Let's talk about Trump

Let me see…

[quote=“Mick”]He called for a temporary ban on Muslims until “we can figure out what the hell is going on”. Obmama/Hillary on the other hand, “nothing is going on, look over there a squirrel and transgender toilets”.

Yeah, Im pretty sure Trump is right, something is going on, what could it be? [/quote]

Trump is right? About what part exactly?

Calling for a ban is a conversation?

But… Trump can decide what religion an American can choose? :doh:

You should just lead with that one next time :2cents:

Actually, that’s very Trump like. Here’s what Trump would say:

I love Mexicans, I love the Mexican people, they’re great, I love immigrants, Mexicans can’t do their job objectively because they are Mexican, America is a melting pot, everybody is welcome here, I love all the religions, Muslims can’t come to America, Muslims are beautiful people.

And then Trump would sit there and say, what don’t you get? Do I have to say it again? I said I love Mexicans, I love Muslims. What part of that don’t you understand?

And we’re like, the part where you slipped in all those other comments about how much you decidedly don’t like them. Yeah, THAT PART !

If Hillary Clinton stated in a public interview that the reason her email scandal hasn’t been thrown out is because the lead investigators parents are Arab, you would be going ballistic right now.

[quote=“BrentGolf”]

[quote=“Mick”]He called for a temporary ban on Muslims until “we can figure out what the hell is going on”. Obmama/Hillary on the other hand, “nothing is going on, look over there a squirrel and transgender toilets”.

Yeah, Im pretty sure Trump is right,
something is going on, what could it be?
[/quote]

Trump is right? About what part exactly?[/quote]

Highlighted it for you.

[quote=“BrentGolf”]

Calling for a ban is a conversation?[/quote]

Got a conversation started, just about, Obama still wont discuss it and Loretta Lynch is withholding the tapes of the recent Orlando shooting and going to edit out transcripts to leave out mention of his pledge to ISIS or whatever else she feels like. Pretty sure some people in Florida will point out they have a right to those tapes and full transcripts under FOIA.

[quote=“BrentGolf”]

But… Trump can decide what religion an American can choose? :doh: [/quote]

When has he ever said anything about what religion an American should choose? Are you making up stuff again Brent, because your position is not strong enough based on the facts and you continually need to make up facts of your own?

[quote=“BrentGolf”]

You should just lead with that one next time :2cents: [/quote]

Pretty sure I have said the same numerous times, just scanned back one page to find that quote.

[quote=“BrentGolf”]
Actually, that’s very Trump like. Here’s what Trump would say:

I love Mexicans, I love the Mexican people, they’re great, I love immigrants, Mexicans can’t do their job objectively because they are Mexican, America is a melting pot, everybody is welcome here, I love all the religions, Muslims can’t come to America, Muslims are beautiful people. [/quote]

I think you should stick to what people actually say rather than make up a bunch of shit you think they might say or try to imagine what they think and then write long posts which claim the person you are debating has completely different views from those which were explicitly stated but you either choose to ignore or were too lazy to read.

[quote=“BrentGolf”]
And then Trump would sit there and say, what don’t you get? Do I have to say it again? I said I love Mexicans, I love Muslims. What part of that don’t you understand?

And we’re like, the part where you slipped in all those other comments about how much you decidedly don’t like them. Yeah, THAT PART ![/quote]

Ok, I hope you are enjoying your imaginary Trump moment.

If Hillary Clinton stated in a public interview that the reason her email scandal hasn’t been thrown out is because the lead investigators parents are Arab, you would be going ballistic right now.[/quote]

I believe she has stated on numerous occasions that the investigation of her emails and those involved both the Inspector General and the FBI are part of a right wing conspiracy. Where was your outrage? How can she claim the Inspector general may be biased against her or those in the FBI, aren’t they all robots too?

Paul Ryan, but why do I get the feeling you know that already.[/quote]

Just wondering when was the last time a Speaker of the House called the Presidential nominee for his own party a racist.
Possibly Howell Cobb of Georgia, referring to Democratic candidate Lewis Carr of Michigan, back in 1848.

