The only ballots contested in WI were those cast in Dane and Milwaukee counties. It was all over the news after it happened. A lot of information on how it was done in the two counties containing The Cities of Madison and Milwaukee respectively, aka the “blue” counties and also aka the only the counties with a lot of minority voters in the state. Further news brought up that if there was “widespread voter fraud”, the contest should also be “widespread”. Even the local Fox stations reported as such. They found nothing initially and the GOP was told that if they wanted to peruse it further, they’d have to pay. They didn’t want to pay and the whole thing stopped.
Betraying? He was the fucking president of the United States, a position literally established on the basis that he is NOT a king.
No, the court didn’t take up the case, and you’re quoting the majority of why they didn’t take up the issue, not news reporters angle. They also turned down the case because it was filed too late, he should have filed it before the election!
They said in the opinion that there were many minority voters, but that’s just a red herring. As you said, that’s where the two biggest population centers are and Democrats galore. Just like Fulton County is where Atlanta is.
But I seem to be wrong about Trump being heard and winning in Wisconsin. I may have got confused with a case brought by an individual challenging results that got heard and granted. Or I may have conflated Wisconsin with Pennsylvania, where Trump did get a hearing and win the case.
I think I was referring to Trump’s own men, who he appointed under the Executive Branch. Yes, there is separation of powers in a democracy and they should all be wary and checking and verifying each other all the time. But the Executive Branch is all under the President, and he gets to call all the shots. Problems is, that there does seem to be a separation of powers within the Executive, and that is the Deep State who seem to be more in control of some stuff than the President…and none of them are elected. Pence was elected under the same ticket, but with the understanding that they would be working together and not against each other. Again, there isn’t (or shouldn’t be) separation of powers under the Executive.
But the president is a position that was made a bit strong by our Founders on the basis of a robust enforcement of laws and compared often to the British Monarchy, because the earlier Confederation, the states all had too-weak executives (because they feared the Monarchy too much). They finally decided they needed to move a bit closer to a strong executive that was checked by the people and the legislature (by impeachment).
So you understand in theory how checks and balances work, until you say that the president gets to call all the shots, which is where that’s not checks and balances anymore, it’s a dictatorship, which America came VERY close to becoming, but did not, because his friends “betrayed” him by following the laws they swore an oath to uphold.
He gets to call all the shots within his Executive Branch. The Constitution gives power to one man in the Executive. Problem is that there are permanent employees working under the Executive and they begin thinking they rule the roost and to the extent they push back against the President…especially as they were doing to Trump, they’re working against the original concept of the how governent works.
The Executive Branch is not the swamp, not the Deep State…and that seems to be your point. That is very undemocratic, because the people voted for one man to be in charge of that branch, and that isn’t the swamp. The swamp wants things to go according to a philosophy they hold and they keep most presidents under their sway…until Trump came along. Trump is his own man, he has very strong intuitions and he acts on those intuitions, and this is the reason he’s wildly popular with his base. The swamp resists those intuitions and want a certain decor or procedure to be observed at all times. And men of intuition can’t be held by that. They must follow him, instead of him being on a leash to them.
I would suggest Biden is exactly the kind of president who really isn’t in charge or calling any shots. The Democrat Party is giving him the outline how to say and act. We have the most contrasting picture of presidents with these two.
Since he did a very obvious setup of Mike Flynn, people paying attention noticed that was a very obvious coordination between intelligence agencies, media outlets that he went onto at the time and Mike Pence. Those paying attention wrote him off as an establishment player there and then.
He has since then (by those paying attention) been at the center of bad staffing, leaks and other shady stuff aimed at undermining the Trump administration.
Those afflicted with Trump derangement syndrome, never noticed anything outside orange man bad. But to those paying attention, things were more nuanced than you might imagine.
You are literally saying “because he followed the laws and did what he was supposed to do, per the CONSTITUTION, he became a member of the Deep State. Is “The Deep State” code for “people who follow the established laws of the Republic?”
