The ID number format change was a pointless exercise that solved/improved nothing. And it’s ridiculous that if you had the misfortune of absolutely needing to update your A(P)RC card and renew your NHI card before 2022, that you are excluded from the card renewal fee refund.
Not 100% true. An individual might have gotten the new ID number first, then later, after January 1, 2022, renewed their NHI card. In this case according to the article they would be eligible for a refund of the cost.
Not sure whether there’s a better thread for this, but I’ve been updating my bank accounts with my new-and-not-improved ARC number this week - these are the results.
CTBC, Gongguan branch
Mostly fine, in the context of banking in Taiwan. Had to wait at least 50 minutes before getting to the counter because of the number of people ahead of me (branch- and time-dependent, of course), but once there it was quite straightforward. Probably took another 25 minutes and had to sign a couple of forms, but they seemed to know what they were doing.
Standard Chartered, Guting branch
The branch was pretty much empty when I arrived so got seen immediately, but this one took the longest for the process itself - maybe an hour in total. I had to sign more sheets of paper than I remembered to count and write my signature at least 15 times - this was a problem in itself because my scrawl didn’t match what was on their screen from two years ago. The clerk helpfully used a makeup mirror to show me my previous signature and the supervisor/manager came from the back to give me a few tips (which letters of my surname I needed to write more clearly before the final flourish), so it was all a bit pointless in terms of an anti-fraud measure, but we got there in the end. I had to cancel and reapply for online banking and set all the details again, and I also received a new ATM/debit card for some reason (not the case at the other two banks). The clerk seemed to have some technical problems that required her to keep calling someone else to fix.
Mega Bank (Guting branch)
This would probably have been the fastest…if not for the bank asking me to sign a CRS self-certification form confirming that I’m tax-resident in the UK (I’m not). This took at least an additional hour to sort out on top of the ca. 30 min for the process itself, and involved at least 5 bank employees in addition to multiple phone calls.
They kept insisting I needed to write the UK in the “other tax residency” table, along with option A for why I’m not supplying a TIN (= the jurisdiction doesn’t issue TINs, something like that). I kept insisting I don’t because I’m only tax resident in Taiwan and that the table should be empty, and showed them the CRS rules to confirm this. I also kept pointing them to the text of their own form, where options A-C are only needed if the account holder has tax residency elsewhere. The five of us went back and forth like this for a while, with one of them at some point suggesting I can just write the UK in the table and append a more detailed explanation, but the thing that probably swung it was showing one of the guys this photo from @fifieldt about his Richart meeting a couple of months back, which complains about Taiwanese banks misinterpreting CRS rules:
After that they agreed to just write Taiwan and my ARC number in the table (I think it should actually have been left entirely blank and told them the same, but my patience was running thin at this point and this seemed an acceptable compromise), and I happily signed.
A bit frustrating to deal with, but the disagreement was all very civil and friendly, and there’s hopefully now at least 5 employees in that Mega Bank branch who know a bit more about the CRS rules for foreigners.
I’m not sure why I didn’t have to do this 3 years ago when I opened the account actually - I’m hoping that they didn’t just fill that out without me knowing, but I definitely didn’t sign anything about being tax-resident in the UK.
It wasn’t necessary then.
Yes it was. It was actually late 2020 when I opened the account (I rounded a bit - didn’t bother checking when I wrote before), but banks were already asking foreign customers to fill out the CRS forms at this point. I filled them out then too, just didn’t need to go through a tedious process with Mega Bank to get them to remove the UK from the table.
So far never had to declare myself as tax resident of other countries at banks, some tried (I recall Fubon, CTBC and Cathay), but I just explain myself and they didn’t continue, just put my TW tax residency.
Whilst dealing with banks here is bogged with bureaucracy, I always managed to do everything I needed to do, just need to exactly know what I need and read everything.
Yeah, that’s been the case for me up to today as well, although I’ve read of others having issues. It seems like it happened today because they wanted me to re-self-certify when updating my ARC number.
@Marco - the reason I didn’t put it in the ID number thread is because I knew so much of it would be about the CRS misinterpretation thing.
By the way those plans were suspended and now some contractors are pissed.
yeah, let’s keep the plastified pieces of paper… that’s safe instead…
The frustrations after changing the ID card just keep propping up. It’s just about bad quality, more and more problems just start to show up after time.
As above, message, contractor perhaps have the power to seek compensation for all mistake by the government, but how about all the ARC/APRC holders that suffered from all the negative impact for this ID.
Here are a few more to add to the endless list of things you will need to think about after changing your ID, I thought I had them all, but still missed a few.
Regular car inspection. Insurance companies and car inspection stations systems are not integrated. After changing the ID, the inspection did not allow the inspection with the new APRC ID. Insurance companies stopped issuing paper insurance cards so there was no evidence of the insurance on hand. After many calls between the inspection staff and the insurance company they finally confirmed the car was insured by me and allowed to proceed.