But in that case Cobb, later one of the founders of the Confederacy, would have been reassuring the folks back home that Carr, a Northerner and believer in Popular Sovereignty (states and territories determining slavery in their own borders), actually had his heart in the right place.

Well, it would be nice to see an outbreak of sanity amongst Republicans

Though it could have been William Pennington, Republican ex-Whig, who was chosen as a compromise in 1860 when the Republicans, having only a plurality, couldn’t get one of their own radical abolitionists elected over the opposition of the Democrats, Know-Nothings, and…Opposition Party.

Same reason - he would have been assuring them that Lincoln was too a racist who didn’t believe in race-mixing or civil rights, and thought the best thing to do was ship all the black people somewhere else.

Or actually, when you think about it, any Democratic Speaker after 1860 talking to the Southern wing about any Dem. Presidential candidate up until Kennedy - though by then they wouldn’t have been doing it publicly.

[quote=“Mick”]

I believe she has stated on numerous occasions that the investigation of her emails and those involved both the Inspector General and the FBI are part of a right wing conspiracy. Where was your outrage? How can she claim the Inspector general may be biased against her or those in the FBI, aren’t they all robots too?[/quote]

Quotes where she says the inspections by the FBI and Inspector-General are part of a right wing conspiracy? As opposed to her saying the claims made by Republicans - which go beyond what the IG or FBI have said- - are part of a RW conspiracy.

[quote=“MikeN”][quote=“Mick”]

I believe she has stated on numerous occasions that the investigation of her emails and those involved both the Inspector General and the FBI are part of a right wing conspiracy. Where was your outrage? How can she claim the Inspector general may be biased against her or those in the FBI, aren’t they all robots too?[/quote]

Quotes where she says the inspections by the FBI and Inspector-General are part of a right wing conspiracy? As opposed to her saying the claims made by Republicans - which go beyond what the IG or FBI have said- - are part of a RW conspiracy.[/quote]

Quick search brought up this by one of her spokesmen , not Clinton herself and you may be right she may not have personally called the IG part of a right wing conspiracy, but I do have a vague recollection, I will look more later. Here’s the clip with her spokesman @2.20

But quite a few stories claiming Clinton says and then go on to quote her spokesman, so I may be mistaken.

This was another one doing the rounds a about the same time. MSNBC: Clinton Creating Conspiracy Theories to Explain Away Her Email Scandal

[quote=“BrentGolf”]
If Hillary Clinton stated in a public interview that the reason her email scandal hasn’t been thrown out is because the lead investigators parents are Arab[/quote]

Really? Do tell. And links, please.

Some people have been questioning as to whether Trump will drop out of the campaign
These are what money given to the Trump campaign is paying for.

[quote]Okay, we’ve got, in one month:
Rent to Trump Restaurants and Trump Tower: $200K
Rent to Mar-A-Lago: $420K
Catering, Eric Trump Wine: $4K (piker!)
Tag Air (Trump’s “airline” apparently) $350K
Trump CPS, Trump Plaza: $15K
Various people at Trump’s address (725 5th ave), including Donald, listed alphabetically under Trump (there are a bunch more listed elsewhere): ~47K
Trump national and international golf clubs: $66K
Trump Virginia Acquisitiions: $1K

Total outlays: $6.7M, of which perhaps $1.1M went back into one of Trump’s pockets.
[/quote]
lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/201 … 6#comments

I would say, not any time soon.

Looks like cash is a problem

tinyurl.com/gw7scbp

[quote=“Tempo Gain”]Looks like cash is a problem

tinyurl.com/gw7scbp[/quote]
The way he’s managing his campaign - or not managing it, as it were - is fascinating and apparently unprecedented. From Slate’s Jamelle Bouie, emphasis added:

[quote]If you follow enough election coverage, you’ll notice a phrase from those inclined to read and absorb political science: “Campaigns don’t matter.” The idea is that the twists and turns of the horse race are less important than the broad “fundamentals” of an election year: unemployment, economic growth, foreign conflict, etc. What’s key is the mechanism behind the slogan. It’s not that campaigns are useless; it’s that—in general—they’re evenly matched, so they cancel each other out. When they aren’t—Obama’s ground game vs. Romney’s, for instance—they don’t.