I am saying those who followed in real time saw what he did for what it was. Looking back in retrospect now we know his communications were monitored and unmasked by every Tom, Dick and Harry, it’s safe to say that everyone was aware of the conversation that Mike Flynn had with Russian Ambassador at the time, including everyone in the media.
Mike Flynn was targeted for removal by the Obama administration, he is the one name Obama told Trump not to use in his new administration precisely because he was an inside man to the establishment and had promised to usher in some changes in how it was doing business.
He was 100% setup and the moment Mike Pence went on the MSM to say no one in his team was talking to Russian his fate was sealed. It didn’t matter what Flynn had said, or that talking with Ambassadors was his job in the transition period, the ensuing meltdown from the media required he be fired from the Trump team, which he was.
I didn’t bring up events on an 6th as that relates to Mike Pence, all that seems overly complicated and at times Democrats have argued the very same arguments they now say Republicans are not allowed to argue. I’m not getting involved in any of that.
What does Michael Flynn being what you’re defining as “Deep State” have to do with Mike Pence following the established laws that have lead to centuries of peaceful transition of power?
You asked since when was Mike Pence a part of deep state/the establishment. I replied with his observed setup of Mike Flynn.
Anyone being intellectually honest and impartial recognized that, for 4 years after that people were documenting how Pence was trying to repeatedly hamstring the Trump administration.
But for those who were lost in complete disgust with Trump, never noticed any of that going on. You it would seem are one of those, I can link back to articles at the time and subsequent times when this was discussed in detail.
Mike Pence’s name was right under Donald Trump’s on the ballot. A vote for Trump was also a vote for Pence. Regardless of how you’re seeing his actions as being “Deep State”, he was elected into office by the Electoral College, which is how Presidents and their Vice Presidents are elected into office in America, and have been since the founding.
I will not get into the weeds about the meaning of “Deep State”. The United States has a constitution and Donald J Trump was the first president in US history who tried to pretend it didn’t exist. Pence knew Trump’s actions were illegal and he stopped him. He chose to “betray” the tyrant instead of betraying his country.
There is a process with very many steps along the way to counting or certifying the electoral vote. Most elections, it’s just a rubber stamp, but when you have controversy and dual slates, every step of the process exists to weed out fraud. Everything was set, a congressman and Senator were going to object to the Democrat slate that was sent in and by going through the process, there was supposed to be discussion in both chambers before finally having a vote by state. And as there were more Republican states than Democrats, they would have chosen the republican slate since the democrat slate was filled with unlawful voting procedures not following the strictures of the legislatures of all those 7 states, which would in effect render them illegitimate.
The Democrats understanding what was about to elapse, nipped it in the bud by letting in the protestors and pretending it was a riot.
Even without the objection phase of the counting of the votes, the Vice President is given power by the Constitution to choose at will, and that was done back in election of 1800 when Vice President Jefferson was presented with a unConstitutional faulty Georgia ballot unlike the rest of the ballots that might have been tampered. The tellers told Jefferson the fault, but he quickly counted it as it was for himself and that’s how he won the presidency.
Vice President Nixon was aware of his power to declare himself president by counting the Republican slate instead of the Democrat slate for Hawaii in 1960. The controversy had been settled that the Democrats won the state after a recount and there was unanimous consent in Congress (though 2020 wasn’t settled at all), so he went along with the Democrat slate while stating, “without the intent of establishing a precedent.” Because he knew he was given full charge of deciding, and that might be necessary in a future session, as we see with Mike Pence.
Yet so very little to say about actual adults, under oath, saying Trump was dead set on leading the mob to the Capital, to then do what? Do the right thing?
Come on, mod, keep the stupid shit in the funny threads. Be best.
No one there to represent the other side, she can say what she likes. Who knows what the truth is and where parody starts, the stenographers in the media are reporting it all uncritically as if it were all true.
