What do people mean Taiwan is more China than China

Speltcheck. Spellchuck. :laughing:

Sorry, it’s not gluten free. :cactus:

I know. My point was that it makes a better analogy for typical traditional ==> simplified changes than colour ==> color would. I don’t actually look forward to that kind of simplifide Ingglish.

I admit I only skimmed this post, but I had to give it a :heart: for the Changing Dynamics part! :smile:

I partly concur, but re superstition, I think that’s a ymmv thing.

What you’ve written looks very interesting and 8 plan on reading the whole thing later.

But the latest DNA studies show that 80% of self-identified ethnic Chinese are Southern Han, 5% Northern Han, and 14.5% similar to Southern Han and distinct from Austronesian.

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If you only look at Y-chromosome and only view lineages through a patriarchal lens, then yes.

Like I said, most of Taiwan were matriarchal societies. These early immigrants actually first taiwanified, before social economical pressure eventually forced them to sinicize.

In this previous post, we discussed how most early Austronesian matrilineal societies were fairly opened to taking men from other tribes and cultures in as their husbands, including the Taiwanese Pingpu Aborigines. Austronesian groups that made it past the Wallace Line had no issue taking in non-Austronesian men, despite Austronesians being the dominant culture, to the point where it is difficult to find Austronesian Y-chromosome past the Wallace Line.

As a Han dominant social structure started to form around the 1700s, that probably accelerated the trend, as having a Han family member came with social economical benefits, until eventually they had to give up their cultures, names and languages all together just to avoid discrimination.

Also, since the Qing starting in the late 1800s and the Japanese both enforced a patrilineal society, it became extremely easy for Han Chinese who married into the Pingpu family to takeover control of how land and wealth were distributed.

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The study looked at both Y-chromosome and mitochondrial DNA, so it includes both sides.

SNPs on the X and Y chromosomes, as well as those on mitochondrial DNA, were also included for data release.

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Is there anything similar to ancestry.com or 23 and me? None of them sends to Taiwan. I mean I have no way of knowing if any of my dads story is real.

I think modern genetic evidence is more reliable then guessing who procreated with whom.

It really looks like you’re basing your opinion on historic guesses to try to prove a desired outcome. I’m embarrassed about some of the people I’m related to as well, but I’m not going to do genetic backflips to prove I’m something I’m not. Being Chinese has never been about being Han anyway. There have long been a number of sinified minority groups, so rather than discrediting yourself with politicized science by claiming decent from what China calls one of it’s 56 ethnic minorities, you (and your NPP friends) might be better served demonstrating how Taiwanese identity is distinguished from that of China besides freedom and democracy.
I have always personally found it distasteful that indigenous Taiwanese, the people worst off in Taiwan, are used as showpieces for a Taiwanese distinctiveness.

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Aboriginals would call your appellation one of the 56 Chinese minority groups to be distasteful, even offensive.

This is their land.

As would Taiwanese, and all China’s other minorities that are not recognized. They probably wouldn’t like more that they are all lumped into one minority. I only use it to make the point that claiming some genetic connection is not a convincing measure of Taiwanese distinctiveness.

At present, this is the DPP’s land, and the aborigines are a showpiece. I think it doesn’t matter in who’s hand the land is in, the people who currently identify as indigenous would probably like things to be going a little better for them.

Where’s @Icon when we need her to remind us of the existence of the local deep state? :idunno:

Btw it’s officially 55 minorities – the 56 figure includes Han.

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Que? Como? Cuando? Donde?

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Good luck with that under CCP.

What we should look at is the mitochondrial DNA I guess to see how many of the locals are descended from Pinpu? Any studies on that?

But it depends on how different mito DNA was between the east coast of China and Taiwan maybe five hundred years ago. Because as mentioned already the ‘han’ are also a mix of many ethnic groups.

i’ve seen a chinese person from guanzhou’s dna test results include taiwanese aboriginal. so yea i see your point.

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I’m watching Monkeys vs Guardians and Monkeys just hit a three run HR off Woodall.

In celebration, 陳俊秀 two others in the Monkeys’ dugout were lined up in a row, all three sharing a single bat on their left shoulders, bobbing up and down. Wonder if that’s some sort of aboriginal dance with some bamboo stick. I didn’t get a screenshot in time.

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You can do the basic one if you’re just interested in ancestry info. NT5890

Man they’re way more expensive than ancestry.com