What happens when one side has a campaign and the other doesn’t? When one side is mobilizing voters, contacting supporters, and persuading independents, and the other is sitting on its hands? Cable news has done a lot for Donald Trump, but it can’t raise money or organize volunteers. What happens when it’s September and Trump lacks the personnel or the cash to mount a credible fight against the Democratic Party?

I don’t know. No one knows, because it’s never happened before. But if the polls are any indication, what happens is something like a catastrophic defeat for Trump and the rest of the Republican Party. And of all possible outcomes in this election, that’s the most fitting. Trump built his career by talking and grifting his way into some facsimile of success, before losing it to his own arrogance and narcissism. If nothing else, a historic defeat in November will fit the pattern.[/quote]
I guess it’s possible that he mobilizes the vote through Fox or rallies or whatever, but what he’s (not) doing is totally new.

And from James Fallows at the Atlantic, via a few other sources, a chart and a bit of an article comparing June presidential spending by party in 2012 and 2016. Part of me thinks, “Great, campaign ads are dumb anyway!” But mostly it looks like piss-poor management on the part of the reds:

[quote]Doing a good job as a candidate means, among other things, being aware of the huge financial obligations of today’s politicking: How you raise money, how you carefully husband it, how you spend it when and where it is most useful and save it everywhere else.

The chart above, from Mark Murray of NBC, is one indicator of how things are going. Four years ago, an incumbent president and his well-funded challenger were in a tight advertising race in what both sides had identified as possible swing states.

This year, all the ad-spending in those swing states has been by Hillary Clinton and her allies. Trump’s forces have not put up anything. Either he doesn’t have enough money, or he hasn’t understood how and when and where to spend it, or he has no ads prepared, or something else. He has also apparently ignored the professional-politicians’ lesson of the past few cycles, which is that opposition advertising in May and June, when a nominee has emerged but before he or she has been officially chosen at the convention, can powerfully brand a candidate in a way very hard to shake once the “real” campaigning begins in the fall.

To get all the provisos out of the way: Of course skill in running a campaign is not the same as skill at being president. Of course money is the ruination of modern politics. Of course ads can be an insult to the collective intelligence. Of course [name a hundred other points]. But you can’t be a good president if you don’t get elected. And in this, the first sample of how Trump might handle the complex management challenges that go with political leadership, early results look bad for him. He said: Don’t sweat all the details, I’ll do a great job. In fact he’s doing a terrible job.[/quote]

I’m never sure if you’re serious, or trying and failing at telling jokes. :ponder:

Trump has called for a ban on Muslims entering the US. “Muslim” refers to a religion. That’s likely the closest a Presidential hopeful has ever come to publicly stating what religion Americans can choose. Oh you can come, but not if you’re a Muslim.

We’re open to ALL religions of the world and Americans can choose any religion they like (just not the one with 1/4 of the worlds population as followers)

I’m never sure if you’re serious, or trying and failing at telling jokes. :ponder:

Trump has called for a ban on [color=#FF0000]foreign[/color] Muslims entering the US. “Muslim” refers to a religion. That’s likely the closest a Presidential hopeful has ever come to publicly stating what religion [color=#FF0000]Non-[/color]Americans can choose. Oh you can come, but not if you’re a [color=#FF0000]foreign[/color] Muslim.

We’re open to ALL religions of the world and Americans can choose any religion they like [strike](just not the one with 1/4 of the worlds population as followers)[/strike] [color=#FF0000]including being muslim[/color][/quote]

Fixed that for you, like I say Im not in favor of a blanket ban on all foreign Muslims, but how hard is it to state his proposal properly?

There’s nothing in any of his proposals that target Americans, they target foreigners. Yes, Muslims in particular, foreign Muslims, not American Muslims.

I’m never sure if you’re serious, or trying and failing at telling jokes. :ponder:

Trump has called for a ban on [color=#FF0000]foreign[/color] Muslims entering the US. “Muslim” refers to a religion. That’s likely the closest a Presidential hopeful has ever come to publicly stating what religion [color=#FF0000]Non-[/color]Americans can choose. Oh you can come, but not if you’re a [color=#FF0000]foreign[/color] Muslim.

