Totally unrealistic. It’s law enforcement and, even more important, education. Teach the people about what happens when they do things the wrong way. Educate them about proper behavior on the roads for their own good. Make them understand that the laws are there for their own good and abiding by them is beneficial for the whole society. Ironically, those needing the protection most and who benefit the most from everyone respecting the law, grandpa and grandma, are often the worst offenders of them all. Drives me crazy all the time.