Stock dividend. The banks that issue the dividend are not notified of shareholders ARC/APRC ID changes. In general for non-residents, tax is withheld at dividend issuance. For residents (ARC/ARPC) it is not. We noticed that the number on the notice of the dividend was changed from last year and that the dividend now was withheld, The bank said, the reaosn was that they did not have the changed ID information, so probably they considered this ID a new client. Based on lack if ID information they withheld the tax at issuance. The bank informed the withheld tax could be refunded by visiting that bank to get a cheque after we provided the ID and related documents
This all shows again the total mess or lack of considering all the impacts for foreign residents in Taiwan. There is no winner in this change, only losers, the government, the institutes and companies having to deal with this and the residents. Whoever, forced this change should be (…)
@Andrew above, I had exactly the same experience in filling out the form and they insisted on the same even , by my interpretation of what the form instruction,s it was wrong.
And P…S After 9 months still did not receive a new NHI card.
@11173 There is a loophole. You don’t need to pay a fee for an card change, if you change your address. So what you can do is , at application of the new ID, use another address (whatever once) and change it back the next year or so. It is stupid but it works.
They are happy to get our tax but there is nobody there to fight for us.
I left my number for China Trust to call me back. On the app there is no way to apply for replacement cards. Lass calls me I right up say here is my ID card number coversation only in Chinese, Oh Mr CSH she asks me for my horoscope sign. I’m like wtf do the kyc using a real DOB. Please NT$200 for replacement cards.
Later on another call from different staff but this time I speak English. The lass asks for my card details but I don’t have them so I give her my ID number number. When I give it she gets all shitty saying foreigners don’t use Taiwan ID number and that number is not in the CT system. I said how dare you assume because I am a foreigner because I speak English. She says but it’s always the case. So my reply is oh so because you also speak English you too are a foreigner. She gets all snooty so I hang up the phone.
CT are full of idiots I swear.
they are.
They call me ytd since the China airlines card I applied for has 2 choices of welcome gift: 1k miles or a backpack. I wanted the backpack, but nowhere u can choose either on the application form or website. They don’t even have an email address for complaints.
So I sent them a letter saying I want that sign-up gift (in Chinese), used their free mailing slip from their application form.
They called me and kept me on the phone for 10 mins telling me an absolute hideous amount of info which I didn’t need just to confirm I wanted the bloody backpack.
Senseless institution.
Given how many Taiwanese people assume that foreigners don’t pay taxes in Taiwan, I wouldn’t even agree with that one…
I never use my ID for a car inspection…
Today went to Bank Sinopac to add an pin code the the bank account. They needed two ID card for that. Ok, so ,showed the APRC (with the new number in the front and old one on the back). NHI had still not not provided the new card after 8 months. (there is a whole thread about the NHI and reasons why and it’s not the chip shortage).
The management at the bank did not accept the NHI card as a 2nd ID card. So moved out all the money from the bank to another one. Problem solved. Bye Sinopac ! I am happy, not sure about you.
The DPP and NHI should have solved the backlog of APRC holders long by now, but they did not and I refuse to give in spend time on all the snowball effect problems caused by this
In an interview with Taiwan Business Topics, a monthly magazine published by the American Chamber of Commerce in Taipei, Minister of the Interior Hsu Kuo-yung (徐國勇) said that the measure would increase foreign residents’ sense of belonging in Taiwan and make their lives easier.
Having a residency number with the same format as a national ID card number would make online shopping, booking tickets, hospital visits and other activities easier for foreigners, Hsu said.
Mr. Hsu, your idea has given the total averse effect,it 'ts give me al least an very much alienating experience…
On line shopping, booking tickets for just concerts etc… Hospital VISITS were NEVER a problem. If you only had persuaded other solutions for NON-ESSENTIAL LIVING issues that now have causes major problems for ESSENTIAL LIVING needs. Proably here are some other drivers for you to persue this change. How many problems did it really solve ? Do you have a post mortum analysis ?
@comfy123 It is not related to using the ID card at the station itself. It’s about the discrepancy between the data in the insurance company, car registration and the record in the inspection station systems. Root cause: ARPC ID change.
This is a inaccurate statement by Minister of the Interior. Taiwanese have number 1 or 2 on second place based on gender, while foreign residents have different numbers now. Many websites will determine the ID number to be ‘invalid’ if there is not a 1 or 2.
Just by changing it from a letter to a number for foreign residents did not make anything easier.
Yes the article and many of the statements in it were idiotic.
It may have been the original intention to adhere to the Taiwan ID format but they very quickly changed it because they don’t want foreigners automatically accessing lots of Taiiwan public services.
Hence this made the whole exercise worse than useless. It should have been cancelled in the same way that the digital ID project was cancelled.
Yeah, it really feels like a rotten compromise: Pretend to change something (“make the numbers for the foreigners more similar to the Taiwanese ones!”) while actually not doing anything at all (and causing issues and lots of work for everyone involved…).
Maybe they actually started out with the idea of unifying the numbers - but then were met with some resistance and instead of stopping the project, they ended up with this mess…
Ah right. I understand now