We’re open to ALL religions of the world and Americans can choose any religion they like [strike](just not the one with 1/4 of the worlds population as followers)[/strike] [color=#FF0000]including being muslim[/color][/quote]

Fixed that for you, like I say Im not in favor of a blanket ban on all foreign Muslims, but how hard is it to state his proposal properly?

There’s nothing in any of his proposals that target Americans, they target foreigners. Yes, Muslims in particular, foreign Muslims, not American Muslims.[/quote]

I stated entering the US. I said you can come. Open to all Religions of the world. Is it really that hard for you to recognize that all of those things mean foreign? In plain English, I was also talking about foreigners.

Stating that 1/4 of the worlds population shouldn’t be allowed to come to the US is choosing acceptable religions, that’s exactly what it means. You really don’t need to defend Trumps statements. You can again, just lead with the one that it’s completely unacceptable and leave it there. :2cents:

And are you sure he’s not talking about Americans? Because his statement was in fact directly related to the American born and raised in New York City. He didn’t triple down on his call for a ban on Muslims when someone slipped through the border and attacked the US. He triple down when an American born and raised in the same place as Trump did it.

If Trump wasn’t referring to Muslims in general, surely he’s smart enough to wait until an actual foreigner attacks the US, and then call for a ban on foreigner Muslims?

Is he too dumb to recognize that New York City is in America? Or is he a bigot towards Muslims in general? Which one Mick? :whistle:

Yes I am quite sure he is not talking about American Muslims he has said so himself a thousand times. My original comment was in reply to this.

His proposal (whatever you might imagine it to be) is regarding foreign Muslims, they are not American, why do I get the feeling you’re just discovering for the first time he’s not talking about Americans. If I have a bit of time I’ll look for some link for you later.

edit* Here you go, from the La Times, Im sure there are numerous clips I have seen him say it myself on a number of occasions.

[quote]After the initial public uproar, Trump quickly clarified that he did not mean to include U.S. citizens in the ban and was referring only to foreigners.[/quote] latimes.com/nation/la-na-mus … story.html

So just so we’re perfectly clear Mick. When Trump said this:

“Appreciate the congrats for being right on radical Islamic terrorism”

He was NOT referring to an American? According to Trump, American citizens are not the issue. He was referring to foreigners? Last I checked, over 90% of terrorist attacks in the US are domestic. But as far as your concerned, he’s only taking about foreign Muslims?

When Trump said this:

“I’m building a wall,” Trump said. “I’m building a wall. I’m trying to keep business out of Mexico. Mexico’s fine. … He’s of Mexican heritage, and he’s very proud of it, as I am of where I come from.”

Again, Mr. Trump was NOT referring to an American? It’s clear to you he’s talking about foreign Mexicans, not people born and raised in the US right?

Great, glad we cleared that up. I was worried for a second there that a future President was making bigoted comments about American citizens. Thankfully they were just foreigners.

Now we can talk about something else :slight_smile:

When was the last time you checked?

heritage.org/research/report … -terrorism

[quote]Between 2001 and 2009:

There were 91 homegrown terrorist attacks of all kinds against the United States, while there were 380 international terrorist attacks against the United States; [/quote]

[quote=“BrentGolf”]So just so we’re perfectly clear Mick. When Trump said this:

“Appreciate the congrats for being right on radical Islamic terrorism”

He was NOT referring to an American? According to Trump, American citizens are not the issue. He was referring to foreigners? Last I checked, over 90% of terrorist attacks in the US are domestic. But as far as your concerned, he’s only taking about foreign Muslims?[/quote]

I never said he was only talking about foreign Muslims, there you go again misrepresenting people. I said his ban was aimed at foreign Muslims, not Americans.

Please.

And there it is. See, that wasn’t so hard was it Mick. It’s not just foreigners, so in the future, don’t say it is. Don’t try so hard to find the nuance in statements that have none. He’s NOT just talking about foreigners is he? And just so we don’t have to talk about this again, the answer to that question is, No Brent, he is not :slight_smile:

About 3 minutes ago, you? Taking an average of the multitude of articles from various sources, not just the Heritage LOL, yeah 90% is a reasonable number to go on.

google.com.tw/search?q=what … e&ie=UTF-8